Muff's Modules & More

Lyonel · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:29 am Post subject:

Well, that's for the moment how i see the beast...
The boats will be always in the studio.
"Midi Cabinet" will be at right (that's perhaps important to know it, concerning Boats interconnection).
So, there will be one boat dedicate to Midi (polyphony/computer control),
with most inter Audio modules spaghettis (Osc. mixing, FM (261e/291e with 210e or 291e for control levels) and VCAs).
On this boat, i think that presets would be very useful and effective.
I would like to see the other boat more like a performer, a real-time player and improviser.
At first i had put the two 250e in the same boat... but i don't know...
About the 260e, it seems that it's not a vital component, but i would like to have at least one of each Don's actual creations. smile

Qu'en pensez vous messieurs et mesdames (if there is any !) ?
Thanks

astroschnautzer · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:36 am Post subject:

One thing I have always wondered is why does buchla modules have both minijacks and bananajack holes on some modules, have I missed something crucial? Pretty awesome system btw!

BananaPlug · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:41 am Post subject:

2012 · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:43 am Post subject:

Lyonel · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:45 am Post subject:

astroschnautzer · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:46 am Post subject:

2012 · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:51 am Post subject:

the best is always shielded in any case,buchla did always use both but with the 200e and its ad/da conversion its getting more importand now i guess not to mix.

sadly its by mixing both signal u get interesting sounds on any modular system

luckly they did use Hexagons

Lyonel · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 7:59 am Post subject:

2012 · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 8:02 am Post subject:

u always could build a custom banana to minijack panel

BananaPlug · Posted: Mon May 25, 2009 11:02 am Post subject:

Re. the Buchla FAQ, separate signal and control, etc.

As always, the designer is trading off one thing for another. Assuming they maximize the benefits stated in the FAQ does the combination outweigh the advantages of everything to everything patching? There's no objective way to compare those.

There's room for debate. For instance, "Signal wires must be shielded." It's the signal to noise ratio that matters and in an everything to everything system the signal level is quite high so it's pretty near impossible to pick up a meaningful amount of noise with a few feet of patch cord.

In a way I'm glad Buchla decided to optimize for each kind of signal because somebody should be trying that out.

daves · Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 12:08 pm Post subject:

cbm · Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 12:56 pm Post subject:

Before I became a Buchla user (and as an ex-Serge user), I also thought that the separation of signal and control was a bad thing, at least in theory. After using the Buchla almost exclusively for a few years, I have come to the conclusion that it's actually pretty great. My main reason is that I change the audio routing of a patch much less than I change the control routing in a patch. The fact that the audio is on a different type of connector, using grey cables with colored ends, means that when tracing control sources & destinations the grey audio cables become pretty much invisible. They more-or-less get ignored at a level below conscious thought. I'm not making this up, honest.

There is a banana jack in addition to the mini jacks on the output of the modulation oscillator of a 261e or 259e. A simple banana <-> mini cable pretty much takes care of most other needs. The fact that there are FM inputs where you need them, and modulation outputs where you need them, go a long way to addressing any real-world concerns, in practice. When I first got my Buchla, I made a few banana <-> mini cables. I only know where one of these is, and only because I use it to more easily connect an audio signal to my scope. I can't remember a recent case where I was inconvenienced by the difference in jack types.

The ease of being able connect the Buchla to external equipment because audio signals are at line level is also a big plus, IMO.

BananaPlug · Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 1:21 pm Post subject:

carbon111 · Posted: Tue May 26, 2009 1:34 pm Post subject:

If Buchla would soften the signal segregation a bit, I'd be adding Buchla modules to my Serge right now. love

I don't really buy the reasons for segregation stated on the website (can't argue with #6 though...) d'oh!

kkonkkrete · Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 2:33 am Post subject:

I've got some Serge but no Buchla yet. I can see the merits to both approaches. Verbos makes a good point on his blog about the sensitivity of pots associated with inputs that are designed to handle both CV and audio frequency ranges: there are times when barely touching a knob on a Serge can send it into a completely different state because the range is so wide. Forcing a stricter separation between CV and audio helps to mitigate this problem.

On the other hand, with a Serge it can be very inspiring to patch things up with one function in mind ("this and this signal are acting as control sources") and then tweak a little and end up with something fundamentally different. It also increases the functional density because a given module can do different things in different ranges. For example, if you used the 256e for processing audio signals, it could make an interesting wave-folder / distortion. Has anyone tried this?

citizen mori · Posted: Wed May 27, 2009 3:58 pm Post subject:

something to consider is the unbiased leveraging of processors and analog couriered within the e-series modules. there are dramatically different considerations when architecting and articulating machine code which will work with audio than there are when working with cv.

Lyonel · Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 6:13 am Post subject:

I have really wavered between the two systems, and Serge's side was very tempting because of this obscure (for me !) alchemy between CV and Audio,
and therefore, the ampleness of each control (NTO : 0.1Hz to greater than 100 000Hz);
Waouu, you know... composing one minute of music and people will say :
- but John Cage has already composed this shitty little piece of silence !
And you will answer proudly :
- you don't understand ! it's an opus dedicated to Batman's friends,
don't you hear this intricate bongos poly-rythm at 30200 Hz and this beautiful swirl at 53000 Hz smokin'

I am joking but certainly not mocking, because for me it's still appealing, adventurous and creative (but sadly not above 14000 Hz in my case !).

200e's signal pass clarity instantaneously jump out for me, instant (more or less !) comprehension of which modulate what.
Snappy and beautiful illuminated visualization of gates, LFO's speed, waveforms, panning and levels...
Pristine line level at every degree of the audio pass :
-and if insert my Orville between 261e and 291e or perhaps a Culture Vulture or a Sherman before 292e...

My wish : integrate one's best the Modular in studio's workflow;
Adventurously for atonal and/or offbeat experimentations,
but also as a good slave to computer for additions to boring one chord songs hmmm.....

With those different purposes in mind, it seems that for an entirely inexperienced person like me, Buchla 200e wins !
Well... i think i will be caught short, but surely i would like to place an order for a three or four panels Serge very frustrating

2012 · Posted: Thu May 28, 2009 6:39 am Post subject:

i whas thinking of a 'best of serge' in a 200 panel format

anyhow the day i got a 200e i made for sure such a panel

Lyonel · Posted: Mon Jun 01, 2009 11:59 pm Post subject:

I have updated configuration on page two,
Four 261e at this time ; it'll let me add different future Oscillator flavors, other third party modules or new Don Buchla realizations grin

Cheers

chrisso · Posted: Tue Jun 02, 2009 12:07 am Post subject:

I was a Serge user for quite a while, then I bought a Buchla CBS Music System (hybrid 100/200 module system).
I love the separation between audio and control voltage.
1) I found interesting sounds quickly and without using audio, and 2) I found it directed me into synthesis areas I hadn't really explored with my Serge system.
I don't find it a compromise at all. And in a system as heavily featured and expensive as a Buchla 200 or 200e, I'm surprised people are talking about compromises designed into the system.