Frap Tools USTA

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esmooov
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by esmooov » Mon Mar 16, 2020 2:03 pm

So last night I fudged something and got stuck in a mode that I couldn't find a reference to in the manual. Essentially what happened was the normal pattern start/end readout was replaced with something that read 'rep 23/15` and then USTA stopped respecting song mode. Even in song mode, it just looped whatever patterns I had set up in pattern mode. I rebooted the unit and everything worked as normal but I'd like to know what I did to cause this if anyone else has seen this?

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by synonymist » Mon Mar 16, 2020 11:36 pm

Another go with USTA brought more facility. By discovery this time, however, not by study. Selecting a range by 'SHIFT plus stage encoder press' is what I stumbled on. At first I thought I broke the module. ;) Then I deduced that it was a feature not a bug, and I liked it. Using it to the extreme can yield pretty dense combinations of states across all the stages in a pattern. But if you use it simply it is quite manageable for performance. So that's what I did.

In these tracks, René and PNW do the drum patterns; while USTA does all else, including resetting itself and René. The meter is 5/4, but the melody floats over it in another meter or no meter. Albeit after only a few tries, I am finding that USTA has a "sound".

Based on the same patch, these tracks differ from each other enough to merit listening to at least some of each, in case you might prefer one's flavor to the other. Session notes are at each track's webpage:




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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by esmooov » Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:51 pm

I managed to get into this mode again, which seems to disable song mode (even though I am in song mode). It just loops one pattern over and over. I wish I understood how this happens. Pay attention to the "rep 13/25" thing on the display. What is that? Usually it just reads 01/01 but whenever it gets into this state I feel trapped and would love to know what I'm overlooking. I've read the manual several times and can't find this setting referenced. It seems related to how pattern repeat works in song mode (?) but I can't quite reproduce reliably.

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studioutopia
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by studioutopia » Tue Mar 17, 2020 7:01 pm

esmooov wrote:
Tue Mar 17, 2020 12:51 pm
I managed to get into this mode again, which seems to disable song mode (even though I am in song mode). It just loops one pattern over and over. I wish I understood how this happens. Pay attention to the "rep 13/25" thing on the display. What is that? Usually it just reads 01/01 but whenever it gets into this state I feel trapped and would love to know what I'm overlooking. I've read the manual several times and can't find this setting referenced. It seems related to how pattern repeat works in song mode (?) but I can't quite reproduce reliably.

Image
Normally, the "rep 13/25" means you are playing pattern 13, and it will loop 25 times - not sure how you got past 16!?!?.
Looks like you have song mode enabled, but are now listening to pattern 1, and editing (see) pattern 1. And by the light blue LED, it looks like you are hearing stage 2...
You should send an issue ticket in from their firmware/support page on the website.
I WANT TO KNOW HOW TO DO THIS!!!!

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Gringo Starr » Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:04 am

On the verge of buying one of these but there seems to be a good amount of problems people are having with it. Anyone regret buying this? Might order one tomorrow to keep me entertained during some extended home time. :)
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by studioutopia » Wed Mar 18, 2020 1:24 am

Gringo Starr wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:04 am
On the verge of buying one of these but there seems to be a good amount of problems people are having with it. Anyone regret buying this? Might order one tomorrow to keep me entertained during some extended home time. :)
No regrets!!! I love this sequencer. For me - I would not call them problems, more of a learning curve... and Frap is really working hard on adding features.
It's a very deep module. And very different that most other sequencers I've experienced.. in a great way.
I have found that the workflow is very unique, and has intricacies that take time and experimentation to figure out - but once you catch on, USTA is extremely powerful.
Tonight, I really started exploring Song mode - and started finding ways I could control it and modify which pattern was going to play next, and for how long - in real time, and in ways I could not do with another sequencer. And the way you edit is really conducive to improvisation and coming up with ideas on the fly. I am finding I can edit and build new patterns really fast - without ever stopping playback.
I'm still hoping they add more features for CV control of patterns and songs, but there is a lot there to play with already.
For me it has the depth of Five12 Vector (if not deeper), and fun, interactive and immediate like Rene2 or Metropolis.
It feels way more polished than Eloquencer. And it can be surgical like the ER-101.
The probability and ratchets are very musical... everything that comes out of USTA when I use it, just sounds right.
My opinion... but I wouldn't say not to buy it for any technical reason.
One thing to consider though - is it's not a device you can just mount, power up, and play. You will really need Manual One.

