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Schematic for Eurorack busboards?
 
 
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Author Schematic for Eurorack busboards?
jonkull
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 3:01 pm    Post subject: Schematic for Eurorack busboards? Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

I'm thinking about making some bus boards and want to know if anyone has a schematic/parts list. I want to pick the parts up at lunch time but I'm at work and can't open my case up to see what's in them and how they're wired.
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consumed
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 3:53 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

i intend to do that as well. the only problem is that i cant find vero board (strip board) here in the states anymore! you basically dont need those leds or anything in the busboard, just need strips that run horizontally behind the busboard. i suppose you could solder wire across all the points on the back of some protoboard but that would be a PITA.
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jonkull
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:29 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

So I'm basically looking at something like this then:

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wetterberg
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:55 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

if I understand correctly, no, they don't look like that - it's one continuous trace all the way down. As simple as it comes, and if you get the proper strip board you basically only need to solder the connectors on there and that's it.
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consumed
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 5:59 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

right. the extra column on the power headers is superfluous. make sure you have horizontal continuity on every row.
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jonkull
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

wetterberg wrote:
if I understand correctly, no, they don't look like that - it's one continuous trace all the way down. As simple as it comes, and if you get the proper strip board you basically only need to solder the connectors on there and that's it.


So it's connected between the pins? Like this?

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fonik
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:30 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

why not just using a stripboard? it is nothing but a buss actually...
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fonik
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:32 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

BTW i once thought i needed an etched bus board, so here it is:
http://modular.fonik.de/pdf/bus.pdf

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jonkull
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:41 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

fonik wrote:
why not just using a stripboard? it is nothing but a buss actually...


Yeah, that's what I'm going to do.
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consumed
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 6:47 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

fonik wrote:
why not just using a stripboard? it is nothing but a buss actually...


i cant find stripboard anywhere in the states. =(

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wetterberg
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 7:36 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

consumed wrote:
fonik wrote:
why not just using a stripboard? it is nothing but a buss actually...


i cant find stripboard anywhere in the states. =(
wow... you're... actually right!?!? Mouser; nothing. :-(

For the europe crowd Reichelt even has 50cmx10cm strips, which are lovely:
http://www.reichelt.de/?;ACTION=3;LA=2;GROUPID=3373;ARTICLE=8281;SID=2 62BWf7qwQARoAAH8wqQga53d59f7bb0e01a46e34090916d0e3d7
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NV
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:07 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

For those of you searching for vero/strip board in the US, take it from me and abandon hope; strip board (as well as pad-per-hole board) are slim pickings in the US without paying a ludicrous price.

Reichelt has affordable vero board but unfortunately also has ridiculous shipping policies ensconced in archaic procedure. My recommendation is to purchase vero board through JayCar. Here's a link: http://www.jaycar.com.au/productResults.asp?CATID=&SUBCATID=&keywords= veroboard&part=&SPECIAL=&form=KEYWORD&ProdCodeOnly=&Keyword1=&Keyword2 =&pageNumber=&priceMin=&priceMax= There are smaller sizes available, but I recommend purchasing the 95mm x 303mm boards and cutting them in half lengthwise with an exacto knife - easy solution for two bus board strips that can comfortably hold about 12 module connection headers with no awkward cable spans and room to spare for solid chassis mounting and PSU connections. SPBaker also posted a thread discussing some of the options and methods here: http://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=1406 , although I would recommend a star grounding/distribution method rather than daisy chaining.

JayCar has a minimum order for overseas shipping but it's only $25 AUD I believe, which can be easily covered by purchasing a couple vero boards and the headers to solder into them. For about $30 USD and a touch of DIY you can build the rough equivalent of 4 Doepfer busboards using this method.
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spbaker
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PostPosted: Mon Feb 02, 2009 9:35 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

NV wrote:
although I would recommend a star grounding/distribution method rather than daisy chaining.



seconded! i still have a bit of crosstalk due to a couple of daisychains but one day i'll redo the whole thing and have the grounds for every module seperately connected to the PS, as it seems that is the only solution to eliminate crosstalk completely.... one day confused

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BugBrand
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

www.futurlec.com is good & cheap for stripboard (though orders take a little while to arrive -- just use the standard shipping rate)

(though, strangely, their website isn't working for me right now???)

I'd often recommend putting V+ and V- LEDs in just for testings sake - it takes 30seconds and can really help with troubleshooting!

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fonik
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:16 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

the mouser part #:
854-ST3U
854-ST6U
but be warned. expensive!

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fonik
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 7:25 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

spbaker wrote:
NV wrote:
although I would recommend a star grounding/distribution method rather than daisy chaining.



seconded! i still have a bit of crosstalk due to a couple of daisychains but one day i'll redo the whole thing and have the grounds for every module seperately connected to the PS, as it seems that is the only solution to eliminate crosstalk completely.... one day confused

never had any issues. just try to keep the distances on the bus as short as possible. connect the PSU not to one end of the bus, but in the middle.

IMHO using a bussboard is no real daisy chaining, just because you actually not chaining the modules. these are branches from the bussboard tree. real daisy chaining would be to conenct only one board to the buss, and then connecting the next module to the first module instead of the buss!? in any casy you need a distribution board, don't you? or do we want to connect all modules to the PSUs terminals directly?

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brandon daniel
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PostPosted: Tue Feb 03, 2009 5:04 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

jonkull wrote:
wetterberg wrote:
if I understand correctly, no, they don't look like that - it's one continuous trace all the way down. As simple as it comes, and if you get the proper strip board you basically only need to solder the connectors on there and that's it.


So it's connected between the pins? Like this?



Yup, that's it exactly. Though if I'm making one I tend to build in a 5v regulator to give my boards active 5v lines, but it really is this simple.

