tax return+other things equals moneymoneymoney

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sgnhh
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tax return+other things equals moneymoneymoney

Post by sgnhh » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:17 pm

I should soon have around $400 to spend on modules. I'm curious as to what you guys would buy if you had my setup. This is what I have now

Plan B M15 VCO
Harvestman Polivoks VCF
Metasonix TM7
Serge 3p mixer
Doepfer 143-2 Quad ADSR
Doepfer 118 Noise/Random
Doepfer 137 Wave Multiplier
Doepfer Expo VCA
Doepfer Expo Mixer
Doepfer Multiples

This is what I'm stuck between. I'd really like to get another audio source. Probably another VCO. But, I'm really entranced by the Doepfer R2M ribbon controller. I don't have a keyboard or any other device like that to control my modular, and while I don't think I necessarily need one, from what I've seen, I think the R2M would fill that gap nicely and I could definitely make use of it.

So it would break down like this:

$399 R2M
$free shipping through ebay

or

$200-$250 audio source
$100 Adinfinitum multiples (if I go this route I can then sell my Doepfer multiples for around $40)
$20 Adinfinitum cables (really need more cables)
$??? shipping

The first option gives me one new toy, but one that is infinitely usable. The second option gives me a new sound source and some foundation in having enough multiples (for a while) and cables, while saving some of the cash leftover. Also, if I wanted to go slightly overbudget, I could pick up a cheap-ish used Doepfer module, such as a ring mod, another mixer or vca, or wave processor.

It seems like the choice should be obvious, but fuck, the R2M is so damn cool. Does anyone here have the R2M? What would you guys do? Any other suggestions??

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Muff Wiggler
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Post by Muff Wiggler » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:50 pm

everyone i hear moans about the quantizing on the R2M

I think i would make my own un-quantized ribbon for $20 and then spend the cash on modules. I would get another VCO for nice FM work, or a MiniWave for real flexibility

you are on Euro, I think in your shoes I'd buy a Livewire AFG!

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felix
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Post by felix » Wed Feb 20, 2008 2:56 pm

Personally, I love "voltage sources" more than audio sources...but of course, many times they can be the same thing.

"Audio sources" are fairly ubiquitous. They can come from external samples/mics, other instruments, self-oscillating filters, feedback, the TM-7...etc. Sure, those aren't VCOs, but they make great audio sources.

If it was me (and your system is very similar to mine) I'd immediately add one of the Doepfer dual VCAs (A-132). I didn't put much stock in VCAs originally, but I quickly learned that a VCA+EG is basically an extra "hand" in playing a patch. It's relatively cheap too ($80), and they come up on eBay fairly regularly if you want to save a little more.

Another cheap add-on which would give you more options out of your existing sources would be a voltage inverter. Doepfer has a 4HP dual one (A-175) for $65. A nice additional feature of this is that it has two inputs (on each half) which are normalled to eachother...so if you have a source going into one input, you have a copy of the source available at the other input as well as the inverted source available on the output. Saves your multiples, basically. I would definitely recommend this with the Quad ADSR as it's the only way you can get inverted envelopes.

I'd also recommend the Dalek Modulator ($260) once they are back in stock. Not only is it a great sound source, it's an even better modulation source. You basically get 2 VCO/LFOs with x-mod and a ring mod all in one; but each can still be used independently. The only downside to the Dalek is that it's oscillators track linearly and not 1v/Oct which has been a bit disappointing sometimes.

The other guys here might have other opinions, but overall I've personally found multiple to be overrated. I thought I would need a bunch, but I have yet to make full use of the 2 Doepfer A-180s that I have. The majority of the time that they are used are on the rare occasion that I hook up the keyboard and need to distribute the 1v/Oct pitch source to multiple modules, and that usually only requires half of one of the A-180s.

The ribbon controller would definitely be fun though! If you don't really think you need all the additional features (midi basically) of the R2M package, you might save a bit more by going with the A-198 (http://www.analoguehaven.com/doepfer/a198/). It's essentially just the ribbon and the module necessary to get CV sources. Personally, I've always found quantization to kind of defeat the thing that makes ribbons so great, but you can always add quantization with an A-156 Quantizer. The bonus with that route is you can use that quantizer with other modules in your system, where as the quantization in the R2M "brain" is only going to function with the ribbon. (http://www.analoguehaven.com/doepfer/a156/)

Oh yeah, and as Muff mentioned, the AFG once it's released...but that's gonna be your whole $400 right there.

