Triggering "parts" with....

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Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:23 pm

Hey y'all,

Couple of things here....

Been kind of checking out latches/switches but haven't really found the "thing" that would work. I've seen the "trigger to gate" modules, but I'm wondering about more of a latch (or switch) that could be triggered with a trigger and just let voltage go high to say open a vca for several seconds or longer to let like a sequence play for a measure and then turn back off. Then, second trigger makes the gate go low. Seems like a super simple thing.

I've seen the ADDAC manual latch module (spendy, I'm not DIY) and the "mute mixer" type manual jobs. Which I've thought would be cool for a little controller pod....

Which brings me to the other thing. I've got a handful of digital modules IME and others. Another unit that I'd like to see is one that can also change the programs on these at the hit of a trigger... I think there is a way for IME modules to change progs every time a trig hits it, so that maybe solvable with a sequencer.

Either way, combining these 2 things seems like a powerful way to make some drastic part-type changes which I feel is lacking in my euro "jam" sessions, that get boring rather quick.

Anyone got any tips for this or use this in their own jams

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by Raindeer » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:16 pm

GregIcky wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 3:23 pm
triggered with a trigger and just let voltage go high to say open a vca for several seconds or longer to let like a sequence play for a measure and then turn back off. Then, second trigger makes the gate go low.
Sounds like a flipflop. Instruo Tàin will do this in latching mode.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:33 pm

Raindeer wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:16 pm
Sounds like a flipflop. Instruo Tàin will do this in latching mode.
Is a flipflop what I'm after? One trigger goes high, one trigger goes low...

I have a switch from Ladik that is great, but not really the same.

I'm thinking triggered mutes .... seems so simple.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by batch » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:38 pm

There are a lot of switch type modules that can turn things on or off.

For parts, or dramatic shifts there are ways to combine switches with other modules, particularly voltage memory type things. For example, using Tetrapad you can have 8 voltages that can be changed either manually or sequenced (using Tete). These voltages could open a switch, change a cut off, switch a preset or change a sample depending that they are plugged into. Think of it as 8 things changing that define your parts.

There are other modules that can do this, Pressure Points + Analog Memory for example, or using something like Matrixchate or other muting capabilities. Matrixchate can change 16 things at a time.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by batch » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:39 pm

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by pugix » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:47 pm

Seems like any digital divide by two would work. First pulse on, second pulse off. Am I missing something?
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by ima_jrk » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:48 pm

Tain can be either triggered or gated. Has the bonus of having an adjustable fixed dc voltage normalled to the input when nothing is patched. Acid Rain Switchblade is trigger only and is 3x 2:1

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by XODES » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:54 pm

This can indeed be achieved with a flip-flop as long as it's self-patched as a "divide by two".

Alternatively, a frequency divider should also work, yet the flip flop would allow you to possibly do more conditional patches by feeding another signal to the data input.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by joem » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:53 pm

You can use a voltage controlled switch, like the Doepfer A-150 which has two (or A-151 set to 2 steps) and then put a steady high signal into one of the I/O's and a steady low signal into the other I/O, and take the output from the O/I. On the first clock(/trigger/gate) input, the output will go high, then on the second clock input it'll go low again (repeat as necessary). If you use the A-151 you also have a reset input to set the output back to low, which could be used interestingly.

The benefit to using a switch (even though you need to provide a high and low signal) is that then you can use the switch to switch between other signals (CV, audio, whatever) sometime when you're not using it as a flipflop.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by KSS » Tue Feb 23, 2021 5:57 pm

E-Switch section of a 2600 -or clone- will do it.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by authorless » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:15 pm

A clock divider that does gate outs instead of trigger outs.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by mosorensen » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:20 pm

^ This

Specifically, I use "Integra Solum" for exactly this, but I don't think they make it anymore.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by KSS » Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:49 pm

The cool thing about the 2600's E-SW is that you can put *anything* into the common to be switched. Or vice versa. There's incredible power and opportunity in that!

So for example, one side could be a single gate, and the other a pulse train. Or the level could change if the destination modules respond to triggers-gates differently by level. As in accent function.

The circuit of the 2600's E-SW is a flip flop which then closes one of two FETs acting as analog switches. SPDT operation.

-------------
Edit: I'm fairly certain the Roland 100M had a simlar switch? Might have been the 700?
If 100M, then Behringer's new super inexpensive 100M Euro modules might be a good solution. If 700, then Pharmasonic's 700 DIY euro modules -which I think Synthcube now carries? would be the ticket.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:25 pm

pugix wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:47 pm
Seems like any digital divide by two would work. First pulse on, second pulse off. Am I missing something?
Basically.

But I'm wanting it for audio, and thinking of it being on or off for like 8 measures of a song.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:30 pm

authorless wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:15 pm
A clock divider that does gate outs instead of trigger outs.
Was thinking this, I have a Tempi, but it seems to be "fast" and doesn't divide down low enough...

But also, that would just give me ON/OFF/ON/OFF

I'd like to be able to trigger it - send it the trigger from a sequencer and have it turn on at say, the beginning of a seq and off at the end.... 4 bars later, it triggers on again.

I'm thinking AC, audio on/off.... without having to push buttons. Non-manual style.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:31 pm

ima_jrk wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:48 pm
Tain can be either triggered or gated. Has the bonus of having an adjustable fixed dc voltage normalled to the input when nothing is patched. Acid Rain Switchblade is trigger only and is 3x 2:1
Is it AC coupled?

