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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Software is the way ahead
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Music Software Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next [all]
Author Software is the way ahead
supersuper
I have had a 15 year journey in the world of synths and now more than ever i feel i am really happy with soft synths as my primary sound sources now.

I progressively got rid of all my hardware synths apart from my modular over the last 5 years. I have a modular still; a cwejman one but now even the softube one seems more exciting to me in some ways; made me realise that what i like about the modular is the purposeful sound design aspect rather than any form of analogue tone.

Not saying that i will sell my modular but i am just recognising the joy and productivity of working inside the box.

So why discuss it here? I am just curious if anyone else has drawn similar conclusions? It certainly is not a well published view; in fact generally i only see proponents of the converse.
101010oxo
I really do like a lot of software.

Reaktor and the u-he stuff sounds great to me and the Madrona Labs and Soniccharge (just to name a few) plugins are also very deep and creative.

But (you knew that a 'but' was coming, didn't you?) I keep coming back to the (hardware) modular and only use the computer as a recording and multi-FX device. Why? It is simply so much more fun to play (with) the modular. Is it productive? Not very. But it makes me happy thumbs up
SB-SIX
Software is much easier to recall and edit afterwards, and indeed the quality of the sound has become very good. But it just doesnt spark my creativity anymore. Too many choices/possibilities, lots of fiddling with mapping knobs to controllers, automation. I think i've lived too long in the software realm, started to feel more like work than play.
With hardware and especially eurorack, i feel i get really creative. Even on my holiday i was taking notes of patch ideas i had. I record jams, random stuff, single sounds, and the good parts turn into songs in my daw. Maybe adding some soft fx or a sample afterwards. This has been the most fun and most productive for me. And although the sound of softsynths have been really good, the productions with hatdware only sound more alive. I think it does add up in the end.
rod_zero
Whatever allows you to express your art as you imagine and feel it is thhe way forward.

Lately I am really liking having a ITB set up and a small HW one, each one has its place and time.[/b]
Worwell
SB-SIX wrote:
Software is much easier to recall and edit afterwards, and indeed the quality of the sound has become very good. But it just doesnt spark my creativity anymore. Too many choices/possibilities, lots of fiddling with mapping knobs to controllers, automation. I think i've lived too long in the software realm, started to feel more like work than play.
With hardware and especially eurorack, i feel i get really creative. Even on my holiday i was taking notes of patch ideas i had. I record jams, random stuff, single sounds, and the good parts turn into songs in my daw. Maybe adding some soft fx or a sample afterwards. This has been the most fun and most productive for me. And although the sound of softsynths have been really good, the productions with hatdware only sound more alive. I think it does add up in the end.


+1 Music on the computer felt more and more like file management.
Norma
I tried the hardware route for a brief while...turned back quickly. I never felt more unproductive and uninspired than while I was trying to set up a hardware rig. I still have a few selected pieces that im keeping, but 9 outta 10 times I turn to my beloved software. Its just so fast and easy to open up Renoise, Fl studio or Ableton, and start writing actual music. When I wanted to make a hardware rig, I often forund myself browsing obsessively after the next piece of gear to blow a shit load of money on. Some things are easier with software some with hw. Im personally very glad and relieved that I made the decision not to go hw. Saved my wallet and hours upon hours of browsing wasting valuable time to make music. Nowadays hw offers just as may possibilities as sw. I guess it all comes down to a matter of personal preference.
waveglider
As technology advances we find ourselves staring at screens more frequently during a normal day, the last thing I want to do is look at a screen to make music.
Norma
waveglider wrote:
As technology advances we find ourselves staring at screens more frequently during a normal day, the last thing I want to do is look at a screen to make music.


Well, I also play guitar and drums which allows me to make music away from the comp. When it comes to synthesis the screen is exactly where I wanna look thumbs up
mt3
No reason why the appeal of hardware and software must be binary and mutually exclusive.

