Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

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SingleCell
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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by SingleCell » Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:59 pm

Here's a couple images of the hum, in Izotope RX. The right hand side shows frequency.

The top one shows the output of a Xaoc Belgrad, opened fully, no resonance and no audio input, with the Performer CV1 Out patched to v/oct input. In the first half I unplug the CV input twice. Second half, I start switching "Step" pages on the Performer, to show how it changes volume depending on how much of the OLED is lit up.

The second image shows the CV1 output of Performer patched directly into Pro Tools.

I don't know if this is useful, but thanks for looking.
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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by escargot » Thu Nov 12, 2020 2:55 am

SingleCell wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:35 am
I had a guy that I found online build it for me. Unfortunately he's not responding to emails now so, at least for the moment, I'm on my own.
Let me guess.... Todd Sines?

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by SingleCell » Thu Nov 12, 2020 3:04 am

I didn't come here to name names or point fingers. Also, the guy has got back to me now. I'm hopeful we can work it out.

EDIT: sorry if that came off snotty. I'm just trying to diagnose the problem and get it solved, that's all.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by crumb dinger » Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:55 am

I'm expecting a Performer soon and would really like to read some more impressions of it. There's not too much video/demo stuff available out there to get me through the wait!

Is anyone composing longer tracks with it? Do you like the ergonomics? Is it fun to use? etc?

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Lokua » Sat Nov 14, 2020 1:34 pm

crumb dinger wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 2:55 am
I'm expecting a Performer soon and would really like to read some more impressions of it. There's not too much video/demo stuff available out there to get me through the wait!

Is anyone composing longer tracks with it? Do you like the ergonomics? Is it fun to use? etc?
I have composed longer tracks with it here and there. With 16 patterns and a song mode it is perfectly capable. That style, however, is not exactly fun and not what I find attractive about modular sequencing. For me the fun part is being able to perform with it and the Performer's Pattern and Performer pages as well as 4 assignable CV ins are great for that. I often stay in one of those pages and just play it.

A great thing about the Pattern page is that you can play any track from any pattern, and the track will always "pick up" correctly, so you can mix and match tracks across all 16 patterns and it doesn't have to wait for a bar to end and it doesn't matter if that track has a different step length - it will always be "aligned" as if it was playing in that length all along. Of course you can change the entire pattern for all tracks at once and even play patterns like a keyboard - maybe play pattern 2 for just a couple steps where you might have some fills and higher notes, for example. Really great for "injecting" breaks etc.

The other fun page is the Performer page. This page gives you access to mutes for all tracks as well as fill buttons for each track. By default the fills are exactly that, holding the button is like temporarily turning all steps on, but each track can control exactly how it responds to fill mode - something I haven't really played with much as just normal fill is enough for me. Using these pages have become muscle memory now - good times.

Other than those pages, I also find it fun to easily change play modes and track divisions on a per track basis. I often forget I can even do that, but have been practicing taking advantage of those more. Ergonomically it's just an intuitive button combo (page + mode then press the step button corresponding to a mode) or page+division and press the button corresponding to division. It's super fast. The only hard part is those shift+ (or page+? I forget) functions have not become muscle memory yet so I have to squint to read the text above the buttons (it's actually faster to just shift+<button> and see the screen feedback and try another button if it wasn't correct haha - still really fast to do).

Last fun thing and what I think is true modular spirit is those 4 CV ins. I'll leave that for you to dream about.

Overall the Performer is brilliant. I absolutely love it, and that actually means a lot as I've spent a lot of time writing sequencer software myself, am somewhat obsessed, and really hard to please.

Only thing I don't love but am not loosing any sleep over are the generator modes: they don't actually fit in with the rest of the Performer's design IMO and take too long to dial in. I think a euclidean generator that doesn't have parameters that can be tweaked live makes absolutely no sense, and even less so as a feature on a grid-based sequencer.

Edit: sorry for the novel but I love this subject. Just want to add that at the end of the day, it's just a grid-based sequencer. A really well designed one, but ultimately it's a big ass utility. I do find myself at points where I am not inspired to use it, but that would happen with any traditional sequencer grid based sequencer. Lately I go back and forth between using the performer normally vs as quantizer for external CV that I can transpose up and down from things like a turning machine, etc. I keep one pattern with all my note tracks set to C0 for this purpose, with the 4 CV ins set to transpose my 4 note tracks. When I want to go back, I just turn those CV routings off and go to another pattern - which gives me time to sort of break the performance down into a transition (or in theory anyway, still practicing this).

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by crumb dinger » Sat Nov 14, 2020 5:41 pm

Lokua wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 1:34 pm
Overall the Performer is brilliant. I absolutely love it, and that actually means a lot as I've spent a lot of time writing sequencer software myself, am somewhat obsessed, and really hard to please.
Thank you so much for the detailed writeup! I appreciate the length, in fact. Definitely a hearty endorsement and you illustrate what using it might actually be like, which is isn't obvious from what's out there now. For instance, I had no idea that patterns would 'pick up'. I love using legato clips in ableton and this would be a such a killer feature to have in the rack. Pretty unique in the current sequencer market.