I should have specified that I'm thinking audio paths = parts in a sequence.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:41 pm

batch wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:38 pm

There are other modules that can do this, Pressure Points + Analog Memory for example, or using something like Matrixchate or other muting capabilities. Matrixchate can change 16 things at a time.
WTF is Matrixahate... didn't see on on MG and google doesn't like it either.

Also,analog memory..? Seems like I've seen this, my my memory is shot. :zombie:

I'm thinking something really basic that maybe doesn't exist like I think it should.

Send trigger to thing > thing opens vca for 27 seconds, or days... until I... > send trigger to thing > thing turns off VCA.

my beautiful riff plays thru the vca while I'm doing things

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by dubonaire » Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:45 pm

I use a Doepfer A-152 Addressed T&H/Switch to do this. It is clockable with a reset input. A trigger advances the output by one. I have the CV coming in to switch input 1, nothing going into input 2 and then the digital out 3 resets to 1. This is a very simple use for the module. More complex CV changes can be made using the CV address function.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:00 pm

dubonaire wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:45 pm
I use a Doepfer A-152 Addressed T&H/Switch to do this. It is clockable with a reset input. A trigger advances the output by one. I have the CV coming in to switch input 1, nothing going into input 2 and then the digital out 3 resets to 1. This is a very simple use for the module. More complex CV changes can be made using the CV address function.
I bet this would work.

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by dubonaire » Tue Feb 23, 2021 9:08 pm

GregIcky wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 8:00 pm
dubonaire wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:45 pm
I use a Doepfer A-152 Addressed T&H/Switch to do this. It is clockable with a reset input. A trigger advances the output by one. I have the CV coming in to switch input 1, nothing going into input 2 and then the digital out 3 resets to 1. This is a very simple use for the module. More complex CV changes can be made using the CV address function.
I bet this would work.
It does work! :tu:

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by authorless » Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:33 pm

GregIcky wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 7:30 pm
authorless wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 6:15 pm
A clock divider that does gate outs instead of trigger outs.
Was thinking this, I have a Tempi, but it seems to be "fast" and doesn't divide down low enough...

But also, that would just give me ON/OFF/ON/OFF

I'd like to be able to trigger it - send it the trigger from a sequencer and have it turn on at say, the beginning of a seq and off at the end.... 4 bars later, it triggers on again.

I'm thinking AC, audio on/off.... without having to push buttons. Non-manual style.
Sorry, I don't know anything about that module. The divide by 2 output of a clock divider that outputs gates instead of triggers does exactly what you are asking. Something like the Doepfer A-160. It is basically a T flip flop ("T" stands for "toggle"). Each successive pulse toggles the output state.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by ATW » Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:49 pm

Voltage applet in ornament & Crime Hemisphere Suite would work. The first gate can turn it on, passing a user defined voltage through, the 2nd sets it back to 0v. Or the reverse where the voltage passes through by default and a gate turns it off.

And the sequential switch flip flop techniques mentioned above would work just as well.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by batch » Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:54 pm

Sorry, I misspelled:

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/sssr-labs ... rixarchate

It’s an 8x16 bidirectional matrix. You can set up particular routings as “parts”, save them as presets and then sequence through them either manually or clocked. If you put a fixed voltage into one of the ins and then use to open a VCA or turn on a switch you can effectively control 16 things. It works, but can be a bit of a pain to set up the presets which also the. Have to be in the right order if you want to sequence them.

Analog Memory is an old Make Noise module which extends Pressure Points to have 8 voltages per step. If you use these voltages to turn things on or off you can have these 8 things define your parts. You can do the same with Tetrapad which is a much smaller and more flexible module, particularly with Tete as you can then sequence the parts in whatever order you want, including repeats (and can build the sequence on the fly).

Beyond this you are getting into using muting modules, or battleship sequencers which can load presets. The Black Sequencer, Westlicht and ER101/2 can all do parts this way (am sure others can, but these are the ones I have).

Hope this helps.
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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by GregIcky » Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:17 am

ATW wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 10:49 pm
Voltage applet in ornament & Crime Hemisphere Suite would work. The first gate can turn it on, passing a user defined voltage through, the 2nd sets it back to 0v. Or the reverse where the voltage passes through by default and a gate turns it off.

And the sequential switch flip flop techniques mentioned above would work just as well.
I've been on the fence about this module. I hear a lot of people swear by it, but I also hear a lot of "I just use it for ____" ....one thing.

Seems like a crazy Swiss army knife of sorts. Does the Hemi firmware retain the original functionality? Is it an easy switch to change out the FW?

How do you like yours?

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Re: Triggering "parts" with....

Post by oliodnb » Wed Feb 24, 2021 10:50 am

GregIcky wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:17 am
I hear a lot of people swear by it, but I also hear a lot of "I just use it for ____" ....one thing.
Hemispheres has a lot of very useful CV tools, I bought several modules to free it up from specific duties.
GregIcky wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:17 am
Does the Hemi firmware retain the original functionality?
Nope.
GregIcky wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:17 am
Is it an easy switch to change out the FW?
Yep!
GregIcky wrote:
Wed Feb 24, 2021 2:17 am
How do you like yours?
I'll definitely get another one.

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