Plus isn't the softtube stuff limited by the number of modules you can run before your CPU glitchfukcrackles the sound?
mwvm
the advantages with software imo lie in daws - in that you cans ave vstis and everything is there how is was 3 month ago.

like many people have siad...hardware is much more about the experience and fun...especially eurorack... i actually do all my sequencing in reaktor>es3 so in that regard best of both worlds
ersatzplanet
For me the divide comes in with the type of sound I want to make. When it comes to abstract experimental sounds or background ambient beds, I turn to the modular. When it comes to tonal sequences, bass lines, and melody it is either software or MIDI synth boxes. The hardware of the modular is just too much work for me to make tonal music with - too much time tuning and such just takes me away from the idea I had in my head. The experimental nature of modular, the ease with trying out ideas, and playing sounds that may require multiple non-traditional controllers is just easier for me on a modular. Even though I have modular software like Audulus and Oscillator, the experimental part is much easier on the hardware modular for me. I currently have a pair of Nord modulars (a G1 and a G2) and they are a happy medium that really lies in-between the software and the hardware. Although mapping MIDI controllers to knobs on software synths has never been easier, and more interesting MIDI controllers are appearing every day, the Nord is a great combo of controller/softsynth and is the best for me right now.

I have to admit that the number of sample player type modules are growing in my modular. I often spend a long time making a great sound on all of my rig to then record, burn to media, and then use as a monster wavetable VCO later playing back from the sample player module and processing with the now freed up modules in the rig. That is sort of a hybrid approach that works well too. I have recently made a few players that do 14-track polyphony at stereo CD quality audio (based around the $50 WaveTrigger PCB) and am moving the tonal parts off the computer and onto the modular now. Sort of a Ableton in a module approach. The goal is no computers at the gig.
CF3
supersuper wrote:
It certainly is not a well published view; in fact generally i only see proponents of the converse.


I don't know about that. I'd say the vast majority of people out there are using software. Hardware gets a lot of attention for being sexy, but software still rules nowadays by a wide margin. You wouldn't know it from hanging out around here, but this is a small niche within a small niche.

For me software definitely has it's place. Mostly on the recording, arranging and mixing side of things. If worst came to worse I could live with an all software set up + a CONTROLLER (like PUSH). I personally find the experience of using plugin synths boring and tedious. Thats not to say they sound bad. But I don't see the point of using emulations of analog synths when the real thing is attainable and sounds better. This goes double for pro audio and mastering gear (budget permitting of course). Now stuff like granular apps I think are way better ITB (currently anyways). I was unimpressed with Mutable Clouds (to say the least) compared to something like The Mangle or Granulator (we'll see what happens with that ER-301). I'm also really blown away by some of the wavetable plugs like Serum. The software modular...not so much. Although it is fun and useful for working out ideas.

Thats the great thing about the current era.... Choices.

Quote:
No reason why the appeal of hardware and software must be binary and mutually exclusive.
TRUTH BE TOLD
secretkillerofnames
I definitely think finding the right combination of hard and software is the goal. For developing tracks i'm much more prolific and inspired with a finite set of hardware to control.
For mixing and production effects though I can't imagine not taking advantage of the galaxy of great plugins.
I'm also a Nord Modular user and use a System-1m, V-Synth and a couple of Aira modules. With the Push 2 I've found a perfect link between them and the software world and I find myself investing more time (and $$$) on effect processors than synths in the box.
That said I use Madrona Labs stuff, Air Loom and Serum because I don't find those kinda sounds so accessible in hardware. Reaktor 6 Blocks is also a great toolbox.
Can't say i'm that impressed by Softube Modular. It's OK but just not really the kind of sound I want in software.
dkcg
I use my modular like a plugin for the studio. Same with my hardware effects and other hardware synths. Just HW plugins to end up in a track in Live or Logic w/o loading the CPU.

Push2 is pretty sweet tho, I find myself not needing the screen or mouse very often, which is great. Logic, I mouse my way through.
stk
I've been using a mixture of both for twenty years, it's all good. Have made a truckload of music.

"The way forward" is always whatever gets you to where you want to be.

Cheers Guinness ftw!
kwaidan
I teach English at the college level, and some of my students are into music and production. They typically use Reason, FL, and Protools. None of them seem to be interested in hardware, and I suspect it is because of the cost, and until recently, the availability of affordable, modern synths. Outside of the usual Roland 80s suspects, I don't think they realize that there are still good buys on some 90s onward equipment.