I'm really into the button-based interface in combination with the screen, so I'm happy to hear that you get along with that aspect. I'm super excited!

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Bachelard » Sat Nov 14, 2020 6:50 pm

Lokua - interesting lens. I haven't really used any external CV inputs because I've been finding such joy routing Curve Tracks to modulate various things in Note tracks.

I've only had it for less than a week, but out of all the sequencers I've tried in the last 4 years, this is the one I've been able to get the most musically interesting things with. Like you said, per-track clock division is huge, and once you start to MODULATE that using another track that's set to Curves (ie.., a CV/LFO/envelope track), things just come alive. Sequences just ebb and flow, shrink and expand, becomes very fluid, which a lot of other sequencers cannot do or require a bit more work (maybe with the exception of the ER-101, from what I understand of it).

I'm using the Westlicht clearly not for very synchronous sound events, and for a grid sequencer, it's surprisingly good and making things sound messed up.

crumb dinger - I'm planning to make some tutorials (as soon as I get my DSLR back from my work place) in addition to the fine ones that Anthurium has done, probably around Song mode and honing in on taking the internal routing matrix to some extremes.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by rayultine » Sat Nov 14, 2020 8:35 pm

Bachelard, more tutorials would rock. I haven't had the module for very long and I am still having a blast exploring 4/4 16 or 32 step territory.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by MindStasis » Sat Nov 14, 2020 10:44 pm

SingleCell wrote:
Wed Nov 11, 2020 7:59 pm
Here's a couple images of the hum, in Izotope RX. The right hand side shows frequency.

The top one shows the output of a Xaoc Belgrad, opened fully, no resonance and no audio input, with the Performer CV1 Out patched to v/oct input. In the first half I unplug the CV input twice. Second half, I start switching "Step" pages on the Performer, to show how it changes volume depending on how much of the OLED is lit up.

The second image shows the CV1 output of Performer patched directly into Pro Tools.

I don't know if this is useful, but thanks for looking.


I have the same hum. I figured it was just the OLED. They tend to be noisy.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by SingleCell » Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:31 pm

@MindStasis

Can I ask, what color OLED does yours have?

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by MindStasis » Sun Nov 15, 2020 2:28 am

SingleCell wrote:
Sat Nov 14, 2020 11:31 pm
@MindStasis

Can I ask, what color OLED does yours have?
Blue

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by dooj88 » Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:35 pm

+1 here for a potential very appreciative demo watcher! just seeing the process through someone elses eyes can open up some new ideas and tricks for working.

i too have struggled with the search for The Perfect Sequencer for years, and this is something i think i'll keep for a while. perfect balance of depth/features, hands on control and visual feedback. the only thing that would have made this an absolute killer would be 16 knobs for controlling each step's pitch value, but honestly with all the routing options it's not missed. anyway, i've been having a blast using another CV 4 step sequence routed to the play mode and octave shift on another pattern. it retains just enough repetition that it's a recognizable sequence, but its predictably unpredictable at the same time. quite brilliant.

i need to spend more time exploring curve tracks. it would certainly make killer synced LFOs, similar to that new Maestro module.

couple Qs:
--has anyone figured out how to play the arpeggiator on internally generated sequences? i haven't been able to get any external gear to be recognized to explore this feature.
--when copying/pasting steps from one pattern to the next (the Page + Patt button combo) it does not retain the original note values - they seem to be randomized, although the scale is consistent. is that normal for everyone else? i made sure there wasn't any routing on that track that could have changed it. curious, but not a big deal.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Lokua » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:04 am

dooj88 wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:35 pm
--when copying/pasting steps from one pattern to the next (the Page + Patt button combo) it does not retain the original note values - they seem to be randomized, although the scale is consistent. is that normal for everyone else? i made sure there wasn't any routing on that track that could have changed it. curious, but not a big deal.
I just copied some steps from one pattern and pasted them into another. Works as expected, though I'm on the second to latest firmware.
Just trouble shooting, are you sure you don't have track scale override? There is the project scale but also per-track scale override that defaults to the project one (I think in Seq page). Are you sure you didn't have more than one routing? Good luck.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by MvK » Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:18 am

I've had a lot of fun using a curve track as "lfo-controller" using the cv-out for lfo freq and the gate for lfo reset. That way I have complete rythmical control over a lfo. The min/max values per step can be edited very precise (with shift I think) so you can dial in great lfo patterns for the acidbass eG. even better if the lfo has adjustable startphase.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Cedre » Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:37 am

I really like to have tis sequencer, for the moment I have a NerdSe.

Butt are the 24 pots and the encoder robust ?

The pots seems to be very little and brittle ?

