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3rd Party 200e Preset Manager - Who's Up For It???
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Buchla, EMS & Serge Goto page 1, 2  Next [all]

Would you purchase a $700 third-party modernized 200e Preset Manager / Mixer module?
Yes
46%
 46%  [ 28 ]
No
18%
 18%  [ 11 ]
Possibly
35%
 35%  [ 21 ]
Total Votes : 60

Author 3rd Party 200e Preset Manager - Who's Up For It???
numan7
in the So, is BEMI still a mess? thread, mirf59 wrote:
....

I've been kinda peeved watching the price swings. A 200e module list price is as volatile as natural gas on the open market.

The prices seem to be associated strictly with the popularity of the modules. The more essential and popular a module is, the more the ask price has gone up since BEMI came in.

For example, the 207e used to be listed for something like $799 and the 206e for $699. Then, it seems someone went through and reviewed the popularity of the modules, and the ask price for a 206e went through the roof. This occurred even as the ask price of a 225e remained stable, so it had nothing to do with the price of manufacturing the preset manager.

The same thing happened with 257e and 256e. The ask price for a 257e used to be in the neighborhood of $1499, and the 256e was maybe $1099. Now that price differential has been flipped in a grotesque manner, despite threads here that argue that 257e is superior technically, more recent tech, better tech.

So, there is a high degree of arbitrariness to the module prices and the price changes. It looks like "charge those suckers what they are willing to pay."

This is a shady business practice in my opinion, and makes it very difficult to plan finances to acquire a system.

OK. Rant over.

....


thumbs up yep - i know what you mean, mirf59... the price-gouging on the 206e is particularly infuriating! angry

anyways, i have a Studio H Dual Programmable Oscillator sitting here waiting for me to build a nice little buchla-reference system around it. i would so love if there were a less expensive (and yet more modern in terms of things like generic high capacity sd-flash cards and usb) option for preset managment.

perhaps it's time for someone to make one.


cheers
APETECHNOLOGY
it has always bothered me that the preset manager is not located on the 223.
it is infuriating that you have to buy 2 modules to get a user interface.
it would be nice if they had a cheaper version of the preset manager in a "h" option.
i am probably just going to wait for the sound machines Arches to come out.
it is going to have a banana break out panel for it.

nanners banana break out nanners

http://www.sound-machines.it/product/arches/
ArguZ
Well, when i got the 206e and used it PM i instantly fell in love with the whole idea.
Now that i have a 225e as well i must say that the 206e has no reason to exist.
The beauty is not the preset managing, its the internal midi and worth every penny.
I am truly puzzled no one introduced a similar system in Eurorack.

So i have to views on the whole save and load topic.

1. If you are in the market for an e-system, buy the 225e and build your system around that. Do not hope for anything new from BEMI's side. But look at it as you look at a blender or a guitar..this it it. Do something with it smile

2. We totally should think about a proper preset matrix.
Something that allows each module to have a number of local memory storages and a manager that has the same.
So we can load module 1 preset 5, module 2 preset 69, module 15 preset 4 .. and so on.
Then i would totally be on board.
And it also should sport a proper big OLED screen, midi and USB support and be controlled remotely by a VST.
jsheaucsb
I've been using the 225m Firmware card USB-Midi solution and it works insanely well.

I would be so up for a solution that involved Preset storage over USB. The current preset storage over card solution is just way too cumbersome and I think the tech exists to save presets to your Mac desktop or laptop.

Module or not. An improved Preset management system would be a dream!
mirf59
....

If you've got MIDI channels and MIDI input into the 200e, why have a hardware-based preset manager at all? It can be software residing on your workstation, sending all the necessary information to the 200e over the MIDI channels directly to the modules. You would lose the CV'able advance of the preset, CV'able random recall. But you could accomplish the randomness in the software, and the CV advance is not enough to justify so many $s for hardware-based, real-estate consuming preset manager, on-board.

.....
mritenburg
mirf59 wrote:
....

If you've got MIDI channels and MIDI input into the 200e, why have a hardware-based preset manager at all? It can be software residing on your workstation, sending all the necessary information to the 200e over the MIDI channels directly to the modules. You would lose the CV'able advance of the preset, CV'able random recall. But you could accomplish the randomness in the software, and the CV advance is not enough to justify so many $s for hardware-based, real-estate consuming preset manager, on-board.

.....


Most 200e module parameters cannot be set through MIDI.
tIB
Fwiw my only real gripe with the way the 225r handles things is the clock reset/jitter/skip when you change presets with an external midi clock running. Annoying.
stephentrask
APETECHNOLOGY wrote:
it has always bothered me that the preset manager is not located on the 223.
it is infuriating that you have to buy 2 modules to get a user interface.
it would be nice if they had a cheaper version of the preset manager in a "h" option.
i am probably just going to wait for the sound machines Arches to come out.
it is going to have a banana break out panel for it.

nanners banana break out nanners

http://www.sound-machines.it/product/arches/


This is bugging me to no end. I really want a 223e as a controller for Eurorack. It may have been a great way into the Buchla Ecosystem. But since I now realize I have to add another $1600 module to make it effective, pushing me into a 6 space boat or 4 space + passive boat for the surface, I am essentially looking at a 5k controller.

