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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Disting reality check - the jacks are very bad!
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Expert Sleepers  
Author Disting reality check - the jacks are very bad!
srsonido
The jacks on this module suck! Period. Pretty? Yes. But pretty precarious in actual use.

Sorry to start yet another Disting thread but with all the gushing and forum topics with words like "Awesome" in the subject line, I think it's fair to have another perspective rise in the searches.

I got the Disting module recently and have started getting to know it. The functionality is remarkable! You can do a lot in a small space with software and I agree with most of the positive opinions in that regard. It can offer a lot of utilities in a small space.

But... I've used the module in just a few patches now and I have knocked the cables in the Disting jacks loose twice - loose enough to change the function or disconnect it all together - simply by making patches or moving other cables in the vicinity of the cables going to the Disting.

If you consider loose jacks a desirable source of uncertainty, you may like the jacks on this module, they certainly can add some unexpected sounds. But if you like to have solid, reliable patch connections in performance, beware, this module may disappoint you.

Like many, given all it's functions I was considering that one Disting might not be enough. After actually using the module however, I think I'm going to hold off purchasing any more until / unless ES can fix the jacks. One of these in the setup might be manageable as a utility module, but having these unreliable connections distributed in critical points all over my setup would be a nightmare in performance.
os
I'm all for negative feedback, but I'm not sure you needed to post the same thing twice.

Link to other thread: https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1609432#1609432

If you happen to have the chance to compare your unit against another, and find that your jacks are unusually loose, we can get that fixed. But I do personally test each unit and nothing goes out unless I believe the jacks are satisfactory.
srsonido
os wrote:
I'm all for negative feedback, but I'm not sure you needed to post the same thing twice.

Link to other thread: https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?p=1609432#1609432


Thanks Os, I understand your point and apologies to all for the clutter of a double post.

The reason I did so is twofold:

First, my observation was that there was already a thread with "Amazing" in the topic line. I felt that was a bit leading and if I were researching this module I would be less likely to see a contrary opinion buried in a thread so named, than I would be to see it in a separate subject line. I stated this in my original post.

Second, while I'm not new to synthesis or precision audio equipment for that matter, I am rather new to this forum and when I was creating this topic I was not aware that the system (or moderator) would triage my post into a separate category. That's my ignorance at work, mea culpa. After creating this thread, however, I realized that it had instantly been moved to the ES category and not the Eurorack category, the later, as you observed, tends to get broader attention. So, ironically, for reasons similar to your motivation for starting starting that other thread in the Eurorack category...

os wrote:

...I'm posting here by way of a news bulletin so all Euro users are likely to see it.


I moved my attention to that category, and posted there, where it might get broader discourse. This was really just clumsiness on my part, so again, apologies for that.

Regarding your suggestion to compare the jacks on my module to those of others, that's a good call and I did so with one other module before posting here. The jacks on that module feel just like mine. I realize that's only an n of 2, I may have access to a second one later this week so I will at least have a n of 3.

Thanks for your response here. I'm going to try and move further conversation about this back to the other thread which you created.
os
Cool, no worries!
Parametex
In similar vein as ES is most likely using same components in other products in the future...

The jacks on my ES-3mkIII are also unacceptable loose. Its "ok" for the studio I suppose but just barely.

Sourcing different components in the future would be a wise move for otherwise absolutely brilliant product line.
exper
I hate to add to this, but I just received my Disting. When I read this thread before, I thought, how bad can it be...

But just moving cables around in a patch causes jacks to pop out from the Disting.