Yes... this extended home time we are all doing (or should be doing) is great for learning a DEEP new module and patching!!

Cheers! Stay happy and healthy!

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Protocode » Sat Mar 21, 2020 6:45 am

Hi everybody ! I'm really thinking of ordering a USTA (seems so powerful)

But I have a question :
Most of the time, when I compose with a sequencer, I do it live, until I find a good pattern/melody. But, it ́s quite common to end up with a great beat or melody only to realise your downbeat is displaced by a few steps. At this point, is it easy, with the USTA, to shift the pattern to the originally intended position ?

For example :
stage 3 become stage 1
stage 4 become stage 2
stage 5 become stage 3
:
:
stage 1 become stage 15
stage 2 become stage 16

It's really simple to do it with the Eloquencer (function called "Pattern/Track Shift"). Is it the same with the USTA ?

It's a very very important feature for me !! I read the One Manual, but wasn't able to find any informations about it (certainly miss it).

Thanks in advance for your help !! :tu:

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by hawkfuzz » Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:27 pm

Kinda has this function. I believe the 'Pattern Shift' cv function will get these results, however, the 'Stage length' parameter remains the same so if all 16 steps are the same length you're gold, but if you have variance in stage length it won't work. The stage length remains to the step when rotating all of the other information so shifted one step:

step 1 is 1 C4-----step 1 is 1 G2
step 2 is 2 D2-----step 2 is 2 C4
step 3 is 1 E5-----step 3 is 1 D2
step 3 is 3 G2-----step 3 is 3 E5

I'd like this feature as well to just rotate the pattern without having to use CV for it. I've been using the copy and paste function to move sequences, but most of those have been 8 steps. With 16 steps you might have to remember one to copy and paste the others.
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Graffie » Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:40 pm

Gringo Starr wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:04 am
On the verge of buying one of these but there seems to be a good amount of problems people are having with it. Anyone regret buying this? Might order one tomorrow to keep me entertained during some extended home time. :)
I kind of agree with studioutopia. Most of the initial problems had a lot to do with me learning the module. And there is definitely a learning curve to it so you need to be prepared to give it some time. While I don't think its as deep as the Five12 Vector (almost bought it but went for USTA instead) its definitely deep enough for my current needs. In general, I think once it clicks it can be a fast and fun sequencer to use. So no regrets at all.

To give you an idea of how long it can take to get used to its workflow. Sequencer I already had experience with are several Elektron machines, SQ-1, Metropolis, Eloquencer, and the TR-8s. I think it took me about a month of nondaily usage (about 8 hour a week) to get to the point where I don't need the manual anymore for basic operations. With this I mean to get used to: jumping between performance and edit mode and the 4 tracks without getting lost, copying stuff around, get used to how the looping patterns work, using the set, shift, and course buttons, the way cv layers, length, and gate layers work. Also during this time, I had my modular slaved in a patch where I had 4 basic subtractive voices to control so I could focus on just how USTA works.

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Graffie » Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:54 pm

hawkfuzz wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:27 pm
I'd like this feature as well to just rotate the pattern without having to use CV for it. I've been using the copy and paste function to move sequences, but most of those have been 8 steps. With 16 steps you might have to remember one to copy and paste the others.
Have you made a firmware feature request? Cause I'm thinking about submitting one. I think a nice way to do this would be something like:
in edit mode --> hold set + shift and rotate the navigation encoder to shift around the starting point of a pattern.