Anyway, I began with software but moved to hardware because it felt strange to use my mouse to twirl little animated knobs. After NI dumped Kore, I realized that you are at the mercy of the software developers, and there is no guarantee of longterm support. Plus, there is the cost of updates, and the price of software fluctuates more dramatically.

Unlike hardware, there is virtually no resale market for software.

As of today, I use Ableton to record and sequence. Every now and then, I update Komplete.
Mashmore
applause SlayerBadger! Enjoy the show! Enjoy the show! Enjoy the show! Enjoy the show! Enjoy the show!
phase ghost
mt3 wrote:
No reason why the appeal of hardware and software must be binary and mutually exclusive.


This is the right answer. Both worlds can work in harmony without a lot of fuss.
dkcg
kwaidan wrote:

Unlike hardware, there is virtually no resale market for software.


This is something I assume with every plugin and DAW I've bought. I assume a complete loss (pun intended), but do like when they do major upgrades and improvements (like the soundtoys 5 upgrade from 4), something hardware has a high chance of making you buy it again. More hardware upgrades (through hardware or firmware) would be cool, but then there's the wait while it's in the shop.

But at least hardware you're almost guaranteed some kind of return if you sell, maybe 75-100% for analog equipment. I would think 25-50% max on software resales, if you're even allowed to.
supersuper
Ok some interesting points raised.

On Hardware software mixed setup. The more i use software the more i learn to overcome the nuisance of programming with a mouse in favour of the benefits of software; the less i desire to deal with the nuisance of integrating hardware into the music. I probably will keep some hardware but that would be for jamming out only unless i could not replicate a certain sound in the box which hasn't really happened yet.

On Software resale value. Yes some software cannot be resold other software can at around 50% of value. Also software DAWS and compendiums tend to carry a $200 upgrade cost every 2-2.5 years; I stayed on Ableton 8 for this very reason that i can keep running everything i got smoothly. On the flip side you by new hardware it does tend to loose more value the total cost of a soft synth within the first few weeks. Vintage gear can be hit or miss and will require costly maintenance at some point or just completely die on you.

On the computer screen time thing. I always laugh at this one cause often the people who use the excuse are people who spend a lot of off work time chatting on forums like these and using social media etc. End of the day the computer offers a new level of depth to programming and parameter control that has made new genres possible. For example, clarifying that i am no fan of the genre, but a big part of the sound is the way in which parameters of vsts such as massive can be sequenced in a DAW that is just incredibly difficult or impossible in traditional hardware sequencers.

To CF3 thank you for pointing out that there is likely a large community of younger people who have grown up out of the hardware space and are unrepresented on MUFFs or Gearslutz or the like.

To Secretkillerofnames; Its synths like loom and serum which offer new ways to access concepts presented perviously in hardware but which were highly inaccessible to program (think k5000,fizmo, etc...) that made me have to really engage with a computer setup. My favourite hardware synth of all time would have to be xtk but at this stage i would have to take Navi over it because ultimately there is greater clarity in programming making it easier to study patches i like and produce my own variations.
CF3
So basically what you're saying is that you're leaving and going over to KVR? hihi
supersuper
Actually i discovered that site recently but it does not seem well laid out.

Also i find i need to discuss software less online because i can demo anything i like and form my own opinion. Whereas with hardware i cannot always try before i buy due to distance to retailers so i am forced to take others impressions.
Joe.
The way ahead?

But i want to go back seriously, i just don't get it
DJMaytag
kwaidan wrote:
Unlike hardware, there is virtually no resale market for software.

It depends on the product, but for the most part, you can assume that software depreciates as much and as quickly (if not more!) as a new car does. You can't expect to spend $200 on a piece of software and be able to resell it for $150-175 like I see happening on used modular hardware. Why spend that much with a third party when you can get it new direct from the developer for just a little bit more?

Massive holiday sales also disrupt the market value too. Can a $200 plugin be had for $75 during Black Friday? Don't expect to be able to sell it for more than $75 then, especially as the end of November approaches.

That said, I've acquired a shit ton of second hand licenses for next to nothing, and built a solid array of tools to use (almost to the point of not seeing much more in the software world that I really "need.")
subbasshead
"the best camera is the one you have with you"

=

whatever works for you, works for you
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