4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

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klacke
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Post by klacke » Wed Sep 26, 2018 10:14 am

th0mas wrote:
klacke wrote:Contemplating if I should get a SMR or not?
:despair:
Does anyone know how it compares to Random Source Serge Res EQ?
Is 4ms still developing updates for SMR?
I owned an SMR before, have the Res EQ now.

I never got *really* into the SMR too deeply, my patches with it were always relatively pedestrian, but some differences I'd mention off the top of my head:
- Res EQ does not have many CV inputs for control.
- Res EQ does not change it's frequencies, so no eerie shifting chord patterns
- Res EQ with high feedback usually converges on one frequency, not a chord of frequencies, since the whole module is being fed back, not each channel individually and then mixed (as it is with the SMR)
- Because of that (global feedback not per-channel feedback) Res EQ "breaks down" in more interesting ways than the SMR, when pushed, in my opinion. Never tried externally feeding the SMR back into itself, maybe it can do similar things in that configuration.

SMR has a lot of other secondary features and modes like envelope follower, quantizer, all sorts of ins and outs. Serge EQ does not.
Thanks Th0mas.
So is it fair to say that for you the Serge EQ is more interesting and that you dont miss SMR?
I had an Serge for one day (was broken so I returned it to the seller) and from what I saw and heard I liked it a lot. Missing Cv controll a bit.
Where I live I dont have any store where I can try modules do I have to make up my mind based on what I find on the net

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th0mas
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Post by th0mas » Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:31 pm

klacke wrote: Thanks Th0mas.
So is it fair to say that for you the Serge EQ is more interesting and that you dont miss SMR?
I had an Serge for one day (was broken so I returned it to the seller) and from what I saw and heard I liked it a lot. Missing Cv controll a bit.
Where I live I dont have any store where I can try modules do I have to make up my mind based on what I find on the net
They sound very very different, and you patch them pretty differently too, so I wouldn't directly compare them (despite me giving you a list of differences in a comparison fashion, lol oops :) ). I owned the SMR very early in my modular career and didn't use it past the wavey chords.

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brandonlogic
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Post by brandonlogic » Wed Sep 26, 2018 4:48 pm

watch some SMR and Res EQ demos... get the one you like better. there's not much that's similar about them.

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Post by pelang » Thu Sep 27, 2018 9:05 am

i own both. SMR demos have lots of resonance. (i use mine in "V4 mode") using little or no resonance, the sound goes then more direction ResEQ. As an instrument, i like the ResEQ better, as overtime, i know what it is doing.
SMR with its many functions needs time to go beyond the usual SMR sound.(which i found not so interesting) I think of the SMR more like a precision tool, ResEQ = electric guitar

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captjrab
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Post by captjrab » Thu Sep 27, 2018 10:36 am


SMR -> Modemix with some outboard delay and vibrato from the Malekko Echo. “In a Silent Way” kinda vibe.

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novim
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Post by novim » Thu Mar 14, 2019 7:15 pm

Looking for a bit of help. I picked up an SMR a few months ago, and I'm still getting familiar with it, but I find the output to be extremely quiet. With every band at full resonance it's still much quieter than any of my oscillators. Anything more subtle (i.e. normal usage for me) requires every other element of the mix to be heavily attenuated in order for the SMR to be audible enough, which can lead to extremely quiet recordings. Alternatively, I end up using two channels of the Intellijel Quad VCA to boost it twice over, which isn't ideal.

A quick test:
Doing a sweep with my Dixie and observing on a cheap scope I see that it outputs at equal power across the frequency spectrum. Observing the SMR, levels of the upper frequency bands taper down quickly, to about half the level the of lows and mids.

Another test:
With both the Dixie and SMR outputting a 2Khz sine wave through the VCA, they are at equal volume when the SMR channel's level is set to full (no boost) while the Dixie's is only at about 7:30 (i.e. barely turned up at all). At 440Hz, equal volume occurs when the SMR is at full and the Dixie is at about 9:30.

I've seen a few users mentioning low output from the SMR, but not much insight into exactly what's going on, how people work around it, or whether there's a solution internal to the module. Is boosting the only option? If so, what are you using?

Thanks.

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Post by dooj88 » Fri Mar 15, 2019 8:03 am

captjrab wrote:
SMR -> Modemix with some outboard delay and vibrato from the Malekko Echo. “In a Silent Way” kinda vibe.
that's really nice man. were you using an lfo to get that vibrato effect? it's been a while since i owned one but i can't remember ever doing that. sounds good.