OS, is there anything that can be done to fix this? It's pretty cool so far in and of itself, and the lit jacks are genius. But, you know... This is kinda crazy.
os
I'm promised that the next batch of jacks from the factory will have a higher retention force. I can't say when those will start finding their way into distings though.
exper
That's good to hear, but for now, I'm not sure what I want to do. I'm thinking of returning it and waiting until a batch is available with the improved jacks. Hope Control Voltage has an OK return policy!
Nuuj
Is there no way to manually tighten these?
Analog>Plugins
Or solder some wires to it on the inside and then use a multi module (really cheap) and wire it to those. Obviously disconnect the multi's jacks from each other.
adh82
I noticed how loose there are too do I compared the jacks to my es-3 mk1 and other doepfer jacks and noticed it's the metal contacts that are to blame not the jack design. It seems to me that the metal is thinner and less rigid than other modules the they don't lock in/push down on the cable as hard as other jacks do, I'm pretty sure that if you replaced the metal, mainly the top pice that moves and in in contact with the tip of the cable it would improve them 10 fold! What do you think OS?
Analog>Plugins
I think I will buy some better mono jack plugs and just change them over on my Disting. It's not a big job and shit happens....should only cost about £6.
Claudyknight
I'm considering swapping out the metal part now! Is what do you think? Will this tighten up the jacks?
monads
So...there's plenty of comments on this, but my reason for bumping this particular thread on the subject matter is can or have any users fixed???
ilya.n
I noticed that too (with esx8cv) - jacks are bit loose.

Is it possible to replace the jacks DIY?
chapelier fou
Same thing on my ES-3. i might change them by myself as i don't think it's acceptable in a live situation.
ilya.n
<DELETED>
monads
I was gonna pick up a Disting mk2, but this issue just deferred it waah

Maybe mk3 will get right!
cupwise
think i'll hold off also
Funky40
srsonido wrote:
The jacks on this module suck! Period. Pretty? Yes. But pretty precarious in actual use.

same opinion here in regards to the FH-1.
in my case my FH-1 is in a siderack so the pulling force comes somewhat from the side.
....and i don´t have to jam there with knobs.
so i think i can live with that. nevertheless, its totally unnice.
.....has the market to be like this that one has to totally avoid buying anything new ?
seems so to me.
...thats what i heavily have to force me to do with allready many many manufacturers.


some more constructive feedback:
the earthenvar cables feel less loose than the doepfer cables.
the dopefer cables are quasi on the edge to be unusable with my FH-1.
the earthenvar are on the edge to be somehow acceptable.

have to hold off to buy anything more from ES till this issue is solved. sorry


edit:
OS, otherwise was your appearance in the forum here, especially on the FH-1 thread VERY confidence drawing !
you are doing a great job ! ......to bad with the jacks
Upright
Someone told me there are new mark 2 distings available, does anyone know if this is true? I've heard about the jacks and this has been one of the reasons I didn't buy disting initially.
exper
Upright wrote:
Someone told me there are new mark 2 distings available, does anyone know if this is true? I've heard about the jacks and this has been one of the reasons I didn't buy disting initially.


There are mk2 distings, but the jacks are the same. Only internal memory has been increased to allow for longer delay times.
os
mk2s are coming back in stock in the next week or so.

You know, I like to think it's a measure of my integrity that I don't moderate the f*** out of this thread razz
os
exper wrote:
There are mk2 distings, but the jacks are the same.

The jacks are gradually being improved, every batch I get from the factory, so don't assume any given revision of the disting has the same jacks on it as others of the same revision.
exper
os wrote:
exper wrote:
There are mk2 distings, but the jacks are the same.

The jacks are gradually being improved, every batch I get from the factory, so don't assume any given revision of the disting has the same jacks on it as others of the same revision.


Good to know! I'd like to get a disting again eventually, it's just the one I had literally would let cables slide right out. Fantastically useful module though.
Upright
I'll keep my eye out for the MKII.
bisquick
i just received a disting mk2 from control in NY and the jacks exhibit the same issue that was posted about originally in this thread. i guess i need to contact control about it... eek!

@os - is there anything that is currently being done about this that would allow me to return this item and get another one that has new jacks?

is the issue actually addressed in a new batch that'd gone out recently?
my purchase date was 9/20/15, so i'm assuming that they had the current stock in as of that date. maybe not? is there a HW revision to speak of that i can check against?

help
snufkin
one thing that might help is sourcing some jacks that are slightly bigger than normal, these should stay in the jack sockets better.

Cliff does a whole range of non standard mini-jacks that are only fractionally bigger than normal
os
@bisquick The most recent batch has the date code 20150821 on it.
bisquick
@os:

OK, I can confirm that the jacks still easily pop out with this revision.
I read here that the problem was being assessed and that you were attempting a resolution in the manufacturing process. It doesn't seem to be resolved as of this batch.

