E102 Temporal Shifter - Expander Module

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JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:09 pm

Paranormal Patroler wrote:
JohnLRice wrote:Sounds like a cool idea Paranormal Patroler :sb: although I'd be happy to a least get the first version of the E103 because I've been saving a space for it in my case since the exapnder was originally proposed 2.5 years ago! :cry:
You should totally give it a shot. I use a switch before the input to be able to swap the incoming CV and as soon as the other voices start "looping" for a bit, I switch to manual CV control and start a solo voice over them using voice 1 (for as long as I can).

It sounds marvelous!

Would be great if I could keep it going for longer. Let alone being able to swap between these things (loop modes, flow) would make the whole thing far more playable. I won't even go ahead and mention how nice it'll be to swap the incoming sequence (transpose?) while voices 2-4 loop on, and then play with the Delay ...
I had tried some basic looping early on but was disappointed that the voltage was sagging (or rising?) with each loop.

Now . . . :domodance: TWO E102 :domodance: modules with a greatly expanded mega E103 between them would be increadible, yes? :hyper: 8-)

I'm wondering . . and maybe I asked this before but the answer was "no" and I've forgotten but . . . is it possible to DIY a switch to the E102's header to activate looping? Paul, what say you? :hyper:

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:17 pm

After looking at the expander panel again after a year or so the above suggestion makes even more sense. Use the second switch to determine which voice gets feedback from output 4: 1, 2, or 3?

That way you have these options:

a) all four voices loop
b) 1 feeds off CV input while 2-4 loop
c) 1 feeds off CV input, 2 feeds off output 1, while 3-4 loop

Personally I'm not interested in the lights, I'd love to see more interesting options* instead but I'm hoping at least the above is doable and interesting for others. It gives us the extra functionality of having 2 X two-voice Shift Registers, in a sense.



*
- knob for swapping the series of the outputs
- I've actually found a nice solution for the trigger-per-output request. Since the E102 gives us the option of quantized notes, the expander could fire a gate whenever each output would hit a 12-tet note in 1V/oct series. Makes sense, no?
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Post by JohnLRice » Mon Mar 20, 2017 7:55 pm

I'm guessing that all of these selective looping features are not going to be possible with the current design of the E102 and what might be feasible for the E103 but got the sake of discussion . . . :hihi:

I have a little Xaoc Devices Tirana sequencer in my case and one of the nice features is that each step can be repeated 2, 3 or 4 times (or not repeated). The way that these repeats are selected is to hold down the gate on/off LED switch (for the step you want to change) for 3 seconds and then press the button for the step that relates to how many repeats you want. It works pretty slick and takes no extra panel real estate.

Image

Getting back to the E103, if the proposed LEDs were turned into LED buttons, a similar thing could be done (in yours and mine fantasy world :hihi: ) where you'd hold down a button to put the stage into 'loop source select mode' and then press the button of the desired source.

Unfortunately . . . with the recent mega successful 1/4 million $$$ Kickstarter for the E370 :party: :party: :party: I fear that us handful of E102 fans clamoring for a low profit margin expander module will continue to be in a holding pattern over a cold back burner. :cry: :cry: :cry: :cry:

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Post by VortexRanger » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:02 am

Haha, it's the same three people every time this thread gets bumped. I'm happy to be one of them though :) The E102 will never leave my rack.
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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:15 am

:oops: Guilty as charged. Sorry for the selfish bump you guys, but I really :love: this module and I remember Paul saying he always wanted to make it, so I'm hoping he has a soft spot for it, even though it hasn't been a huge seller.

I'm unsure that is the case, but I would love to have the extra functionality on the expander to give it a sort of comeback if it's indeed a sleeper among wigglers. Life has been crazy lately but if the expander ever surfaces I promise to make demos of the functionality and improve the manual; I have a far better grasp of what is going on after using it extensively and I think it's one of the best modules in Eurorack. I owe it to Paul to say the least!

It's not easy to express it, but I really believe my suggestions would make it even more playable. The E102 really begs you to mess with it and that's why it occupies one of the center roles in my live setup: four sequences are combined into one longer sequence, and then the E102 takes it and repurposes it to four voices.
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Post by JohnLRice » Tue Mar 21, 2017 7:19 am

With all the people buying E370's you'd think most of them would want at least one E102 and E103 to drive it? :party: :goo: :sb:

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Sun Mar 26, 2017 6:04 pm

Come on paults throw us a bone here. Is any of the above suggestions possible ?!? :hyper:
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Post by JohnLRice » Wed May 03, 2017 10:43 am

Hey! I just had a thought . . . you know what would be really useful to have on the E103 expander? A divided clock output that matches the delay time! :hyper: :hyper: :hyper: That way we wouldn't need to use an external clock divider and try to match it up to the E102 delay times, which gets harder and harder the longer the delay time is. If we had this feature it would make it very simple to fire all voices at once only after a shift/update has occurred.

:hmm: Or . . .did someone suggest this already and I forgot? :oops:

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed May 03, 2017 11:01 am

I wanted to bump this thread just in case Paul gives us some news and feedback on the ideas we've had so far. Glad you posted instead!