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captjrab
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Post by captjrab » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:07 pm

dooj88 wrote:
captjrab wrote:
SMR -> Modemix with some outboard delay and vibrato from the Malekko Echo. “In a Silent Way” kinda vibe.
that's really nice man. were you using an lfo to get that vibrato effect? it's been a while since i owned one but i can't remember ever doing that. sounds good.
Thanks @dooj88 the vibrato is comming from the Malekko Echo guitar pedal. I should try the lfo -> freq in someday. Ive owned this module for a few years now and am still trying new things out. Never messed with the Freq ins so far.[/b]

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captjrab
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Post by captjrab » Fri Mar 15, 2019 6:21 pm

novim wrote:Looking for a bit of help. I picked up an SMR a few months ago, and I'm still getting familiar with it, but I find the output to be extremely quiet. With every band at full resonance it's still much quieter than any of my oscillators. Anything more subtle (i.e. normal usage for me) requires every other element of the mix to be heavily attenuated in order for the SMR to be audible enough, which can lead to extremely quiet recordings. Alternatively, I end up using two channels of the Intellijel Quad VCA to boost it twice over, which isn't ideal.

A quick test:
Doing a sweep with my Dixie and observing on a cheap scope I see that it outputs at equal power across the frequency spectrum. Observing the SMR, levels of the upper frequency bands taper down quickly, to about half the level the of lows and mids.

Another test:
With both the Dixie and SMR outputting a 2Khz sine wave through the VCA, they are at equal volume when the SMR channel's level is set to full (no boost) while the Dixie's is only at about 7:30 (i.e. barely turned up at all). At 440Hz, equal volume occurs when the SMR is at full and the Dixie is at about 9:30.

I've seen a few users mentioning low output from the SMR, but not much insight into exactly what's going on, how people work around it, or whether there's a solution internal to the module. Is boosting the only option? If so, what are you using?

Thanks.
Try using the built-in noise generator rather than plugging a VCO or anything else in to it. I’m no expert, but it seems like it is filtering out the volume until you hit a sweet spot, then BAM there goes your speakers and ears. I havent had much luck using the SMR as an actual filter, but I’ve gotten a lot of milage out of it as a sound source and 6X sequencer/quantiser, so if you are stuck on something, maybe move on into some new territory with it.
Make sure you have the latesest firmware so you can get full resonance out of it. If u cant get a good signal out of it and feel like it’s faulty, message 4MS for some trouble shooting tips.

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novim
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Post by novim » Fri Mar 15, 2019 9:39 pm

Thanks, captjrab. I actually use the built-in noise almost exclusively. I guess, in part at least, I'm just gravitating toward sounds that happen to be in the quieter zones of a module with a really wide dynamic range. Checking on the scope was instructive.

On another thread about boosting quiet sources, someone suggested using MT Ears. It hadn't occurred to me, but it really does the job, in a pinch anyway.

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Post by Phase47 » Sat Apr 27, 2019 12:58 pm

Question on this, and all apologies if it's covered somewhere earlier in the thread, but how does the SMR fare as a sequencer for VCOs external to the module? I've got Marbles, but it's a bit fiddly for my use case. Just wondering how the SMR would compare as a sequencer to others. Anybody have any thoughts?

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Post by cptnal » Sat Apr 27, 2019 2:10 pm

Phase47 wrote:Question on this, and all apologies if it's covered somewhere earlier in the thread, but how does the SMR fare as a sequencer for VCOs external to the module? I've got Marbles, but it's a bit fiddly for my use case. Just wondering how the SMR would compare as a sequencer to others. Anybody have any thoughts?
It does have a large bank of interesting scales but it may be overkill just for this job. You could certainly have up to six v/o outs, but to get anything resembling a sequence you'd have to hit rotate with rhythmic, predictable CV. With a sequencer in other words. If that's your end goal then you'd probably be better off with a programmable quantizer, or a quantizable sequencer (like René). If it shines in this department it's in getting six tones out for one CV in.

On the other hand the SMR does have a ton of other uses... :cloud:

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Phase47
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Post by Phase47 » Sat Apr 27, 2019 3:16 pm

cptnal wrote:
Phase47 wrote:Question on this, and all apologies if it's covered somewhere earlier in the thread, but how does the SMR fare as a sequencer for VCOs external to the module? I've got Marbles, but it's a bit fiddly for my use case. Just wondering how the SMR would compare as a sequencer to others. Anybody have any thoughts?
It does have a large bank of interesting scales but it may be overkill just for this job. You could certainly have up to six v/o outs, but to get anything resembling a sequence you'd have to hit rotate with rhythmic, predictable CV. With a sequencer in other words. If that's your end goal then you'd probably be better off with a programmable quantizer, or a quantizable sequencer (like René). If it shines in this department it's in getting six tones out for one CV in.