For the record, I ran into the lack of veroboard in the US, too, found a few on ebay shipped from the UK.
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NV
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 6:50 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

fonik wrote:

never had any issues. just try to keep the distances on the bus as short as possible. connect the PSU not to one end of the bus, but in the middle.

IMHO using a bussboard is no real daisy chaining, just because you actually not chaining the modules. these are branches from the bussboard tree. real daisy chaining would be to conenct only one board to the buss, and then connecting the next module to the first module instead of the buss!? in any casy you need a distribution board, don't you? or do we want to connect all modules to the PSUs terminals directly?


If you're connecting the power into the center of an evenly spaced busboard rather than the outside edges then you've basically oriented a simple star distribution system. The only difference would be that instead of chaining the power from the first busboard to the second via a header and ribbon cable, you would just connect each busboard directly to the PSU or a terminal block. A "true" star distribution system would be an enormous hassle, but by simply running the power to the center of each busboard and running power from the PSU/terminal to each busboard individually, you'll have built a distribution system which would certainly be close enough to the ideal for modular use.

The way I see it, if you have a working system that relies upon chaining boards and have no noticeable problems, then there's clearly no need to change anything. However, if you're building a system from scratch it only takes a few minutes more to build a star distribution system so why not go for it.
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fonik
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 9:45 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

NV wrote:
If you're connecting the power into the center of an evenly spaced busboard rather than the outside edges then you've basically oriented a simple star distribution system. The only difference would be that instead of chaining the power from the first busboard to the second via a header and ribbon cable, you would just connect each busboard directly to the PSU or a terminal block. A "true" star distribution system would be an enormous hassle, but by simply running the power to the center of each busboard and running power from the PSU/terminal to each busboard individually, you'll have built a distribution system which would certainly be close enough to the ideal for modular use.

exactly my thinking.

and actually all my modules provide filter caps and beads on the power I/Os. this might help to isolate the modules.

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wetterberg
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 11:13 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

So for building a pseudo-star-distributed system it would be rather difficult to connect each dist. board directly to the PSU terminals - would the approach be to do a tightly clustered "distribution board for the distribution boards" ?
NV wrote:
fonik wrote:

never had any issues. just try to keep the distances on the bus as short as possible. connect the PSU not to one end of the bus, but in the middle.

IMHO using a bussboard is no real daisy chaining, just because you actually not chaining the modules. these are branches from the bussboard tree. real daisy chaining would be to conenct only one board to the buss, and then connecting the next module to the first module instead of the buss!? in any casy you need a distribution board, don't you? or do we want to connect all modules to the PSUs terminals directly?


If you're connecting the power into the center of an evenly spaced busboard rather than the outside edges then you've basically oriented a simple star distribution system. The only difference would be that instead of chaining the power from the first busboard to the second via a header and ribbon cable, you would just connect each busboard directly to the PSU or a terminal block. A "true" star distribution system would be an enormous hassle, but by simply running the power to the center of each busboard and running power from the PSU/terminal to each busboard individually, you'll have built a distribution system which would certainly be close enough to the ideal for modular use.

The way I see it, if you have a working system that relies upon chaining boards and have no noticeable problems, then there's clearly no need to change anything. However, if you're building a system from scratch it only takes a few minutes more to build a star distribution system so why not go for it.
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mark_olson
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:00 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

How about

http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/ECS-4/SOLDERABLE-PERF- BOARD-LINE-PATTERN/-/1.html

?

Mark
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consumed
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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:05 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

mark_olson wrote:
How about

http://www.allelectronics.com/make-a-store/item/ECS-4/SOLDERABLE-PERF- BOARD-LINE-PATTERN/-/1.html

?

Mark


mark--thanks!

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PostPosted: Wed Feb 04, 2009 3:14 pm    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

consumed wrote:

mark--thanks!


My pleasure.

It would sure beat snaking and soldering a wire along the connector leads on a piece of pad-per-hole like I'm doing on the buss board I'm making.

Mark
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NV
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 5:46 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

wetterberg wrote:
So for building a pseudo-star-distributed system it would be rather difficult to connect each dist. board directly to the PSU terminals - would the approach be to do a tightly clustered "distribution board for the distribution boards" ?


Essentially yes - if you are having trouble wiring a number of bus boards to your PSU, the most simple solution would be to use a terminal block/barrier strip. This page of the mouser catalog has a list of them: http://www.mouser.com/catalog/637/1508.pdf

Basically you would just wire each of the terminals of your power supply to a dedicated terminal block, and in turn wire the appropriate voltage path of each of your bus boards to the appropriate block (+12V to +12V block, etc). Connect each of the terminals of the block to distribute the voltage by simply wiring them to one another or by using jumpers such as these: http://www.mouser.com/Search/ProductDetail.aspx?R=601985-2virtualkey57 110000virtualkey571-601985-2
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Funky40
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PostPosted: Thu Feb 05, 2009 9:11 am    Post subject: Reply with quote Add User to Ignore List

NV wrote:
A "true" star distribution system would be an enormous hassle, ........

Synthesizers.com has a power harness in two different sizes.
I use those for my +-15V distribution ( it's in my euro system too )
http://www.synthesizers.com/q101.html#qdh
seems to me the easiest way to get a star distribution




Quote:
......, but by simply running the power to the center of each busboard and running power from the PSU/terminal to each busboard individually, you'll have built a distribution system which would certainly be close enough to the ideal for modular use.

thats what i have for my +-12V eurobus distribution.
I have a little busboard, from there i feed the 4 ( resp. 8 )eurobus-powerboards. ( btw. made with the 50cmx10cm stripboard from Reichelt )
I don't found it good enough. My +-12V VCO had lots of problems.
I had to put it into a own 19" frame with own PSU and no modulator in the same Rack
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