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by studioutopia » Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:56 pm

Graffie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:54 pm
hawkfuzz wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:27 pm
I'd like this feature as well to just rotate the pattern without having to use CV for it. I've been using the copy and paste function to move sequences, but most of those have been 8 steps. With 16 steps you might have to remember one to copy and paste the others.
Have you made a firmware feature request? Cause I'm thinking about submitting one. I think a nice way to do this would be something like:
in edit mode --> hold set + shift and rotate the navigation encoder to shift around the starting point of a pattern.
+1 for this feature!

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by hawkfuzz » Sat Mar 21, 2020 2:18 pm

Gringo Starr wrote:
Wed Mar 18, 2020 12:04 am
On the verge of buying one of these but there seems to be a good amount of problems people are having with it. Anyone regret buying this? Might order one tomorrow to keep me entertained during some extended home time. :)
Problems, as stated, are just from learning. This thing does a lot and is easy to get it started doing basic stuff. The less common features are the only thing I've got an issue with and it's easier each time I play because it's pretty intuitive.
Graffie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 1:54 pm
hawkfuzz wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:27 pm
I'd like this feature as well to just rotate the pattern without having to use CV for it. I've been using the copy and paste function to move sequences, but most of those have been 8 steps. With 16 steps you might have to remember one to copy and paste the others.
Have you made a firmware feature request? Cause I'm thinking about submitting one. I think a nice way to do this would be something like:
in edit mode --> hold set + shift and rotate the navigation encoder to shift around the starting point of a pattern.
I have not but you should. It wasn't until making the response that I realized it wasn't capable. I assumed I was missing something.
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Graffie » Sat Mar 21, 2020 3:51 pm

Submitted

Protocode
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Protocode » Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:18 pm

hawkfuzz wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 12:27 pm
Kinda has this function. I believe the 'Pattern Shift' cv function will get these results, however, the 'Stage length' parameter remains the same so if all 16 steps are the same length you're gold, but if you have variance in stage length it won't work. The stage length remains to the step when rotating all of the other information so shifted one step:

step 1 is 1 C4-----step 1 is 1 G2
step 2 is 2 D2-----step 2 is 2 C4
step 3 is 1 E5-----step 3 is 1 D2
step 3 is 3 G2-----step 3 is 3 E5

I'd like this feature as well to just rotate the pattern without having to use CV for it. I've been using the copy and paste function to move sequences, but most of those have been 8 steps. With 16 steps you might have to remember one to copy and paste the others.
Many thanks for your answer. I saw this "operation" with the CVin in One Manual, but (and I'm sure you agree) it's not as simple as what I want (neither the copy/paste operation). Hope this feature will appear in a next update. Cheers to you !

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Protocode » Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:19 pm

Graffie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 3:51 pm
Submitted
Many thanks for that !! Really hope that this feature will appear ! The USTA seems to be the perfect beast for me (one knob per stage, lively pattern with the variation probability, it seems musical, enough output, control of the length, bipolar CV pattern, not to much "menu diving", etc...). BUT, without the feature we mentioned before, my workflow will be broken every time I need to do it. So wait and see; Finger crossed !

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by hawkfuzz » Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:40 pm

I wonder if they'd remove some less popular operations for more requested. I like when people put out configurable firmwares but that's a tall order. Nothing does everything and if something does everything I do nothing.
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by closedLoop » Sat Mar 21, 2020 7:06 pm

hawkfuzz wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:40 pm
I wonder if they'd remove some less popular operations for more requested. I like when people put out configurable firmwares but that's a tall order. Nothing does everything and if something does everything I do nothing.
I'm curious what you think the less popular operations are? No judgement - I just find myself using most everything.

For those looking for a non-standard sequencer, the polymetric/polyrhythmic stage scheme and the vast support for non-standard scales make this a neat and tidy beast.