Would you be able to link to some documentation or specs on the jacks (maybe they're standard?) that the user can use to replace the jacks with their own? I'm happy to cripple the functionality of the LED displays in favor of stable connections. It's a great module.

thanks,
b
os
The jacks are mechanically compatible with the standard Cliff parts used by Doepfer, Analogue Systems and others.
bisquick
OK, great! Thank you.
deaddogsinhalf
This is such a shame to hear, I'm clicks away from ordering one here in Australia but have spent the last couple of days fixing/re-calibrating modules that maybe i'll wait on this one.
binray
The white sockets on the ESX-8GT mk2 seem pretty loose too, significantly looser than the black ones on the ESX-8CV. It does depend what kind of jack I use, but the Doepfer ones are pretty loose. They haven't actually fallen out yet though to be fair.
frokka
The best sockets I've come across are the ones EMW are using, the jacks really click into place and stay there.
Not sure what brand it is though.
bisquick
@frokka - better than intellijel? they look similar...
frokka
bisquick wrote:
@frokka - better than intellijel? they look similar...


I have a Shapeshifter and the sockets look similar but feel different. Not much though.
I think the Shapeshifter uses the same as my Tides from MI.
morphlex
I just got the MK3 2 weeks ago and feel the same about how patch cables don't snap in and doesn't hold the patch cable well at the tip. I'm also experiencing clicks when using the Z knob but I'll bring that up in another post since it's not related. I hope I can get mine to stop clicking though.
coresect
Disting Mk 3 owner here. Never noticed a problem with the sockets. Just had a fiddle to see if I was missing something. Nope. Not a problem. I must be really lucky. Only module I have problems with is an Analogue Systems RS-100 which I frequently have to juggle cables to make any kind of contact.
Xtheunknown
I am considering a Disting mk 3. Any additional experiences with the jacks on recent batches?
MrTurboparrot
Xtheunknown wrote:
I am considering a Disting mk 3. Any additional experiences with the jacks on recent batches?


everything solid and fine on my mk3
resynthesize
MrTurboparrot wrote:


everything solid and fine on my mk3


Same, no issues whatsoever on mine, jacks feel fine.
Shledge
Mine are a little loose, similar to my older doepfer modules. Not really an issue though as I think they can be tightened in the same way.
bonzai
Mine came in last Saturday: the jacks in my model (production date mid june '17) are extremely loose, it just takes a pinky to pull cables out, there is just enough grip to stop them from falling out on their own, so almost none at all. cry
This is really a shame, it's such a great little module otherwise, but this issue really looks like a show stopper to me. ATM I'm seriously thinking of returning it, for sure the jacks will get even worse with time.


Edit: It's sad, but I returned it now. I hope that the next batch is ok again, I'd really love to keep it - with working jacks, that is...
aleale62
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/images/smiles/icon_doh.gif
just received a new one: very very loose
very frustrating
phutureboy
+1
sad to see a 3 years old problem still unsolved...
shiny saw
I have a Disting mk4, and besides being amazed by its functionality, I also got really disappointed by the very loose jack sockets. I get glitches and interruptions when eventually touch the cables plug in there.
I also was considering an ES-8, but as much I'm attracted by its features, I'm not sure if those loose connections can be trusted in a live situation.

I'm reading this now and can't believe that this problem didn't get fixed after 4 versions!! And, anyway, it looks like it's not about the Disting, but the jack sockets themselves, which are used in all ES modules (I guess) as their users are reporting this issue too. The LED feedback is an amazing feature, I was totally amused by that. But the metal contacts holding the jack inside are truly flimsy.

os wrote:
I'm promised that the next batch of jacks from the factory will have a higher retention force. I can't say when those will start finding their way into distings though.


os wrote:
exper wrote:
There are mk2 distings, but the jacks are the same.

The jacks are gradually being improved, every batch I get from the factory, so don't assume any given revision of the disting has the same jacks on it as others of the same revision.


With all my respect, @os, you said that 3 years before my Disting was purchased. People at the beginning of this thread were putting their hope in mk2. Mine is mk4 and bought in june. I'm wondering how long it gotta take for these jacks to reach full improvement.

I would appreciate any suggestion or solution (different to swapping the jacks by myself)
megamarkd
I've just received a Disting Mk4 and the sockets are really loose. I was hoping there might be a particular brand of cable that has slightly fatter jacks that will tighten up the connection?
bedhed3000
megamarkd wrote:
I've just received a Disting Mk4 and the sockets are really loose. I was hoping there might be a particular brand of cable that has slightly fatter jacks that will tighten up the connection?


