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Better circuit choices for Silent Way AC Encoder
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Expert Sleepers Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7  Next [all]
Author Better circuit choices for Silent Way AC Encoder
Mans
Are these circuits useful when using a DC capable soundcard like the motu's? I have an ultralite coming my way and think I can expect about 4V from its outputs? Will the voltage doubler circuit boost this to 8V?
os
Yes, you can use the voltage doubler with DC-coupled interfaces too.
Automageddon
Big question, how do I check the voltage output?
(Noob question I know).
I have a digital multimeter available.
os
Plug a cable into the output.

Hold the multimeter probes in contact with the tip and sleeve of the plug at the other end of the cable.

Read voltage off multimeter.
Automageddon
I get a miserable 1.2 with a 1uF capacitor, using the half-way rectifier cables on a m-audio fast track ultra.
I'll now try to find an electronic shop in the area and hopefully get hold of smaller values.
Then I'll try the voltage doubler circuit.

I know I'll give up in the end and get the ES-1 module, but I'm loving the learning process.
PrimateSynthesis
This might be a bit off-thread, but I just read the Expert Sleepers page, and I'm curious what VCA's have to do with the CV input, how could a CV input work with an input that is AC coupled? hmmm.....
os
PrimateSynthesis wrote:
This might be a bit off-thread, but I just read the Expert Sleepers page, and I'm curious what VCA's have to do with the CV input, how could a CV input work with an input that is AC coupled? hmmm.....


PrimateSynthesis
Thanks, now I see what you mean. Although I think it would be easier to have it written somewhere...
billmeirelles
Sablerock wrote:
Thanks for the response OZ. I'll do a capacitor swap once I get my gruuby finger on some lower value caps. As to the question of this affecting pitch: Apparently with the Monotron (per other users), the Gate voltage is tied to the pitch, so as long as the gate value stays constant there isn't any issue. I don't know why Korg did this, maybe as some sort of 'tuning' abitlity. As a workaround I did the following:

1) calibrated the Korg with the gate voltage in ACEncoder at max (1.000), ditto for VoiceController Gate output voltage.
2) after calibrating (I get about 5 octaves), I adjust the Gate output voltage down to the lowest thereshold the Monotron recognizes (approx 1.5 V). Since the voltage drop in the Gate on key-release causes the signal to ramp down from cap discharge, it falls below the threshold, in effect eliminating the symptoms.
4) Because I had to adjust the Gate (affecting pitch on the monotron), I either transpose the midi notes to tune, or use the VoiceControllers Detune to get it perfectly in tune.

I know this is only a temporary workaround, but until I get the Cap Discharge to a much smaller time constant, it is what I'm doing...

I'm probably looking at going down to a .1uf cap. I hear people talk about the smaller values having side effects when it comes to range. Will I lose Octaves going too low in Cap value?

Erik


This is exactly what I have done on my monotron mod, with a 0.1uf cap the problems with the gate are gone, I still get 5 octaves with a voltage doubler for pitch, using a 1uf cap for pitch is a bad choice too, it will give the signal a sort of gliding effect, I'm using 0.1uf caps for everything, works fine with the monotron.
frijitz
os wrote:
In case anyone wanted to try the new options, but wasn't sure how to translate the circuits above into cable wiring, here are some diagrams:

Half-wave rectifier:



Voltage doubler:


For clarification, if you wanted the half-wave rectification to use the full swing of the balanced output you would leave the TRS shield disconnected and connect the TRS ring to the output shield, as in the lower diagram?

grin

Ian
os
The ring-to-shield connection in the lower diagram is probably not a good idea (I realise now). In fact the half-wave rectifer used to show the ring-to-shield connection, and I changed it.
frijitz
os wrote:
The ring-to-shield connection in the lower diagram is probably not a good idea (I realise now). In fact the half-wave rectifer used to show the ring-to-shield connection, and I changed it.

seriously, i just don't get it
So then the output voltages are?
Sorry, I'm totally confused with all the variations.

grin

Ian
os
What are you trying to connect to what? If you let us know that, maybe we can advise the best solution.
frijitz
os wrote:
What are you trying to connect to what? If you let us know that, maybe we can advise the best solution.

Right now I'm trying to figure out how your schematics work, in preparation for updating my interface. I'll just have to figure it out myself. After all, it's not exactly rocket science!

grin

Ian
Tronketz
Is it possible to make a voltage increasing circuit with just TS to TS or do I need TRS to TS?
os
You can use an unbalanced (TS) connection.
Tronketz
Which circuit do you suggest for TS to TS?
os
The original voltage doubler above will work:

just connect the sleeve on the left where the ring is shown connected (which arguably is the correct circuit for a TRS plug, too).
knob_alchemist
Very Interesting...I want to try this solution...When I well understand with this circuit is not possibile to have a negative voltage or? But what range can I achieve? 0-5 V?
os
No, you won't get negative voltages from this. The range you can achieve is entirely dependent on what you're feeding into it.
mirarimusic
so how does this go for banana??
sad banana
mirarimusic
Man Im lost .. ive attempted .. but im honestly so lost .. there are so many capacitor types, variations, values, etc...

is there a parts list...?

i went to radia shack and attempted to make this on a breadboard...but im lost.

Dead Banana
os
mirarimusic wrote:
so how does this go for banana??
sad banana

You'd need to run a ground connection from the synth to the connections that would otherwise go to the cable shield.

Quote:
is there a parts list...?

A 1uF electrolytic capacitor and a 1N4148 diode is a good starting point.
mirarimusic
os wrote:
The original voltage doubler above will work:

just connect the sleeve on the left where the ring is shown connected (which arguably is the correct circuit for a TRS plug, too).


ok so ive done this cable.. but i have no voltage change and my output.

I do get a peak voltage and then it slowly drops out to almost nothing...

here is my cable below .. is it correct? .. it seems simple..

red wire here is tip... and the black cable on the right goes to the buchla ground.

but what am i doing wrong?


mirarimusic
by the way.. i wanted to be clear in what im using...

i am using Ableton>Silent way or Volta> MOTU Ultralite > Buchla 281e.

.. and ive just tried the half wave rectifier and i get less output than originaly
(3.6v as opposed to 4.06v)

here is a pic of that one.


i know i MUST be doing something wrong i just dont know what.
seriously, i just don't get it very frustrating
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