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Is there a 5U SEM filter clone? |
skylab001
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 Posted: Sun Aug 29, 2010 2:19 am Post subject: Is there a 5U SEM filter clone? |
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| Just curious if there is an SEM filter clone in the 5U format. I know there are a couple of State Variable Filters which seem similar, but they don't seem to be clones, but then I've not heard them first hand though. Looking for some input as I would like to have an SEM filter in my setup. |
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SepticUnderground
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MPZ
Learning to Wiggle
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:38 pm Post subject: |
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honestly... why not just buy one of the patch panel SEM re-issues. A few converter cables and you get plenty more than just a filter.
Just sayin... |
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Ken MacBeth
Wiggling with Experience
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| Posted: Sat Sep 04, 2010 7:42 pm Post subject: |
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Hi yes- I have made a replicant in my Mk1 5U series - right down to the LM301A and UA 741 opamps....avoided by many these days. The sound is pure squelch and SEM!
Maybe you could check out postings on here about the Macbeth Mk1 5U synth modules!........thanks
Ken M |
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kidtesla
sucker for filters
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:11 pm Post subject: |
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| Ken MacBeth wrote: | | squelch and SEM! |
 sounds like the title of a 70's TV show
Really looking forward to this filter. |
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drewtoothpaste
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 9:25 pm Post subject: |
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The LP - Notch - HP knob is the most important part of the SEM filter imo.
None of the SVF filters I've seen have this (apart from the SEM filter itself!) |
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Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:16 pm Post subject: |
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| drewtoothpaste wrote: | The LP - Notch - HP knob is the most important part of the SEM filter imo.
None of the SVF filters I've seen have this (apart from the SEM filter itself!) |
...although it's super easy to do. Most SVFs bring HP, LP and BP out to separate jacks. Some also bring out the notch, which requires an additional summing opamp. However, nothing would prevent bringing all four out to a rotary switch and adding another jack for the switchable output. |
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megaohm
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| Posted: Tue Sep 07, 2010 10:18 pm Post subject: |
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| drewtoothpaste wrote: | The LP - Notch - HP knob is the most important part of the SEM filter imo.
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Never played with an original. Is this knob a pot or a switch?
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russma
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 12:24 am Post subject: |
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I want it to be a pot. And under CV control. Please.
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Synthbuilder
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 1:43 am Post subject: |
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| megaohm wrote: | | Never played with an original. Is this knob a pot or a switch? |
It's both. The pot moves from LP to Notch to HP. But turn it all the way anti-clockwise and it'll click and you'll get BP.
Ignoring the BP part since this is either on or off, the LP-Notch-HP can be easily obtained with any crossfader module. Simply connect the LP and HP to it and crossfade between them. Alternatively use an external mixer (VC or otherwise) and mix the outputs to get the variations you need. Notch is obtained when both inputs are at equal gain.
I didn't put a SEM style knob on my SVF simply because there was no room on either the 1U or 2U panel design for it and the large collection of I/O you get with a SVF.
Tony
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Peake
I'm in ur DIY. Filling cases with Buchla
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| Posted: Wed Sep 08, 2010 1:31 pm Post subject: |
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| drewtoothpaste wrote: | The LP - Notch - HP knob is the most important part of the SEM filter imo.
None of the SVF filters I've seen have this (apart from the SEM filter itself!) |
Perhaps my favorite default sound when I had a Four Voice was to get the LPF to pluck, and to then move that notch setting a little bit up to add HP fuzz. Beautiful.
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Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2010 12:46 am Post subject: |
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| Peake wrote: | | drewtoothpaste wrote: | The LP - Notch - HP knob is the most important part of the SEM filter imo.
None of the SVF filters I've seen have this (apart from the SEM filter itself!) |
Perhaps my favorite default sound when I had a Four Voice was to get the LPF to pluck, and to then move that notch setting a little bit up to add HP fuzz. Beautiful. |
I'm just organizing my new 2164 Dual 2P SVF, so thanks for the ideas. Anyone seen how Thomas White panelized his dual MOTM SVF module? Pretty sweet. I may go that route, and add the mode knob too! |
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drewtoothpaste
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| Posted: Sun Sep 12, 2010 8:31 am Post subject: |
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| Thanks Tony! I thought it was more complex than that but I have a pan/fade module and will try this. |
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sempervirent
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| Posted: Fri May 11, 2012 11:33 pm Post subject: |
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Years later... are there any other options?
