Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

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VatOS
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Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:28 am

Hello all..

Have nearly put together a 9U 84 HP Eurorack setup. There are the essential components of the Behringer ARP 2500, A Moog Subharmonicon, some intriguing voices and effects from MI Tides and Beads, an Optomix for sidechaining (have nearby Volca drum machines that can patch in) and the Function for experimentation. The BARP and the Subharmonicon can be played via a Roland A-01 with a 16 step sequencer and Bitbox Micro can record, layer, and introduce just about any other kind of sound. But I'm sure there are some further utilities that I'm overlooking so these different parts can be play nicely together and maybe do some generative things.

Also, I ordered the Cold Mac because I thought this would pair well with Tides and take it's quad output with room for others. But how much overlap is there between the Cold Mac and the Mutable Instruments Warps?

Have looked at Pam's New Workout, the Disting MK4 and Ornament and Crime etc but I'm worried these multifunction modules would sit there doing nothing unless I knew exactly what they would bring to these other modules. Take a look, and let us hear your thoughts! About 20 HP to play with on one row and 6 beneath.

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/1463240

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kingsmore
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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by kingsmore » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:41 am

VatOS wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:28 am

Also, I ordered the Cold Mac because I thought this would pair well with Tides and take it's quad output with room for others. But how much overlap is there between the Cold Mac and the Mutable Instruments Warps?



https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/1463240
there is no comparable 8hp to the COLD MAC!!! kidding but not really

desolationjones
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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by desolationjones » Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:50 am

Cold Mac is a mixing/panning/analog math tool. It can be used for some "effects" with proper modulation but Warps is 100% for digital effects. They are not really comparable.

My disting sat unused 90% of the time (no patience for the interface/cheat sheets), but Pam found its way into every patch. The clocked modulation is very accessible without needing a deep understanding of the module.

Do you have an outboard mixer or were you hoping to mix in the rack?

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by Agawell » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:06 am

at first glance it appears to be seriously lacking in modulation and utilities - these are the most important things in modular - because they provide control over everything else and prevent stasis (ie getting boring very quickly)

for example - to adequately support just Tides - a large subset of the following is useful - a 4 channel mixer, 4 vcas, 4 envelope generators, at least one modulation source, a multiple - and almost definitely some utilities that can modify the multed modulation source - rectifiers, logic, attenuverters, more vcas, switches etc etc

personally I would steer clear of both the modules that you suggest until you have rectified this situation

you don't need more effects at the moment (warps)

cold mac is "interesting" but I think you would be better off with more modular utilities that can be used with both audio and cv at the same time (II have a feeling this is a constraint on cold mac, either audio or cv not both)
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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:12 am

desolationjones wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 6:50 am
Cold Mac is a mixing/panning/analog math tool. It can be used for some "effects" with proper modulation but Warps is 100% for digital effects. They are not really comparable.

My disting sat unused 90% of the time (no patience for the interface/cheat sheets), but Pam found its way into every patch. The clocked modulation is very accessible without needing a deep understanding of the module.

Do you have an outboard mixer or were you hoping to mix in the rack?
Yes, looking at some demo videos am definitely leaning towards Pams vs the Disting and Ornament and Crime as it looks more accessible, and I don't think the Volca Mix can serve as a master clock, but maybe Pam's can slave to it and then distribute multiple outs? Have a couple of outboard mixing solutions so that's why I'm looking at Modules that blend a couple signals in interesting ways and send them on rather than have a large mixer module, so, tossing up between the Warps (which not only has to stand out from the Cold Mac but also the Beads / Tides as a effects module) and also a Moddemix for example.

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Wed Apr 07, 2021 10:16 am

As an update, I've just learned about Intellijel's Shifty and I think that Note Hocketing offers the missing utility link I was looking for. I'll leave Pamela's New Workout and Warps until last, if anyone can suggest an interesting alternative for this last 20 HP let me know!

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:03 pm

Agawell wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 7:06 am
you don't need more effects at the moment (warps)

cold mac is "interesting" but I think you would be better off with more modular utilities that can be used with both audio and cv at the same time (II have a feeling this is a constraint on cold mac, either audio or cv not both)
Already have the Cold Mac on the way, basic six input mixing as well as panning and crossfading is just what I'm after.

But it might be a good idea to opt for the Intellijel Quad VCA instead of Warps, we'll see how the 1006 Filtamp fares as a VCA first.

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by starthief » Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:39 pm

You can use both Cold Mac and Warps as VCAs if they're not busy doing something else.

