Why no Eurorack piano module?

Cwejman, Livewire, TipTop Audio, Doepfer etc... Get your euro on!

Moderators: Kent, Joe., luketeaford, lisa

williamjturkel
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 266
Joined: Thu Jul 06, 2017 10:50 am
Location: London, Ontario, Canada

Why no Eurorack piano module?

Post by williamjturkel » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:08 am

Given the availability of modules like Rings and Plonk, I’m wondering why there isn’t something like a CV-controllable Pianoteq. I can think of a few possible reasons: lack of processing power, lack of perceived interest, etc. Interested to hear opinions on this.

Jefro
Common Wiggler
Posts: 194
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:02 pm
Location: Denver

Post by Jefro » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:25 am

My personal opinion, and I realize that maybe not everyone shares it, is that I don't want anything that sounds like a traditional instrument in my modular. The single exception is sample playback and manipulation.

User avatar
mazzyboy
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 397
Joined: Tue Nov 03, 2015 10:55 am

Post by mazzyboy » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:25 am

I think expert sleepers general cv has a couple of piano settings

User avatar
DruidTek
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 496
Joined: Thu Apr 07, 2011 7:06 am
Contact:

Post by DruidTek » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:28 am

You'd get a better result with samples imo

User avatar
Richie Jape
Common Wiggler
Posts: 166
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:03 am

Post by Richie Jape » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:36 am

manipulation of specific acoustic instruments like a piano works best in my experience if i sample for the piece i am working on and then use the morphagene to incorporate it into the piece ...

recently, not having access to a real piano i've been getting some very good results from using spectrasonics keyscape for this purpose ... sampling to tape and using the files from there ...

like someone mentioned above i see my modular as something different and new and non-traditional

diffrent strokes and all tho :tu:

User avatar
geremyf
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 1213
Joined: Thu Mar 26, 2015 2:01 pm
Location: Boston

Post by geremyf » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:41 am

The Orthogonal Devices ER-301 has a very nice Piano custom unit. It was developed by Kel, and is called Piano16. Here is a link to some information:

https://forum.orthogonaldevices.com/t/p ... m-unit/375

User avatar
cptnal
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 4005
Joined: Wed Jun 14, 2017 2:48 am
Location: People's Republic of Scotland

Post by cptnal » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:44 am

That's what pianos are for.

(Joking - don't have an opinion one way or another.)
Is it finished?
Latest Tune:
Sounds: SoundCloud , Freesound
Racks: Big Case, Top Row, Funboat, Tinicase

User avatar
Richie Jape
Common Wiggler
Posts: 166
Joined: Mon Jan 04, 2016 5:03 am

Post by Richie Jape » Wed Apr 18, 2018 8:51 am

geremyf wrote:The Orthogonal Devices ER-301 has a very nice Piano custom unit. It was developed by Kel, and is called Piano16. Here is a link to some information:

https://forum.orthogonaldevices.com/t/p ... m-unit/375
that is super cool !

User avatar
subdo
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 419
Joined: Sat Nov 28, 2015 8:03 am
Location: Washington DC
Contact:

Post by subdo » Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:27 am

For one thing polyphony is not really modular's strong point and a monophonic piano is kinda :despair:

User avatar
Azarius
Common Wiggler
Posts: 125
Joined: Sun Oct 02, 2016 10:53 am
Location: Las Vegas

Post by Azarius » Wed Apr 18, 2018 9:56 am

Emulating a piano sound would be better via a dedicated keyboard or sample library imo since the sample size needed to store authentic sounding 88 notes with varying articulation / velocity layers would be problematic in a module. For example, Synthogy Ivory is about 49 gigs with 20 velocity layers per key and sounds amazing. This may be overkill for many use cases, but for $189 I’m sure it would be way cheaper than any comparable Eurorack module.

Jefro
Common Wiggler
Posts: 194
Joined: Fri Jun 02, 2017 7:02 pm
Location: Denver

Post by Jefro » Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:10 am

Maybe you could put a sample library such as the one mentioned above on an SD card for a Radio Music module. They're pretty cheap. You would need multiple Radio Musics for polyphony though.

User avatar
boramx
lepidopteran orgasm
Posts: 2167
Joined: Sat Mar 20, 2010 12:02 pm
Location: Infant Island

Post by boramx » Wed Apr 18, 2018 10:21 am

a192 or a192-2 and Disklavier.

swap the sheet music for sampled white noise, swap the punching machine for the a192 and swap the cigarette holder for a krazy straw going down into some Sujeong Qwa and I'm good.
Image

User avatar
D_Robot
Common Wiggler
Posts: 161
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:58 am

Post by D_Robot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:03 am

When I started modular I spent many hours trying to emulate real world instruments patching with the modules I had. Not to make them sound real but to use the principle to make interesting sounds that reflect a little of the essence of these instruments.

I view modules like Rings and Plonk as single modules, of what I was trying to achieve with many modules, and used more as ways of abusing physical modelling synthesis rather than necessarily trying to accurately emulate real world instruments. As others have said to best replicate instruments it is probably better done with a real instrument or a sampler. I think that was the general conclusion of the Sound on Sound Synth Secrets series for most instruments including piano:Synthesizing Piano

Therefore, with piano I prefer to play directly into the modular and sample rather than try to emulate. The two main reasons are the performance aspect of tinkling the ivories but also polyphony.