And yeah, even an h series version would probably have been enough to tip the scales in favor of doing this.
rkilman
I want morphing presets!
Leoespejo
rkilman wrote:
I want morphing presets!


I want interpolation between presets, just like Max patrstorage object.
tIB
stephentrask wrote:
APETECHNOLOGY wrote:
it has always bothered me that the preset manager is not located on the 223.
it is infuriating that you have to buy 2 modules to get a user interface.
it would be nice if they had a cheaper version of the preset manager in a "h" option.
i am probably just going to wait for the sound machines Arches to come out.
it is going to have a banana break out panel for it.

nanners banana break out nanners

http://www.sound-machines.it/product/arches/


This is bugging me to no end. I really want a 223e as a controller for Eurorack. It may have been a great way into the Buchla Ecosystem. But since I now realize I have to add a $1600 module to make it effective, pushing me into a 6 space boat or 4 space + passive boat for the surface, I am essentially looking at a 5k controller.

And yeah, even an h series version would probably have been enough to tip the scales in favor of doing this.


You realise it is capable of saving a single state?
stephentrask
tIB wrote:


You realise it is capable of saving a single state?


It is or isn't? I thought it saved nothing.
ArguZ
rkilman wrote:
I want morphing presets!


I want a preset matrix...
Each module addressable , or systemwide snapshots.
But the old data bus is at its limit already.

The whole preset ecosystem is what makes Buchla stand out.
I would love for them to hire some clever tech and renovate this particular part and then license it out to third party developers.
And then the format would flourish.
tIB
stephentrask wrote:
tIB wrote:


You realise it is capable of saving a single state?


It is or isn't? I thought it saved nothing.


Pretty sure it saves current (programmed) state upon press of mem/recall button.
stephentrask
tIB wrote:
stephentrask wrote:
tIB wrote:


You realise it is capable of saving a single state?


It is or isn't? I thought it saved nothing.


Pretty sure it saves current (programmed) state upon press of mem/recall button.


i see. Still, probably not enough for something as deep as this to be useful without a way of saving set-ups.
tIB
I'd say it was - nearly bought a second to use in my bug setup.
stephentrask
tIB wrote:
I'd say it was - nearly bought a second to use in my bug setup.


Hmmm. You find it to be enough? I feel myself getting poorer.
meatcliff
some type of H format preset manager would be ideal for me
ArguZ
I second that...
It would also be a much needed boost for the h series
Especially if you got a mixer already and do not care for midi much.

It's the one module that is really missing...
Synesthesia
I'll get behind that too!
missingtwin
I wish there was an incremental randomization feature
on the preset manager.
That would be fun!

But I adore the 200e preset system. It’s basically what makes
the modular synth work for me.
batchas
missingtwin wrote:
I wish there was an incremental randomization feature
on the preset manager.
That would be fun!

Is it then the incremental factor that you are missing when you change randomly the presets via CV?
stephentrask
ArguZ wrote:
I second that...
It would also be a much needed boost for the h series
Especially if you got a mixer already and do not care for midi much.

It's the one module that is really missing...

It would be even better as an iPhone app. Get it out of the case altogether and on an easily readable screen. This would free the mixer up to have more CV controllable panning, XLR/TRS combo outs, effects returns so that pedals can be mixed back in, etc. The 225e would have room for a. more jacks to override the default routing, the possibility of switching from MIDI In to MIDI Out so that one might record a performance onto a DAW and then edit it and play it back.

Or other stuff.
batchas
batchas wrote:
missingtwin wrote:
I wish there was an incremental randomization feature
on the preset manager.
That would be fun!

Is it then the incremental factor that you are missing when you change randomly the presets via CV?

I should have asked right away why incremental? What difference does it really makes I mean, as there are only 30 presets anyway? Incremental from 0 to 30 in random, you're gonna reach 0 pretty fast IMHO, so you gonna hear anyway quickly again a previous preset, if you know what I mean, or am I missing something?
unfrostedpoptart
I've been thinking about this (don't own any Buchla at the moment) from the other side - making modules compatible with the preset manager. Does anyone know the protocol? It seems like it would just be a 5-bit bus for preset number (since it only supports 30 presets) and one wire for save and one for load. Maybe a bit more complicated for firmware queries and updates.

Anyway, this thread seems to be based on the idea that the presets are stored in the preset manager. I don't know for sure, but reading everything I could find, it looks like each module has its own memory and the preset manager just tells it which one to use and when to save. Otherwise, the preset manager would be crazy complicated and need to know the details of every connected module. Anyone know the details and have the schematics?

David
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