I'm curious if using right-angle cables, like those Tendril cables that just came out, might help with this. I have a Ladik output module that I found has similarly loose connections at the jacks. It is only a problem if I accidentally bump the cables while turning knobs or patching other nearby modules, so I just bought some right-angle 3.5mm cables to use on this module specifically. They lay flat and out of the way of my stupid hands. Problem solved.

For reference, here is the thread about Tendrils: https://muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=203120
megamarkd
Cheers for the heads-up, they do look handy. Useful for getting at knobs when the spaghetti is thick too. I'll give them a try.

bedhed3000 wrote:
megamarkd wrote:
I've just received a Disting Mk4 and the sockets are really loose. I was hoping there might be a particular brand of cable that has slightly fatter jacks that will tighten up the connection?


I'm curious if using right-angle cables, like those Tendril cables that just came out, might help with this. I have a Ladik output module that I found has similarly loose connections at the jacks. It is only a problem if I accidentally bump the cables while turning knobs or patching other nearby modules, so I just bought some right-angle 3.5mm cables to use on this module specifically. They lay flat and out of the way of my stupid hands. Problem solved.

For reference, here is the thread about Tendrils: https://muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=203120
toneburst
I've been experiencing the same loose-jacks issue with my Disting Mk4, too, I'm sorry to say.

a|x
base615
Sadly, as I love the functionality, I’ve had to stop using my two distings as the jacks are unbelievably loose, even just for studio use.

The slightest touch will cause my Stackcables to fall out of them. I’ve also bought several other types of cable just to see if it will work. It’s a bit better horizontal with the aid of gravity to keep them in, but my case is now vertical.

Right now I use them instead of 4HP blank panels so I’d love to know if someone has found a wider cable which fits snugly so I could use them.

Hard to imagine that ES hasn’t fixed this since first reported in 2014. Every other module seems to be fine so it’s not like there’s a shortage of correctly sized jacks.

That said, there are no other jacks I’ve seen with LEDs in them. Maybe ES need to design the Mk5 to have normal jacks and LEDs outside.
lisa
I have two MK4 Distings and no such issues. They are not as tight as some jacks but the cables do not fall out. If they where I’d be sending them back and request new ones. Not an option?
Shledge
Think the problem is also down to the tolerances of cables, especially in the width and profile of the tips - I've noticed some of mine are really tight in some modules, while others are noticeably looser. Some of these won't fully go in on modules with tighter jacks!

The jacks on my distings are definitely a tiny bit loose, but I never had an issue with them in terms of cables falling out or connection issues. They're similar to my older doepfer modules.
toneburst
Shledge wrote:
The jacks on my distings are definitely a tiny bit loose


They are for me, too, and the same seems to be true (unsurprisingly) for my other Expert Sleepers modules (unsurprisingly, as they all use the same parts).

Shledge wrote:
...but I never had an issue with them in terms of cables falling out or connection issues


I have had issues with the jacks wobbling from brushing cables while reaching for controls on other modules. This has happened while using the Disting's (excellent) record-to-SD algorithm, which is annoying, as this caused dropouts in the recording.

Shledge wrote:
They're similar to my older doepfer modules.


This is not a coincidence, as Doepfer use the same Cliff sockets (but in black, rather than translucent plastic) for many of their modules, I beleive.
mbthey
Just now seeing this thread.

I too experience very poor quality jacks on a new ES-8 that I have just purchased.

Seeing how this has been a known issue for YEARS with no apparent resolution from the manufacturer, I think I will just return the product for a refund.

$450+ is too much to pay for such poor quality hardware.
elisha_gray
I noticed complaints about the plastic jacks on Expert Sleepers modules before I bought my Disting Mk4 and General CV. I checked my modules with several different brands of patch cables, and they are fine.

Clearly, plastic jacks need less force to remove a plug, and the plug wobbles more, compared with metal jacks. I haven't seen any accidental removals or intermittent connections though.

Why the different experiences? I wonder if plastic jacks have more jack-to-jack variability than metal jacks.