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by hawkfuzz » Sat Mar 21, 2020 7:23 pm

I don't know, I haven't used all the features as it's a lot to explore and usually when I end up trying to explore a feature I end up getting lost in grooving.

I was speaking from experience with the SHmk2 that removed one feature and added a much requested feature after a year of community conversations.

I could see a scale leaving.
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Graffie » Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:07 am

Protocode wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:19 pm
Graffie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 3:51 pm
Submitted
Many thanks for that !! Really hope that this feature will appear ! The USTA seems to be the perfect beast for me (one knob per stage, lively pattern with the variation probability, it seems musical, enough output, control of the length, bipolar CV pattern, not to much "menu diving", etc...). BUT, without the feature we mentioned before, my workflow will be broken every time I need to do it. So wait and see; Finger crossed !
Got a reply from Giovanni from Frap Tools stating:
“Your request is already in our records: it's in the pipeline, so it will be 100% implemented in the future.”
We will have to see if it’s gonna be implemented the way I suggested but at least the feature wil be implemented! :)

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Protocode » Mon Mar 23, 2020 4:52 pm

Graffie wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 6:07 am
Protocode wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 5:19 pm
Graffie wrote:
Sat Mar 21, 2020 3:51 pm
Submitted
Many thanks for that !! Really hope that this feature will appear ! The USTA seems to be the perfect beast for me (one knob per stage, lively pattern with the variation probability, it seems musical, enough output, control of the length, bipolar CV pattern, not to much "menu diving", etc...). BUT, without the feature we mentioned before, my workflow will be broken every time I need to do it. So wait and see; Finger crossed !
Got a reply from Giovanni from Frap Tools stating:
“Your request is already in our records: it's in the pipeline, so it will be 100% implemented in the future.”
We will have to see if it’s gonna be implemented the way I suggested but at least the feature wil be implemented! :)

GREAT !! :tu: :tu: :tu:

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by BrokenBo » Sun Mar 29, 2020 3:52 am

usta controlling everything in ping pong with just friends.



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100000bps
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by 100000bps » Sun Mar 29, 2020 11:51 am

Wondering if its a bug or a "feature" but when copying a track, the settings of scale, tempo, swing etc do not copy...

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by hawkfuzz » Sun Mar 29, 2020 1:24 pm

It's not a bug or feature, just how the function is currently implemented. The cloning functions are a bit more rigid than I'd expect but I think the new firmware will address some things if necessary.

Currently you can change all tracks setting by hold SET ALL before pushing the ENCODER in the track settings.


Also firmware 151 isn't out yet but the notes seem to be up.
http://frap.tools/firmwares/
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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by BaloErets » Sun Mar 29, 2020 2:45 pm

Hi folks and peeps.

I got my USTA on Friday. Being jamming with it all weekend. Killer module. Love the workflow and functionality. I do feel my module has an issue though, which I have not seen displayed on other videos.

From the Led-Rings around the knob, I have a significant amount of bleed from the light that partially lights up the following led that should not be lit, but it makes it pretty hard to tell if it's actually on or not. From the Loopop video, nor from the Frap Tools instagram videos do I see that behaviour.

Nevertheless, before sending a word to Frap Tools, I was wondering if this is unique to my module or if people have had a similar experience?

EDIT; I should note that I have the exact behaviour on all of the knobs. Also, from my calucations I am about 8% within the limits of my power supply, I'm wondering if this could be that the USTA might need a bit more breathing room in terms of power to work optimally? Perhaps the specs they give are more minimal requirements that the suggested requirement?

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Re: Frap Tools USTA

Post by Graffie » Sun Mar 29, 2020 2:58 pm

Firmware update is looking good! We even got a new dashboard design.

@BaloErets
I also got a bit of bleed and all the knobs seem to have this. So its probably not due to power supply. For reference here's a pic of what mine looks like.


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