Thanks

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by djthopa » Mon Nov 16, 2020 3:24 am

dooj88 wrote:
Sun Nov 15, 2020 5:35 pm
+1 here for a potential very appreciative demo watcher! just seeing the process through someone elses eyes can open up some new ideas and tricks for working.

i too have struggled with the search for The Perfect Sequencer for years, and this is something i think i'll keep for a while. perfect balance of depth/features, hands on control and visual feedback. the only thing that would have made this an absolute killer would be 16 knobs for controlling each step's pitch value, but honestly with all the routing options it's not missed. anyway, i've been having a blast using another CV 4 step sequence routed to the play mode and octave shift on another pattern. it retains just enough repetition that it's a recognizable sequence, but its predictably unpredictable at the same time. quite brilliant.

i need to spend more time exploring curve tracks. it would certainly make killer synced LFOs, similar to that new Maestro module.

couple Qs:
--has anyone figured out how to play the arpeggiator on internally generated sequences? i haven't been able to get any external gear to be recognized to explore this feature.
--when copying/pasting steps from one pattern to the next (the Page + Patt button combo) it does not retain the original note values - they seem to be randomized, although the scale is consistent. is that normal for everyone else? i made sure there wasn't any routing on that track that could have changed it. curious, but not a big deal.
Agree 100% wih you, this sequencer with 16 pots would have been a winner. Hoping some integration with a midi controller with ths funcionality may come. Novation launchcontrol would be perfect.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by theotteryears » Mon Nov 16, 2020 3:41 am

I had both of these and they compliment each other well. Give me a shout if you need any info about them :)


Cedre wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:37 am
I really like to have tis sequencer, for the moment I have a NerdSe.

Butt are the 24 pots and the encoder robust ?

The pots seems to be very little and brittle ?

Thanks

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Cedre » Mon Nov 16, 2020 3:49 am

theotteryears wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 3:41 am
I had both of these and they compliment each other well. Give me a shout if you need any info about them :)


Cedre wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:37 am
I really like to have tis sequencer, for the moment I have a NerdSe.

Butt are the 24 pots and the encoder robust ?

The pots seems to be very little and brittle ?

Thanks

I don't have any more place in my case to have both, I have to choose.

The nerdseq is very robust with the big buttons and have the LFO and enveloppe!!

But I really like the workflow of the performer which seems to be a elektron like modular sequencer. (but no LFO or enveloppe)

The only thing is that the pots and buttons seems to be a little bit fragile?

Do you confirm ?

Thanks

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by theotteryears » Mon Nov 16, 2020 5:44 am

Hi,
The pot and buttons on mine are great - no problems here! ah will be a tough choice as they are both quite different.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by SingleCell » Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:03 am

Cedre wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:37 am
Butt are the 24 pots and the encoder robust ?

The pots seems to be very little and brittle ?
Those aren't pots (potentiometers), they are buttons. (And yeah they are pretty small, but they seem solid.)

Sorry if this is JUST a grammar correction post, it wasn't meant to be... but I can't be sure what you meant to say.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Cedre » Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:38 am

Yes I want to say button not pot. The 3 rows of 8 buttons.

So they are small but robust?

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by mopoco » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:32 am

Cedre wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:38 am
Yes I want to say button not pot. The 3 rows of 8 buttons.

So they are small but robust?
They certainly feel robust, which is only my 2c.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Bachelard » Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:12 pm

Cedre wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 6:38 am
Yes I want to say button not pot. The 3 rows of 8 buttons.

So they are small but robust?
So far so good. Everything feels solid. My unit was built by a colleague and it was one of his early DIY projects.

One good thing about NOT having potentiometers on this module is that in Step pages, you can press a bunch of buttons and change multiple values at the same time. It's the same as holding Shift+press step buttons to select multiple steps, but it's sometime more fun and spontaneous to randomly press some buttons with a few fingers and offset their value(s). And besides, I find it really easy to dial in values per step anyway.

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by crumb dinger » Fri Nov 20, 2020 3:01 am

Bachelard wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:12 pm
One good thing about NOT having potentiometers on this module is that in Step pages, you can press a bunch of buttons and change multiple values at the same time. It's the same as holding Shift+press step buttons to select multiple steps, but it's sometime more fun and spontaneous to randomly press some buttons with a few fingers and offset their value(s). And besides, I find it really easy to dial in values per step anyway.
This is something I miss dearly from Elektron machines that I'm excited to use with Performer. Great for... performing. If you don't mind, does it work similarly with midi input instead of the encoder?

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Re: Westlicht PER|FORMER Sequencer (DIY)

Post by Bachelard » Fri Nov 20, 2020 8:48 am

crumb dinger wrote:
Fri Nov 20, 2020 3:01 am
Bachelard wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 9:12 pm
One good thing about NOT having potentiometers on this module is that in Step pages, you can press a bunch of buttons and change multiple values at the same time. It's the same as holding Shift+press step buttons to select multiple steps, but it's sometime more fun and spontaneous to randomly press some buttons with a few fingers and offset their value(s). And besides, I find it really easy to dial in values per step anyway.
This is something I miss dearly from Elektron machines that I'm excited to use with Performer. Great for... performing. If you don't mind, does it work similarly with midi input instead of the encoder?
I really have not tested it with MIDI since I don't use MIDI with my Eurorack, but I'm going to grab my DSLR back from work today and probably start doing some videos this weekend, so maybe I can test it then. :tu:

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