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Expert Sleepers ES-3 question |
Shadow84
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 Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 6:57 pm Post subject: Expert Sleepers ES-3 question |
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When using the ES-3 to trigger a modular via CV/Gate, say by recording MIDI notes in the DAW, do you know if there will bad synchronization issues such as the ones occurring with MIDI to CV/Gate converters or any MIDI gear in general? For instance when triggering a 1/16 or a 1/8 sequence the synchronisation is never tight with standard MIDI gear. Is it possible to program sequences with the Silent Way software and shift them forward or backward in time like Innerclock Systems Sync-Gen or SND Acme-4 would do? Thanks in advance.
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Last edited by Shadow84 on Mon May 21, 2012 7:09 pm; edited 1 time in total |
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ringstone
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:09 pm Post subject: |
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Are you talking about doing this in real time? Anyway, if you wanted to you could record the output from Silent Way into a track and then shift the resultant wave file - for example to counter any soundcard latency you could pull it back slightly...
Cheers
Blair
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radiodread87
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:15 pm Post subject: |
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| ringstone wrote: | Are you talking about doing this in real time? Anyway, if you wanted to you could record the output from Silent Way into a track and then shift the resultant wave file - for example to counter any soundcard latency you could pull it back slightly...
Cheers
Blair |
 great tips
In general with using Silent Way there is Zero latency on the midi notes etc, sync is very tight and certainly (in my experience) much better than Midi to CV.
Midi still has its place and I use it but now I am used to the Expert Sleepers modules and system I wouldn't go back, really it has enabled me to use my modular in a reproduceable way. (although that may not be a desired thing for some for me it is important)
Anyway I am sure this will get moved to the ES subforum, and there you will find LOADS of info and threads, plus helpful advice from Os is never far away there 
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Shadow84
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:18 pm Post subject: |
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| ringstone wrote: | Are you talking about doing this in real time? Anyway, if you wanted to you could record the output from Silent Way into a track and then shift the resultant wave file - for example to counter any soundcard latency you could pull it back slightly...
Cheers
Blair |
No it doesn't have to be in real time. See the problem is that because the ES-3 is not a MIDI to CV/Gate converter I don't understand how synchronisation works exactly. If you manually shift a wave file in a DAW that has been triggered via MIDI or MIDI to CV/Gate, the first note will be in time but the rest will not because MIDI synchronisation is poor.
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Shadow84
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:28 pm Post subject: |
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| radiodread87 wrote: | In general with using Silent Way there is Zero latency on the midi notes etc, sync is very tight and certainly (in my experience) much better than Midi to CV.
Anyway I am sure this will get moved to the ES subforum, and there you will find LOADS of info and threads, plus helpful advice from Os is never far away there |
Oh yes I forgot that there was a dedicated ES sub-forum. Basically, because the computer will connect to the ES-3 via ADAT I didn't know how MIDI notes are being transferred to the module and therefore I wasn't sure if there would be bad timing issues. Thanks for your input though, I was looking what ES users had to say about the sync and latency issue.
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ringstone
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:33 pm Post subject: |
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Oh right. As the conversion from MIDI->Audio (which is then output from your soundcard/ES-3 etc as a control voltage) occurs "in the box" the sync is rock solid, much as with a VST plugin. Actually I will say that it initially sounds a bit weird hearing analogue gear played with that sort of accuracy...
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Blair
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radiodread87
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:37 pm Post subject: |
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| Shadow84 wrote: | | radiodread87 wrote: | In general with using Silent Way there is Zero latency on the midi notes etc, sync is very tight and certainly (in my experience) much better than Midi to CV.
Anyway I am sure this will get moved to the ES subforum, and there you will find LOADS of info and threads, plus helpful advice from Os is never far away there |
Oh yes I forgot that there was a dedicated ES sub-forum. Basically, because the computer will connect to the ES-3 via ADAT I didn't know how MIDI notes are being transferred to the module and therefore I wasn't sure if there would be bad timing issues. Thanks for your input though, I was looking what ES users had to say about the sync and latency issue. |
Well basically you would set up a voice controller on the midi track that you want to have the modular play. You then route the output of the track to the appropriate ADAT output of your interface from you DAW. Then of course connect that ADAT out to the ADAT in of the ES-3.
Its all much easier to explain with the software in front of us though, but its really not difficult and like I said from my experience latency was a thing of the past once I started getting the hang of Silent way.
One thing to remember too is you have to calibrate the oscillator you are controlling with the ES3 in the Voice controller, its not that difficult either really and you can save the calibration file for later usage (so you dont have to do it every single time)
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radiodread87
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:39 pm Post subject: |
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| ringstone wrote: | Oh right. As the conversion from MIDI->Audio (which is then output from your soundcard/ES-3 etc as a control voltage) occurs "in the box" the sync is rock solid, much as with a VST plugin. Actually I will say that it initially sounds a bit weird hearing analogue gear played with that sort of accuracy...
Cheers
Blair |
indeed Blair it really is strange to hear it the first few times but one thing is for sure, when I go to someone else's place and hear the MIDI setups etc they have I can sure as hell hear the difference, admittedly they could probably set things up better....
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Shadow84
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:41 pm Post subject: |
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| ringstone wrote: | Oh right. As the conversion from MIDI->Audio (which is then output from your soundcard/ES-3 etc as a control voltage) occurs "in the box" the sync is rock solid, much as with a VST plugin.
Cheers
Blair |
Great news because I keep obsessing over synchronization. So I suppose the ES-3 option will be better than MIDI to CV/Gate converter modules or stand alone units.
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Shadow84
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 7:51 pm Post subject: |
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| radiodread87 wrote: | | One thing to remember too is you have to calibrate the oscillator you are controlling with the ES3 in the Voice controller, its not that difficult either really and you can save the calibration file for later usage (so you dont have to do it every single time) |
How do you calibrate an oscillator? Is it complicated? What if you want to use ES-3 with stand alone synthesisers? I guess they also need to be calibrated?
| radiodread87 wrote: | | indeed Blair it really is strange to hear it the first few times but one thing is for sure, when I go to someone else's place and hear the MIDI setups etc they have I can sure as hell hear the difference, admittedly they could probably set things up better.... |
Yes MIDI is a nightmare, when I am using a drum machine to trigger a synthesiser, with no MIDI involved, it sounds super-tight. When I am doing the same thing with MIDI, synchronisation is very sloppy and it sounds bad. Especially if I am trying to do 1/8 or 1/16 sequences and unfortunately it is impossible and also unbearable to edit something like that if it is playing throughout a song.
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radiodread87
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 8:33 pm Post subject: |
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| Quote: | | How do you calibrate an oscillator? Is it complicated? What if you want to use ES-3 with stand alone synthesisers? I guess they also need to be calibrated? |
its not difficult to do at all, just involved routing audio from the Oscillator (module or synth) to an audio input so that the ES3 is able to "hear it" and calibrate from there.
see this video for details:
you may also be interested in this one....
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Shadow84
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| Posted: Mon May 21, 2012 9:09 pm Post subject: |
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Cool, thanks for the videos.
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