VatOS
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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:10 pm

starthief wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 1:39 pm
You can use both Cold Mac and Warps as VCAs if they're not busy doing something else.
Didn't know Warps could also do that, very cool! :hihi:

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Agawell
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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by Agawell » Wed Apr 07, 2021 2:37 pm

I would wait and see what you need - keep sticking money in a piggy bank - sooner or later the next case will be on the horizon!
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Utility modules are the inexpensive, dull polish that makes the expensive, shiny modules actually shine!!!

an oscillator is an oscillator - utilities are possibilities

choose the case to fit the modules - not the modules to fit the case!!!

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by jbiggerovski » Wed Apr 07, 2021 4:54 pm

I couldn’t live without Pamela’s New Workout, especially with the expander. I use it for drums, melodies, modulation, and so on. So easy to learn, too.

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by SavageMessiah » Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:48 pm

Warps is great for producing weird timbres from vanilla oscillators. If TZFM, ring mod, wave folding, or any of the other things it can do make sounds you like, grab it, it's great and the 6hp clones don't really sacrifice any usability unlike a lot of the micro mutable stuff. It seems to be AC coupled so it doesn't really do anything for CV.

Cold Mac is really useful for both audio and CV. Make sure to read the technical map. It's more straightforward than most people make it out to be. You can use all the individual blocks separately. You can use individual pieces to shape CV deliberately with rectification, logic, etc, or you can stick CV into survey and get a little bit of everything. The rectification, logic, crease, and crossfading are all useful for audio as well.

I'll second the recommendation for Pam's. I use it in every patch that has a clock. Ornament and Crime is much better with the Hemispheres firmware, IMO. It's very accessible - almost all the applets have really straightforward functions, there's no menu diving unless you mess around with some of the larger apps, and there's some built in help. It covers a ton of ground. If you're dead set on hocketing, shifty is great, but O_C with hemispheres is way more useful in general. The Intellijel Quad VCA is a solid workhorse, it'll probably cover your VCA needs for a long time.

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by VatOS » Thu Apr 08, 2021 8:29 am

SavageMessiah wrote:
Wed Apr 07, 2021 5:48 pm
Warps is great for producing weird timbres from vanilla oscillators. If TZFM, ring mod, wave folding, or any of the other things it can do make sounds you like, grab it, it's great and the 6hp clones don't really sacrifice any usability unlike a lot of the micro mutable stuff. It seems to be AC coupled so it doesn't really do anything for CV.

Cold Mac is really useful for both audio and CV. Make sure to read the technical map. It's more straightforward than most people make it out to be. You can use all the individual blocks separately. You can use individual pieces to shape CV deliberately with rectification, logic, etc, or you can stick CV into survey and get a little bit of everything. The rectification, logic, crease, and crossfading are all useful for audio as well.

I'll second the recommendation for Pam's. I use it in every patch that has a clock. Ornament and Crime is much better with the Hemispheres firmware, IMO. It's very accessible - almost all the applets have really straightforward functions, there's no menu diving unless you mess around with some of the larger apps, and there's some built in help. It covers a ton of ground. If you're dead set on hocketing, shifty is great, but O_C with hemispheres is way more useful in general. The Intellijel Quad VCA is a solid workhorse, it'll probably cover your VCA needs for a long time.
Appreciate your insight. Adding Shifty has helped me work out what else is missing or isn't.. For example, it can send CV and Gate to the Subharmonicon, which has it's own VCA and envelope capability, as does the BARP & the Bitbox Micro while Tides can be a fourth voice and can be tamed by the Cold Mac. Given all that, don't think the Quad VCA is needed. But certainly as someone else here has pointed out, a little utility and on rack mixing capability is lacking so I think the Xaoc Warna II helps out as does a Make Noise Moddemix.

But yes, I think you've done a great job describing the case for Warps which is why I'll give it up - Tides does wave folding, The BARP has a ring mod, the Moddemix blends inputs and attenuates them for new timbres, and there is a pedal effects chain as well as Beads for texture. The Ornament and crime might be the first thing that goes in a tiny auxillary rack :lol:

The last choice I have to make is the Pamela's New Workout and Make Noise Function vs the upcoming 1036 module, want to see some demos before adopting the vintage approach to the master clock and sample and hold: https://www.behringer.com/product.html ... ode=P0E93

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Re: Seeking feedback! What's missing, also Warps vs Cold Mac

Post by SavageMessiah » Thu Apr 08, 2021 1:36 pm

You might also consider the Joranalogue Contour 1 instead of Function. It can do everything function can do and more. Great module.

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