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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Damn. DFAM.
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> General Gear Goto page 1, 2, 3 ... 15, 16, 17  Next [all]
Author Damn. DFAM.
GNSDG
Played one of these the other night and it was just fantastic. Thinking about whether I could roll something as immediate and great sounding in 84HP. Anyone already done this? Apologies if it’s been covered on the forum—search isn’t working for me.
anselmi
I love this thing...too bad it seems that Moog is not going to release it...and owner don´t want to sell them either.

I´d love to get one
DougD
The Moog guy at the NYC modular thing last weekend said that they weren't releasing it because they were worried the target market would be "confused" that it wasn't a full drum machine. However, they might use the concepts / circuits in future products.

seriously, i just don't get it
PISS.EXE
Apparently they showed how to build them at moogfest but where's that info?! If they aren't gonna sell them let us build them Dead Banana
anselmi
DougD wrote:
The Moog guy at the NYC modular thing last weekend said that they weren't releasing it because they were worried the target market would be "confused" that it wasn't a full drum machine. However, they might use the concepts / circuits in future products.

seriously, i just don't get it


yep, I was confused a bit at the first sight...expected analog kick, snare, hi-hat and the like...I even was a little disappointed when I realized it was just a monosynth with a simple sequencer BUT a couple demos after that showed me how great this thing is!
jvt
I say just drop the word "drum" from the name and any confusion risk should evaporate. Then put the thing on market!
JakoGreyshire
I wonder if someone could just get the schematics from Moog engineers and we all could design our own PCBs?

I would like to have another one….I can only imagine what two of them together would do!!

zombie

Check out my youtube page for some DFAM goodies….

Sorry for rubbing salt on the wound.. waah

I'm on your side. thumbs up
PISS.EXE
JakoGreyshire wrote:
I wonder if someone could just get the schematics from Moog engineers and we all could design our own PCBs?

I would like to have another one….I can only imagine what two of them together would do!!

zombie

Check out my youtube page for some DFAM goodies….

Sorry for rubbing salt on the wound.. waah

I'm on your side. thumbs up


I'd be eternally grateful if you wouldn't mind posting a few PCB shots applause
JakoGreyshire
PISS.EXE wrote:
JakoGreyshire wrote:
I wonder if someone could just get the schematics from Moog engineers and we all could design our own PCBs?

I would like to have another one….I can only imagine what two of them together would do!!

zombie

Check out my youtube page for some DFAM goodies….

Sorry for rubbing salt on the wound.. waah

I'm on your side. thumbs up


I'd be eternally grateful if you wouldn't mind posting a few PCB shots applause


The PCB has a lot of SMT on it…. When we built it, the PCB SMTs were already baked into place.. We just populated the switches Pots and Jacks then placed washers, light pipes, and screwed to whole thing together…

I'm not sure you'd be able to decipher anything from the pictures….

I do have a friend that is real smart electronic wise…It is possible to reverse engineer it…I think… That would take a lot of time though…. If I knew how to reverse engineer it, I would for sure…

We might be able to get schematics…I want to try to do that….

I'll think about Pictures….Not sure if I want to take the time for that though…

We were supposed to get a written manual for the DFAM but, it still has not been completed…
sad banana
PISS.EXE
The few lucky owners sharing pics of the board is all we can really hope for, unless your friend really wants to undertake reverse engineering it! The SMT stuff should be possible to figure out what it is from a picture. SlayerBadger!
NoLegs
I think maybe a better approach would be understanding how it works not so much the individual components. I think if you break it down into oscillators, filters and modulation options (both normalled and via the patchbay) it would be easy to recreate. I’d be surprised if you couldn’t get most of the way there with a mother-32 and a few additional modules.

With that said I wish they’d just sell the damn thing. There is clearly interest.
JakoGreyshire
yeah the DFAM is 60 hp… I could definitely recreate it with 60 HP of modules…It would take a bit of thought and careful module choosing…But I think it's totally doable…

That would be a cool video.."DFAM work around- what you need and how to patch"… I need a larger system to get it done..I'm still slowly building up to a studio system….

In the interim…What do you all think of noise engineering's BIA as a substitute? I would like to try one out…

J.
NoLegs
JakoGreyshire wrote:
yeah the DFAM is 60 hp… I could definitely recreate it with 60 HP of modules…It would take a bit of thought and careful module choosing…But I think it's totally doable…

That would be a cool video.."DFAM work around- what you need and how to patch"… I need a larger system to get it done..I'm still slowly building up to a studio system….

In the interim…What do you all think of noise engineering's BIA as a substitute? I would like to try one out…

J.


I wasn't able to go to Moogfest this year like I was planning, so I spent that ticket money on starting a percussion based rack. I didn't build towards DFAM functionality (because I didn't know what it was at that point, and still haven't seen anything that fully lays out how it functions). I did pick up a BIA. It's great! Especially with a lot of modulation sources. However, I don't think it's necessarily a way to recreate the DFAM - I think it sounds too different. It's very digital and wavefold-y. I get the impression the DFAM is based more off of more standard analog VCO's with audio rate FM and sync between the two oscillators.