I'm not sure I follow what you're saying though. I get the premise but not sure how a divided clock originating from the delay time would occur.

It's a good idea though, but even regarding my own loop suggestion, I'm unsure whether these are all doable since the E102 already has that expander plug in place; is this all down to software? Is Paul still interested in making a E103? To whom should I pray?
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Post by JohnLRice » Wed May 03, 2017 11:08 am

Paranormal Patroler wrote:I'm not sure I follow what you're saying though. I get the premise but not sure how a divided clock originating from the delay time would occur.
Only Paul and Eric can tell us for sure if it's possible or not but it seems to me the clock divisions must already be taking place somewhere inside the E102 already, at least in the software, but there might not be a way to "pipe it out" and buffer it etc so that it could be used at modular gate levels?

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed May 03, 2017 11:26 am

JohnLRice wrote:
Paranormal Patroler wrote:I'm not sure I follow what you're saying though. I get the premise but not sure how a divided clock originating from the delay time would occur.
Only Paul and Eric can tell us for sure if it's possible or not but it seems to me the clock divisions must already be taking place somewhere inside the E102 already, at least in the software, but there might not be a way to "pipe it out" and buffer it etc so that it could be used at modular gate levels?
Divisions? I don't think there's any division happening. You can control the rate at which the "S&H" happens, either by using the internal clock or the clock input for external clock.

When using the Delay value what you're doing is adding steps in between when the S&H gets output. The clock ticks are there already, remember that each switch position has a certain amount of clock ticks available, you're not actually dividing the clock down, it's just a matter of when the value is being output.

You ought to try the comparator trick to get notes fired irregardless of clock. I really think a sister module which fires gates whenever a 12tet note is reached would pair well with the E102. Four inputs, four outputs at 4HP.
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Post by JohnLRice » Wed May 03, 2017 3:41 pm

:roll:

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed May 03, 2017 3:54 pm

JohnLRice wrote::roll:
I'm not explaining it correctly, I apologize, I'll come back to it as soon as possible.
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Post by JohnLRice » Wed May 03, 2017 4:20 pm

Paranormal Patroler wrote:
JohnLRice wrote::roll:
I'm not explaining it correctly, I apologize, I'll come back to it as soon as possible.
Sorry for the crankiness! :ripbanana: Stayed up too late, then only slept 3 hours then stayed up 3 hours then slept another 6 hours in a room that got too hot and finally woke up because I couldn't stand the frustrating dreams I was having :zombie: and the first thing I read is your post. :ripbanana: I need to let myself chill out and get some food first before I hop on the interwebs! :zen: :chug:

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed May 03, 2017 4:28 pm

It was a fair eye-roll, I can see how one can consider the above a Division of clock but I'll try to word it out in a better way, to see if we can come to a conclusion.

In the meantime: bon appetite!
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Post by JohnLRice » Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:45 pm

:bump: Squeaky wheels be needing some grease! :bump:

Any forward movement on the E103, Paul? :hmm:

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Post by paults » Tue Jun 06, 2017 9:58 pm

I need stuff to do in 2018. This will be one of those things.

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:16 am

Any chance you can give us some hints on the features or are those still up in the air?
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Post by JohnLRice » Wed Jun 07, 2017 2:55 am

Paranormal Patroler wrote:Any chance you can give us some hints on the features or are those still up in the air?
And/or a description of what the pins are for on the expansion header? :nod: You know some of us love to tinker with stuff . . . .

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Post by Jumbuktu » Wed Jun 07, 2017 4:15 am

paults wrote:I need stuff to do in 2018. This will be one of those things.
... And the voltage controlled vacuum cleaner?

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Jun 07, 2017 7:15 am

JohnLRice wrote:
Paranormal Patroler wrote:Any chance you can give us some hints on the features or are those still up in the air?
And/or a description of what the pins are for on the expansion header? :nod: You know some of us love to tinker with stuff . . . .
I will second this.
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Post by sduck » Wed Jun 07, 2017 11:06 am

paults wrote:I need stuff to do in 2018. This will be one of those things.
MOTM 600 (cough)

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JohnLRice

Post by JohnLRice » Tue Jun 13, 2017 10:09 am

OK, I did a bit of rearranging to my briefcase modular and it now has a space reserved again for a 4 hp E103. :party: Of course a 2 hp E103 would be perfectly fine and if it turns out to be 6 hp I could take out the mult and make it work if I have too. Of course, this is all subject to change depending on how long it takes the E103 to materialize, what new wonders someone comes up with in the meantime, and how strong I can stay with commitment to stabilizing this system and not changing it again.
:zen: :lol: :picard: :roll: :zen:

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Post by peripatitis » Wed Jun 14, 2017 4:58 am

you could just get a teletype instead you know and get all tha programmed pretty easily i might add..:)

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Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Jun 14, 2017 6:11 pm

I will have to DIY the uZeus power and move it to the side of the case to make space for a 4HP E103 version. Would love a 2HP version with just switches / jack inputs that do crazy stuff ...
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