PS. Patch the band-pass output of the Polivoks into it's own non-attenuated CV input and then turn the resonance up to self-oscillate. Boom! Instant saw-tooth VCO. :D
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sgnhh
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Post by sgnhh » Wed Feb 20, 2008 3:09 pm

I'll get the AFG, but I don't expect to see that for another month and a half. I'd really like to get one of the Livewire modules, but those are by far the most hard to track down. They seem to never be in stock.

Since I could build a controller, I'll hold off on that.

edit: yeah, feedbacking the polivoks is one of my favorite things to do with it.

Felix, how do you feel about your Plan B M24? I've been seriously considering that, but the more I think about it, the more I wonder what I could do with it. The random output is neat, but from what I gather, it's mostly used as a CV controller. I suppose I don't really "get" cv yet. My understanding of it now is that you mostly use it to, well, uh, control audio sources. Is this a fair assessment? I guess I feel like the amount of cv controllers should somewhat equate to the amount of audio sources I have. I've got the 4 ADSRs/LFOs and 3 cv controllable sources (m15, polivoks, tm7). So it seems that getting another cv controller might be foolish? Maybe you can clue me in to something I'm missing.

sgnhh
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Post by sgnhh » Wed Feb 20, 2008 3:38 pm

Let me add to this

I just watched your video for the M10 envelope and I think I understand why you said you prefer voltage controls. In this video you're running several cv sources to the one M15. Hm.

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felix
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Post by felix » Wed Feb 20, 2008 5:49 pm

sgnhh wrote:Felix, how do you feel about your Plan B M24? I've been seriously considering that, but the more I think about it, the more I wonder what I could do with it. The random output is neat, but from what I gather, it's mostly used as a CV controller. I suppose I don't really "get" cv yet. My understanding of it now is that you mostly use it to, well, uh, control audio sources. Is this a fair assessment? I guess I feel like the amount of cv controllers should somewhat equate to the amount of audio sources I have. I've got the 4 ADSRs/LFOs and 3 cv controllable sources (m15, polivoks, tm7). So it seems that getting another cv controller might be foolish? Maybe you can clue me in to something I'm missing.
I love the M24. I actually group my M24 and my Dual Cyclotron together as my "chaos" generators. I usually patch these to filters or Pulse Width, or things that alter timbre somehow. Sometimes I'll use them to control pitch of an oscillator, but I get kinda bored of that sound quickly. The only draw back to the M24, in my opinion, is the lack of attenuators for the CV ins. The real strength of the M24 as a random voltage generator is the CV control but the CV ins are very sensitive...I almost always have to attenuate a CV source into the M24. The M24 can also function as a S+H, noise gen, gate->trigger, and more. It's very versatile. The Smooth output is really great too, especially if you need some slowly changing voltage. I'm looking forward to using that smooth voltage out with some dual AFG FM patches! :D Check out the M24 product page for the details on all the additional stuff it can do: http://www.ear-group.net/model_24.html

I've come to find CV control sources more useful because I'll usually start with some kind of audio sound and I'll immediately think "ok how do I make this change" or "how can I 'animate' this" and I'll always reach for some kind of control source. And with VCAs and other CV control sources, you can now change/animate the first control source. VCAs don't necessarily have controlled by EGs...and ring mods make great VCAs when you are using an LFO as the modulator.

Think of it this way, most modules are control source type of modules and not audio/filter modules. And that majority of those control source modules are CV controllable! So not only can you have multiple control sources modulating a sound source, but you can have other control sources modulating those control sources.
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Cat-A-Tonic
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R2M

Post by Cat-A-Tonic » Wed Feb 20, 2008 6:56 pm

I have the R2M and I am very happy with it.
I don't think a DIY ribbon would offer the pressure sensitivity.
2 CVs and 1 Gate are very useful in the modular, especially because I don't have a midi-cv converter yet.

I have not tried the Doepfer A-198, but I have heard negative reviews when compared to the R2M. The R2M also deosn't take up any valuable real estate in your rack.

I have been using it to control:
Roland D-50 (you can use the keys at the same time but the ribbon is louder)
and softsynths via midi
and now my Blacet/CGS system via CV.

Page 23 at the end of the manual does offer a trautonium mode which defeats the quantization. It is really quite flexible once you get used to programming the 'brain.'

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Chuck E. Jesus
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Post by Chuck E. Jesus » Wed Feb 20, 2008 7:42 pm

what were the negative reviews of the A-198? this thread reminded me i wanted one :)


to the original poster: did you consider a second Plan B M15? i'd love to hear cross mod between two of those...

sgnhh
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Post by sgnhh » Wed Feb 20, 2008 10:40 pm

I considered a second M15, but decided that I'd rather get a mix of other manufacturers in there.

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Chuck E. Jesus
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Post by Chuck E. Jesus » Wed Feb 20, 2008 11:23 pm

it's your money dude...

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