I like the feedback from the LED in each jack.
mbthey
I've inspected the jack sockets closely with a lighted magnifier- the problem isn't so much the translucent housing of the socket, but rather the quality of the metal tabs that wrap around and apply sprung downforce on the inserted jack. The indented portion of these tabs are very small and as such make very little contact with the inserted jack itself. The tabs are also very very thin, and have lateral "wiggle room" which may even be out of spec?

The jack sockets also do not appear to be proper CLIFF jacks, but rather some knock-off version? They are marked with an "A" underneath as opposed to the "CLIFF UK" that the authentic sockets have. So who knows what the long term reliability of these are going to be? Don't want to take that chance with a $475 module.

On several of my ES-8 ports, the cable end can be pulled out with no resistance or click whatsoever. Like it was literally just an empty hole. But on those same ports, inserting the cable can have a harsh initial resistance (which varies depending on the angle of insertion), followed by a couple "crunches" that are both felt and heard due to both the lateral movement of the jacks retainer clips/bands and ringed detent of the patch cable end.

It really can give a first impression that the socket is broken when first inserting the cables, and it varies between the many ports. Some worse than others, but all bad IMO.

I purchased the "Bitwig Edition" of the ES-8. Which should be no different hardware-wise than the regular version ES-8 from everything that I have read.
Shledge
Cable tolerance matters more. I have 2 disting mk3s and a disting mk4 - granted they're not the tightest, but I never had any issue with them. Cables stay in and there's not that much wiggle room.

Saying it's "poor quality" is just hyperbole.
os
There was a manufacturing problem with a small number of the jack sockets recently. Ironically, these were actually made by Cliff; most of the sockets I use are from another manufacturer.

I thought we'd caught the bad ones but it's possible some slipped through. If you can post close-up photos of the sockets, looking at the back (furthest from the panel), it should be possible to tell whether you have such sockets.

Just to be clear this applies only to a very small number of modules manufactured at the end of 2018. In general, the sockets are as-intended. They are not "knock-offs". They are just not (all) made by Cliff. Cliff doesn't have a monopoly on plastic jack sockets.
mbthey
Shledge: No hyperbole at all, the jacks on this ES-8 I just bought are indeed poor quality. They crack and crunch with varying resistance when plugging in cables and they are come out with very little effort. Very easy for a hanging cord to pop out if it is nudged. How long before a solder joint cracks under such strain?

But since you don't actually have my module in your hand to test, you don't really have anything to judge other than your own experience with your particular modules right?

Seems I am not alone with this issue, and apparently it has been a known issue for years.

I was really looking forward to utilizing this ES-8, but sorry I am not going to drop $475 on something that has these issues.
mbthey
OS: Here's a photo of one of the jacks on my ES-8, let me know if is a proper enough view of it?

[/img]
os
I think I can see that the jack on the left of the photo has a 'curly' contact (looks a bit like a ski jump) closest to the panel. I believe that's supposed to be furthest from the panel i.e. it would grip the tip of the plug. Is that right? Is this one of the problem sockets? Do the other sockets have the contacts the other way around?
mbthey
I think there is another aspect to this which is amplifying the effect of these jacks-

Pictured is a patch cable purchased from Make Noise, manufactured for them by Ad Infinitum. There are three points which have a "sharp" transition (marked).

I cannot tell without taking apart the jack, but I think perhaps the embossed "nub" of the jack's retainer clip, which has a triangular cross section, has too sharp of an edge(?) which causes the sharper "crunching" (and even a small amount of getting hung up on) upon cable insertion that I am experiencing. When the tabs catch these sharper transitions on the cable end, they get pushed laterally against the plastic "stops" before giving way and going up and over the plug end. This also contributes to the additional sounds and feeling when plugging in the cable.

Also note the small angle of transition at the tip. Very easy for the small (and weaker) retainer clips on the jack to easily slip right by when the cable is coming out.

All my patch cable plug ends from different manufacturers look like the photo below btw.


mbthey
Here's a top view of the jack, both retaining clips are identical to each other. All visible jacks look like this-

os
Here's a photo that shows what I mean. You can see the tip contact is very slightly raised.

