Muff's Modules & More

[Guesswerk]

Just set my studio up again after moving house and was thinking last night, what's up with modern gear?

EG TR808 vs Jomox- 808 wins hands down depsite limited editing, no MIDI etc.
pro-one vs DSI MEK no competition. MEK sounds really thin, weak, sterile, dead, uninvolving.
Jupiter80 jesus.

etc etc etc

I know that manufrs can't resist IC's these days and the old discrete designs are expensive etc but if they don't sound as good then why bother? They don't make violins out of plastic just because its easy to injection mold or whatever. I really can't believe Dave Smith thinks his new stuff sounds anywhere near as good as SCI stuff despite what his site says. The specs are massive but the sounds have no grunt or presence IMO.

I find it really frustrating because i don't want to be stuck in the past with a museum for a studio and be restricted to using an 808 for drums but on the other hand the new gear (with the one complete exeption being most modular gear of course) just doesn't sound as good to me. I keep trying the new stuff and it consistently disappoints with general lack of power and thin tone.

Anybody got any examples of modern gear that really stands up against the vintage classics? Andromeda maybe? (never heard one in the flesh)

[Jason Brock]

[darenager]

Yeah good point, but I think a lot of smaller companies are doing great sounding stuff, and sadly a lot of medium sized/larger companies have to go for pricepoint first. It seems that almost every new product that is released someone is giving their opinion on what price it should be, if we take it that manufacturers read forums, then not really a surprise.

I think a lot of people these days confuse something being overpriced with whether they can afford it, then in the next breath they are moaning that everything is made in China etc.

Can't have it all

When the 808 was released it was quite expensive, same goes for a lot of classic gear, these days most people would not pay that much, so it is upto the boutique guys to fill the very small niche of those people who value quality over price.

I remember people moaning about the price of the monotribe FFS

You pays yer money....

[Jason Brock]

Excellent points darenager.
The Jupiter 8 retailed for $5,295 US in 1981.
Adjusting for inflation that would be around $13,000 in 2012.

[ignatius]

This thread smells like gearslutz.


I love the desktop evolver. I think it goes into the classic synths of all time list.

If you can't find a way to make good sounds with all that is available today then you should find something else to do with your time. Just sayin.

[darenager]

My point was not about snobbery, but expectations. I like cheap gear, I like expensive gear, and my expectations are aligned to what I paid.

If anything my mentioning that people were moaning the monotribe was expensive is a good example, a £160 analogue synth, sequencer and 3 part drum machine has a bit of hiss and no midi? Oh the shock! Not really at that price, £500 maybe.

[darenager]

^ Cue someone chiming in that for $20 the noise could be cured and midi could be implemented, yeah? Fucking make some then and clean up.

[mhtones]

[CF3]

[darenager]

Read it again.

[mome rath]

the evolver sounds great

[Babaluma]

agreed, but when a lot of the great stuff the OP mentions was released it was classed as "pro" gear (with a price tag to match), and along the way somewhere it all went "prosumer"/built to a cheap price point, with a corresponding lack of build and sound quality.

if you buy "pro" gear now, you can still get the great sound and build quality, but then loads of people start bitching about the price, and how their new roland/korg/yamaha whatevathefuckitiz can do the same thing for a tenth of the price.

you get what you pay for.

[ignatius]

[Rozzer]

Sequential Pro One was $745 in 1981. That's around $2500 in todays money. The Evolver is $475 or thereabouts right now.

TR-808 was $1175 in 1980. That's around $4000 now. The Jomox 888 is $1500.

I'm not convinced your comparisons are fair. People were parting with large chunks of cash for the very best musical instruments of their time. It's a shame no-one makes a $4000 drum machine any more, but I guess that's a sign of the times.

And yeah, I think the Evolver rocks too

[ignatius]

also, i think something like the FR-XS is a closer comparison to the SCI pro one in features and architecture etc.

evolver is a hybrid synth and imo spanks the bejesus out of a lot of synths, new and old, with all it can do.

[Dr. Sketch-n-Etch]

I want to comment on the OP of this thread; specifically, that discrete circuits sound better than ICs.

First, many of the "classic" analog synths people rave about were built from Curtis CEM33XX or Solid State Music SSM20XX custom ICs. There are Curtis chips in the Evolver.

Second, when you open up a discrete component (like a transistor, for example), what do you find? The same super-tiny lithographically derived semiconductor devices you find in SSI and MSI integrated circuits.

Third, most of the eurorack modules being made today are made not only with ICs, but with surface-mount ICs (which have exactly the same stuff "under the hood" as their larger through-hole cousins) and I don't hear too many people accusing these modules of sounding thin.

If a synth sounds thin, I would guess that it probably has more to do with the control system architecture than with the actual guts of the circuitry.

[sneak-thief]

Discrete doesn't sound as good? Tell that to Phil:

http://www.discretesynthesizers.com/dsc/dsc.htm



mwahaha...

But on a serious note, there are many serious scientific discussions about why discrete op-amps are believed to sound better:

http://www.groupdiy.com/index.php?topic=27238.0

[Dr. Sketch-n-Etch]

[joey]

now is absolutely the best time ever to be into synths... new gear can sound just as great as old gear, it's all about who is using it and how it is being used.

blame the user, not the tool.

[vozs]

My tube Hifi sounds better then yours because the speaker cables is
oxygen free, dont mind the eggcardboardboxes on the wall or my religion is better then yours because i say so.