The Oakley module self-resonates, which is not the true behavior of the SEM filter from what I understand (or hear on my reissue), though I understand that the Oakley SVF is not supposed to be a 1:1 clone.
Yes, I have the SEM reissue but I'm not sure I'll hold onto it, and the filter is really the most exciting aspect.
I'd be interested in the Macbeth SVF but it's MU and all my other stuff is 5U/MOTM.
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Flux Jetson
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 12:02 am Post subject: |
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I see someone says to use a SVF and use a mixer to x-fade between LPF and HPF.
The dot com Q162 is precisely "that". It will provide a "mixture" of all four modes in any amounts of all.
Also on the dot com Q107 the LPF and HPF are 12db, and the BPF and notch are 6db slopes .. isn't that like what the SEM is? So if you use the Q162 with the Q107 ... you're there. I went through this entire headache about three weeks ago. Couple of threads that address it.
I'll have my own Q107 up tomorrow, maybe I can offer a user's point of view after that.
CON: MU.
Other than that I know that Doc Etch -n- sketch has something that fills the need.
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Dave Peck
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| Posted: Sun May 13, 2012 5:12 pm Post subject: |
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| Or, instead of the Q162, you can use a Q111 Pan/Fade and connect the HP and LP filter outputs to the crossfader input, and now you can use control voltages to modulate the filter response from LP to notch to HP. |
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Synthbuilder
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 2:17 am Post subject: |
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| sempervirent wrote: | | The Oakley module self-resonates, which is not the true behavior of the SEM filter from what I understand (or hear on my reissue), though I understand that the Oakley SVF is not supposed to be a 1:1 clone. |
Indeed. The Oakley SVF is not a clone. It's pretty much a standard text book SVF with a rather unusual soft limiting feedback circuit.
It's also had various versions, the first couple had CA3280s, the next one had THAT2180s and the current one uses the LM13700. Each has sounded a little different - but not massively so and you probably couldn't tell them apart unless you had them all next to each other.
I don't the think SEM's sound comes entirely from it's filter. There's something dirty and raw about the original SEM that could well be coming from the final VCA (CA3080 based) and the VCOs (discrete for the most part). They're very nice units and it still bugs me now that I sold my TVS-1.
Tony
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Flux Jetson
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Location: Colorado River Basin, Rural Arizona.
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| Posted: Mon May 14, 2012 4:36 am Post subject: |
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| Dave Peck wrote: | | Or, instead of the Q162, you can use a Q111 Pan/Fade and connect the HP and LP filter outputs to the crossfader input, and now you can use control voltages to modulate the filter response from LP to notch to HP. |
Yup, - true dat.
The Q111 is a nice tool, isn't it? 
On the other side of this coin if you use the Q162 you have the ability to mix FOUR filter types to create whatever kind of Frankenfilter you care too. Imagine what kid of scewball slopes that could come from that effort!
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sempervirent
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| Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 1:44 pm Post subject: |
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I decided to sell my MIDI:CV SEM... started having second thoughts (of course) as I gave it one last tryout before boxing it up. Then I came across this comparison of the SEM vs the Andromeda:
http://www.amazona.de/index.php?page=26&file=2&article_id=3522
You can use Google Translate if you'd like but all you really need to do is click the "Download ZIP" link to the right of the audio player and listen to the files. The person who made these set up the A6 to match the SEM as closely as possible, and recorded a patch on the SEM, followed by the Andromeda. The first filter on the Andromeda is a clone of the SEM (the second filter is a clone of the Moog 904a). To my ears the Andromeda is 90% there in most patches and identical in others. And has 16 voices of polyphony.
This doesn't really answer the question about filters in modular format, but since I have an Andromeda already (which has a filter input) I have no regrets about letting the SEM go. Tony might be right about the discrete VCOs and the VCA of the SEM adding something special but I was really surprised by these demos. |
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Flux Jetson
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| Posted: Wed May 16, 2012 7:32 pm Post subject: |
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I almost bought an Andromeda THREE TIMES back in those days when I had my repair shop and had some money.
I've tried to convince myself it's a crappy synth ever since then. But I kinda know better than that, to be very honest about it.
I truly envy you ... Andromeda .. and an SEM ... you have an embarrassment of riches sir.
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