Tip contact raised => Cliff jack, good
Shield contact raised => Cliff jack, bad
Neither contact raised => not Cliff jack, good

mbthey
I can see no difference between the front and back tension clips on my ES-8. The dimples look to me to be the same shape and size/depth and each clip is flat -no upturned edge like the clip end on the left of your photo.
os
OK, it seems you're not affected by the specific issue I mentioned then.

Without physically examining it myself it's hard to make further comment on your particular unit.
mbthey
Well, I've already started an RMA with the dealer where I purchased it. So perhaps it will end up back in your hands eventually anyway.
mbthey
UPDATE:

My ES-8 unit was received by Perfect Circuit and they informed me that their techs confirmed my issue with the jacks. They are providing full refund and waiving their restocking fee.
Rex Coil 7
Comment in this thread made on July 8th, 2014:
os wrote:
... I do personally test each unit and nothing goes out unless I believe the jacks are satisfactory.


Comment in this thread made on July 23rd, 2014:
os wrote:
I'm promised that the next batch of jacks from the factory will have a higher retention force. I can't say when those will start finding their way into distings though.
If they are meeting your level of satisfaction, as you stated on July 8th 2014 ... then why suddenly a need for higher retention force?

Comment in this thread made on August 22nd, 2015:
os wrote:
exper wrote:
There are mk2 distings, but the jacks are the same.

The jacks are gradually being improved, every batch I get from the factory, so don't assume any given revision of the disting has the same jacks on it as others of the same revision.
Why are they "gradually being improved" instead of simply just fixed?!! Your first comment I quoted here was made over an entire year prior, when you said "all is well, nothing leaves without meeting my satisfaction". This is all sounding like corporate bull pucky that some slick PR rep says at the podium.

Comment in this thread made September 29th, 2015:
os wrote:
The jacks are mechanically compatible with the standard Cliff parts used by Doepfer, Analogue Systems and others.
And yet, complaints continue to come in over the next four years. Probably the single most common complaint about the entire Disting series.


Comment in this thread made January 23rd, 2019:
os wrote:
There was a manufacturing problem with a small number of the jack sockets recently. Ironically, these were actually made by Cliff; most of the sockets I use are from another manufacturer.

I thought we'd caught the bad ones but it's possible some slipped through. If you can post close-up photos of the sockets, looking at the back (furthest from the panel), it should be possible to tell whether you have such sockets.

Just to be clear this applies only to a very small number of modules manufactured at the end of 2018. In general, the sockets are as-intended. They are not "knock-offs". They are just not (all) made by Cliff. Cliff doesn't have a monopoly on plastic jack sockets.


Excuse after excuse after excuse ... year after year ... version after version. I find the credibility of a manufacturer not being able to get the jacks "right" after run upon run, going on for over five years questionable (I speak of ES here, but my comment could also apply to ES's supplier as well). And from the numerous comments I've read in numerous other threads the problem extends beyond just the Disting series.

People don't like being treated with disrespect. Especially when they're wanting to willingly throw their hard earned money at a manufacturer that seems to have the same excuse over five years, perhaps longer. I'm convinced the next time a few people complain about the jacks again there will be another echo ... "the manufacturer did it, and it will be better next run".

Last year I suggested that the Disting be made with non-lighted jacks with small LEDs near each jack. I was essentially told "it's not going to happen". I have to wonder how many people would respect the decision to go with a simple redesign that excludes the use of lighted jacks more than respecting the reluctance to do so and continuing to come up with "the manufacturer did it, it will be better" excuse ... again?

I, for one, would respect Andrew a hell of a lot more if he would just admit defeat and go with the use of less troublesome jacks ... rather than the stubborn years-long push to continue with the customer service nightmare involving the use of "those bloody loose jacks!" ... a choice he's been faced with defending for far too long.

I actually have a need for a number of Expert Sleepers items, but I'll be damned if I'm going to relinquish handfuls of hundred dollar bills on a product with substandard components ... especially since the fix is so easily arrived at. Just dump the fancy jacks, admit it was a neat idea that didn't have the support it needed from a manufacturing standpoint, and improve the product line already!

I'll be one of the first in line to hand you my money for several items in your catalogue.

nodnod
Shledge
I can confirm the disting mk4 I recently bought has tighter jacks, but the idea of "satisfactory" seems to differ from person to person.
REVIVER
I got another Disting MK4 a few months ago and the jacks are noticeably improved. No complaints at all.
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