Knights Who Say Neve
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 300
Joined: Fri Mar 02, 2012 1:25 am

Post by Knights Who Say Neve » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:55 am

Agree that a proper sampled piano in Euro is impractical.

But, the Korg Z1 had some nice physical models of electric pianos. Not ultra-realistic, but very responsive and tweak-able. I'd love to see something like those in a modular.
Space and time contain a manifold of pure a priori intuition, but at the same time are conditions of the receptivity of our mind- conditions under which alone it can receive representations of other objects, and which therefore must also always affect the concept of these objects. But if this manifold is to be known, the spontaneity of our thought requires that it be gone thorough in a certain way, taken up and connected. This act I name synthesis. -Kant

User avatar
pzoot
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 377
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:48 pm

Post by pzoot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 11:56 am

If there was a semi-decent one, I’d be surprised if they sold a dozen. That’s probably the simplest answer for why there isn’t one. You could always try a CV to MIDI module and modulate pianoreq parameters if it interests you

User avatar
Funky40
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 6039
Joined: Mon Nov 17, 2008 7:08 pm
Location: on a big voyage

Post by Funky40 » Wed Apr 18, 2018 12:42 pm

pzoot wrote:If there was a semi-decent one, I’d be surprised if they sold a dozen. That’s probably the simplest answer for why there isn’t one.
THIS
pzoot wrote: You could always try a CV to MIDI module and modulate pianoreq parameters if it interests you
and this !
myself a Pianoteq player and fan. (expecting you meant Pianoteq )



I disagree on the " a one voice Piano would not be interesting" !
Pianoteq seems to work on those mini PC platforms.
A 4 voice moduel or so seems doable in regards to CPU questions.
just whoever wants to manufacture a module needs to calculate in some numbers............
I´d do some CV2midi
( i had sometimes my Digitakt sequenze my pianoteq by accident .....in monophonic. works ! can sound really cool )

User avatar
pzoot
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 377
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:48 pm

Post by pzoot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:11 pm

Yes!! Pianoteq! :hihi:

I too am a user and fan, and I too have used it monophonically (eg with Numerology). Electric piano and clav works well too. I also have Chromophone - Plonk is perhaps a good example of what a Pianoteq like module could theoretically be like vs a software version

I actually don’t have a CV2Midi device to try that suggestion out :) but the OP (if actually interested in this as a technique and not just curious about module production) could also try in-DAW LFO and sequenced modulators on Pianoteq depending on the DAW (eg Max4Live or Bitwig devices, or Numerology, or Reaktor Blocks) to get a sense for what it would be like.

User avatar
strangegravity
A Big Knob
Posts: 1660
Joined: Thu May 21, 2015 12:01 pm
Location: Cincinnati

Post by strangegravity » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:38 pm

Image

User avatar
pzoot
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 377
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:48 pm

Post by pzoot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:44 pm

Nice!! A 5-key velocity sensitive keyboard. You just don’t see enough of those around :yay:

User avatar
Paranormal Patroler
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 11121
Joined: Tue Aug 30, 2011 3:40 pm
Location: the Terminal beach

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Wed Apr 18, 2018 1:51 pm

Funny you should mention it. I'm preparing a dedicated piano 6u case, after experimenting with the premise for years. Got a record in mind I've meaning to make; have a few etudes already but I'm not there yet.

I would buy a physical modeling piano module in a heart beat. I make do with CV to Midi (a-192-2, ADDAC 222) and physical modeling sounds which I work on my own. Lots of ground to experiment.
All rights reserved; all wrongs reversed.

User avatar
D_Robot
Common Wiggler
Posts: 161
Joined: Sun Jun 02, 2013 9:58 am

Post by D_Robot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:11 pm

Just looked at Pianoteq, having not used it before, and now I'm thinking that in module form it could be quite interesting. Forget polyphony, with CV over a range of parameters it would be more like live tweaking a prepared piano...I might be one of the twelve.

User avatar
thebrotherspus
Veteran Wiggler
Posts: 686
Joined: Mon Apr 02, 2012 7:36 pm
Location: Canada

Post by thebrotherspus » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:34 pm

D_Robot wrote:...I might be one of the twelve.
I'd be one too!!

User avatar
starthief
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 4820
Joined: Tue Oct 04, 2016 10:39 am
Location: St Louis, MO
Contact:

Post by starthief » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:36 pm

strangegravity wrote:Image
Honestly, that looks like the start of a great trigger-with-velocity module. 8-)

User avatar
pzoot
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 377
Joined: Fri Apr 25, 2014 8:48 pm

Post by pzoot » Wed Apr 18, 2018 2:56 pm

Ok you guys got me :)

How about an alternate firmware for Plonk!!!

User avatar
2disbetter
Ultra Wiggler
Posts: 992
Joined: Wed Jul 16, 2014 9:40 pm
Location: Germany

Post by 2disbetter » Wed Apr 18, 2018 3:11 pm

I would like something like this, which is precisely why I went with a er-301 and more specifically a SSP.

There is no shortage of ways to accomplish a module like this with what is already available, and a really good sampled piano is about as good as it gets outside of playing a real one.

I am a big fan of my eurorack being able to make any sound.

2d

Post Reply

Return to “Eurorack Modules”