You should definitely pickup a BIA though. They're fantastic for 10hp. Just make sure you have stuff to modulate it.
anselmi
JakoGreyshire wrote:
yeah the DFAM is 60 hp… I could definitely recreate it with 60 HP of modules…It would take a bit of thought and careful module choosing…But I think it's totally doable…


I did it...but the results was not as good as with the DFAM...I mean sonically speaking...this thing is really good tuned for what it does

with modules I got another range of sounds but not the focus and fast to obtain sweet spots of the DFAM

It´s like when you try to recreate a monosynth with modules...even having some close clones of the parts it´s hard to obtain the way the parts interact together in the real thing
JakoGreyshire
NoLegs wrote:


I did pick up a BIA. It's great! Especially with a lot of modulation sources. However, I don't think it's necessarily a way to recreate the DFAM - I think it sounds too different. It's very digital and wavefold-y. I get the impression the DFAM is based more off of more standard analog VCO's with audio rate FM and sync between the two oscillators.

You should definitely pickup a BIA though. They're fantastic for 10hp. Just make sure you have stuff to modulate it.


Yeah, I forgot that the BIA has some digital in there.... I'm guessing that lots of Noise Engineering's stuff is digitally based. I would like to pick up a Sync Iter from them... Huge Octave range on that one. I'd go for a BIA too.. BIA+ PAM's New workout! or Voltage block of course.



Anyway, back to topic..
@anselmi
Quote:
It´s like when you try to recreate a monosynth with modules...even having some close clones of the parts it´s hard to obtain the way the parts interact together in the real thing


Yeah that makes sense... In the Moog class room the engineer, Steve, went over some of the schematics real quick like just for those who might understand it.... It was fascinating! he was showing us different feedback loops and whatnot... I made some videos of the class time... not sure if I got anything worth putting up on youtube...Shitty iphone videos might make my youtube page look crappy to those who don't know... I guess I could make it private and just up load it here... Exclusive for MW! Oh I'm watching it now...shitty audio quality, but I did make a quick shot of the prototype PCB! I'm sure you all would want a high quality closeup shots though eh?

Would this video be a violation of MOOG intellectual Property?
I do not want to be banned from MW.... I hope a moderator can check this for me...
GNSDG
Ha thought nobody replied to this.

Jake did you ever hear from mods?

I think I’m with anselmi here... thought about it for a bit and then decided all the magic was in the sync, cross mod, and maybe envelopes—I’d be buying modules just hoping to hit upon something similar.

I had a similar convo w a Moog guy at TWM re: “confusion”—my advice was to just call it a drum voice, not a drum machine. It’s not a hard problem to solve, I think they just don’t see the market. Which, to be fair, could be accurate.
jvt
GNSDG wrote:
I think they just don’t see the market. Which, to be fair, could be accurate.

Then perhaps they could produce a small run and just test the market! Really, it shouldn't be this difficult to convince a synth company to sell a desirable synth product to people who, you know, actually like to spend money on desirable synth products! seriously, i just don't get it
JakoGreyshire
I would love to have two of them….

I'll probably upload the talk and see where it goes from there…

J.
JakoGreyshire
Finished the video late last night… I'll upload it tonight after work…

It's like 14 minutes of Steve talking. That part is an iPhone video, so don't get your hopes up. It's still cool though. Then I did a video sweep of the DFAM's PCB with some rhythm sounds from the DFAM and Mysteron.

It's a real nerdy video. So, I'll make it unlisted and post it here…

MuffWiggler Exclusive…. Rockin' Banana!

Should I make a new Post? Would that be A better for people to find it? If so, then what should the title be? "An Inside Look at the Moog DFAM"…?

It's already a long video…. I do have more classroom shenanigans…. Steve Explains how to program basic sounds….

I'll probably leave that out for now….yeah it would be a different video…

Programing sounds on the DFAM would be a cool video to make though…

Maybe someday…


Any Thoughts on the matter?

Oh yeah, what category should I post to? Eurorack modules? General gear? etc…

I'll post a link here so you all know where to look…

Let me know what the most appropriate thing to do would be…

Thanks..
JakoGreyshire
I emailed Muff about the possible copyright issue...

No word back from him..

How would looking at a PCB be infringement?


I'll share the boring video here in about an hour or so...

Anyone want to chime in about this concern in the interim?

Any thoughts would be useful...
NoLegs
Hey, I doubt it would be infringement, unless you signed some sort of legal document at the workshop.
JakoGreyshire
Okay here it goes:

Should I also make a new post in another sub forum? Ya know.. for everyone else who is not following this thread..

It is an unlisted video.. you can only see it here.. I think... One might be able to copy the url though... hmmm.....

JakoGreyshire
NoLegs wrote:
Hey, I doubt it would be infringement, unless you signed some sort of legal document at the workshop.


I don't remember signing anything... I don't have a copy of it if I did.

Anyway, I posted the video to eurorack module sub forum.. as"An inside look at the Moog DFAM"

If I get in trouble it all will come down.

eek!

P.S. I like the thumbnail youtube choose of Steve.. Wicked pose! hihi hihi hihi
NoLegs
Thanks! Going to watch now. I think Moog is probably pretty reasonable and would just ask you to take it down, if they had an issue with it.
MikkoM
WTF, my local store let's me preorder this:

https://www.verkkokauppa.com/fi/product/18525/jtnkx/Moog-DFAM-rumpukon e

I did not know they are going to release this, or is that only error at verkkokauppa.com ?
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