On the other hand the SMR does have a ton of other uses... :cloud:
Cheers for that!

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Post by laneo » Tue Jul 16, 2019 7:23 pm

From the manual: "Notice that the SMR will be struck on both the rising and falling edge of a gate, so two sounds will be heard for every gate. Triggers will cause only one sound since the rising and falling edges are very close together."

Is there any way to make the gates act like triggers?
I mean, when I send gates from my cirklon I don´t want to trigger at rise AND fall.

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tomnicholson
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Post by tomnicholson » Wed Jul 17, 2019 2:26 am

You could send the gate to an envelope generator and send that to the SMR. A fast AD envelope should do it, or one with a fast attack and slow release.

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Post by laneo » Wed Jul 17, 2019 6:52 am

I´m currently sending an envelope straight from one of the cv outs of cirklon. That works, but i was hoping that there was a hidden system setting that let me use a gate.

Thanks for your suggestion!

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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Wed May 27, 2020 3:59 pm

So I have recently become interested in the SMR. A lot of the videos I see of it in use appear to suffer from drone syndrome in that many are six layered shifting sine waves. They are wonderful and beautiful and shimmery, but I am interested to see some other sounds that this thing can make. Show me.
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:19 pm

Okay, well anyone use this module primarily for percussive duties? It seems like it would make decent, pitched, two channel LPG type of device, yeah?
Gear List: Elektron Octatrack, Elektron A4,Microbrute, Bass Station, Rings Braids, Pitts Ring Mod, Pitts Osc, Echophon, Intillegel uFold / uMIDI, PNW2, Doepfer 138-c, 119, Tiptop Z4000, Maleko Fade / 8NU8R

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xcc
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by xcc » Wed Jun 10, 2020 12:51 pm

r05c03 wrote:
Mon Jun 08, 2020 12:19 pm
Okay, well anyone use this module primarily for percussive duties? It seems like it would make decent, pitched, two channel LPG type of device, yeah?
I’ll second this request. I have one on the way, and I’m very interested in its percussive skills.

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r05c03
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:42 am

And, so I love the colors of the LEDs. The difference however between them, when selecting banks, seems to be a bit subjective. Also, they seem to not be in the same order as the presented in the manual. Also, what if your are color blind? I would love to go through each in an orderly fashion referencing the manual. It does not seem possible.
Gear List: Elektron Octatrack, Elektron A4,Microbrute, Bass Station, Rings Braids, Pitts Ring Mod, Pitts Osc, Echophon, Intillegel uFold / uMIDI, PNW2, Doepfer 138-c, 119, Tiptop Z4000, Maleko Fade / 8NU8R

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r05c03
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:03 pm

Nothing?
Gear List: Elektron Octatrack, Elektron A4,Microbrute, Bass Station, Rings Braids, Pitts Ring Mod, Pitts Osc, Echophon, Intillegel uFold / uMIDI, PNW2, Doepfer 138-c, 119, Tiptop Z4000, Maleko Fade / 8NU8R

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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by jwise » Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:26 pm

You do realize that it's Sunday right and that most businesses are closed Saturday and Sunday?

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r05c03
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Sun Jun 21, 2020 7:47 pm

Discussion boards too? At any rate, figured it out myself.
Gear List: Elektron Octatrack, Elektron A4,Microbrute, Bass Station, Rings Braids, Pitts Ring Mod, Pitts Osc, Echophon, Intillegel uFold / uMIDI, PNW2, Doepfer 138-c, 119, Tiptop Z4000, Maleko Fade / 8NU8R

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xcc
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by xcc » Sun Jun 21, 2020 11:08 pm

r05c03 wrote:
Sun Jun 21, 2020 10:42 am
And, so I love the colors of the LEDs. The difference however between them, when selecting banks, seems to be a bit subjective. Also, they seem to not be in the same order as the presented in the manual. Also, what if your are color blind? I would love to go through each in an orderly fashion referencing the manual. It does not seem possible.
The colors can be tricky, especially with so many. If you go into system mode you can create a custom color scheme that might help you(in the back of the manual).

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r05c03
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Re: 4ms SMRF: Spectral Multiband Resonant Filter

Post by r05c03 » Mon Jun 22, 2020 6:35 am

Hey, thanks. The main thing was I had not realized that the order and color of the scale banks had changed in v5. I was referencing an older manual.
Gear List: Elektron Octatrack, Elektron A4,Microbrute, Bass Station, Rings Braids, Pitts Ring Mod, Pitts Osc, Echophon, Intillegel uFold / uMIDI, PNW2, Doepfer 138-c, 119, Tiptop Z4000, Maleko Fade / 8NU8R

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