Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

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@green
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Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by @green » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:08 pm

Curious everyone’s opinions on why people are selling their Mutable Instruments stuff? I see pretty much at least 1 MI module per Eurorack sale these days. It it because there haven’t been new modules in a while? Would they rather have smaller HP clones? Are they over them completely? Is it that they were so popular and everyone has at least 1 on the chopping block when figuring out where to go next and no hard feelings? I’m just so curious.

I am still all in and think of the designs as being up there with Moog, Buchla, Arp and Serge and feel like even those designers would find the work both innovative and refreshing. Interested to hear the community weigh in on the topic.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by thetwlo » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:17 pm

They have a self-destruct function that kicks in after 5 years. Just to mess with those that steal the code.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by Pighood » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:20 pm

I ain't tryna sell mines.
*phnert*

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by starthief » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:32 pm

Mutable is an extremely popular brand, and the used market just reflects those statistics. Over on ModularGrid, Clouds, Rings and Plaits are the #2, #4 and #5 most popular modules at the moment.

I've sold a few myself, but I also still have 7 factory Mutable modules in my rack plus a Supercell... :)

And also, unless you're really analyzing the listings you're seeing, I bet several of those "Mutable" modules are DIY and micro/clone versions of their open source modules.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by xcc » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:33 pm

Mine ain’t going nowheres either.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by thetwlo » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:36 pm

xcc wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:33 pm
Mine ain’t going nowheres either.
so, to be clear, they are going somewhere? where?

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by thetwlo » Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:41 pm

starthief wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:32 pm
Mutable is an extremely popular brand, and the used market just reflects those statistics. Over on ModularGrid, Clouds, Rings and Plaits are the #2, #4 and #5 most popular modules at the moment.

I've sold a few myself, but I also still have 7 factory Mutable modules in my rack plus a Supercell... :)

And also, unless you're really analyzing the listings you're seeing, I bet several of those "Mutable" modules are DIY and micro/clone versions of their open source modules.
as much as I think you are 100% correct you should probably note IF you received these modules for free or at a discount. That's a fine line, but it could sound like an ad.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by JuliusRe » Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:41 am

starthief wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:32 pm
Mutable is an extremely popular brand, and the used market just reflects those statistics. Over on ModularGrid, Clouds, Rings and Plaits are the #2, #4 and #5 most popular modules at the moment.

I've sold a few myself, but I also still have 7 factory Mutable modules in my rack plus a Supercell... :)

And also, unless you're really analyzing the listings you're seeing, I bet several of those "Mutable" modules are DIY and micro/clone versions of their open source modules.
I think that hits the nail on the head :agree:
At least I could not think of any reason, why people should suddenly start to sell these popular modules more :despair:

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by lisa » Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:02 am

The most logical and obvious answer to this type of question is always ”there are many of them around”. Sometimes with the add-on ”and there was a big hype so many people got one without knowing much about it”.
My first modular track where I used drum modules! There's also a ton of FM cross modulation from the Instruō Cš-L in there and the Metasonix R56 is a big part of the sound. :star:



We also just did a live performance. Just eurorack, a mixer and two nitwits. :hyper: http://tiny.cc/8ndspz

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by hawkfuzz » Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:05 am

The number 23
THUMPR BC SC

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by cackland » Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:26 am

hawkfuzz wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 2:05 am
The number 23
Ha.. great movie. And so true ;)

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by Funky40 » Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:06 am

starthief wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:32 pm
And also, unless you're really analyzing the listings you're seeing, I bet several of those "Mutable" modules are DIY and micro/clone versions of their open source modules.
my impression too.

I see here alots of love for some of the MI modules.
( just that the hype is now off. The sun shines every day. we edizt: won´t praise her for that.....;) )


(editeds: "want", but should have been: "won´t" )
Last edited by Funky40 on Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:25 am, edited 1 time in total.
For sale / reduced prices ( swiss (we are NON-EU)/ in case it makes sense_ EU/WW)(CHF +- = $):
lowered prices: Dotcom Q960: 650.- / Q119: 420 / ( i also have one or much likely two 19" Frames)
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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by black_label » Sun Feb 02, 2020 3:12 am

Market saturation? They have a lot of modules out there and it’s pretty common for people to try them for a while and then move on.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by Lux A Turner » Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:34 am

I can't say I've noticed an excess of MI in my own (admittedly UK biased) searches and have just bought a Marbles and Stages new. Branches is on the shopping list.

I did consider a mini Marbles for a while, but decided it would be too crowded for a module I wanted to 'play'. There are some very nice, full size clones out there, with some great front panels, but the MI dealers are closer to home with free shipping. That said, I may consider a micro Plaits in future.
Last edited by Lux A Turner on Sun Feb 02, 2020 6:30 pm, edited 1 time in total.
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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by StillNotWorking » Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:46 am

I've been thinking many where drawn to them listening to YT in the time period shimmer where the thing. Then got tired of them not exploring all the other things they can do in favour of then next new hot cake.
looking for service manual for the Clavia ddrum AT or ddrum III

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by racooniac » Sun Feb 02, 2020 7:53 am

i sold my (original design, diy) clouds because i had a bigger problem with 3 parameters being hidden behind 1 cv input / pot than i had expected, atm i like doing granular stuff with mimeophone, works good enough for me ;)

and since i really dont like to remember what led color does what i think i'll not get any more MI modules other than the obligatory (8hp, diy) rings everyone has and the (original) MI Stages thats just too useful to not have =)

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by fredzed » Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:02 am

My original MI modules are staying with me for the foreseable future, love 'em! But I agree with the above statement that many of these so called "MI" used modules going around the marketplaces for really low prices, are mostly clones/DIY. So I don't think more people are ditching MI modules, it's just there's so many cheap clones, that they become almost a currency.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by Kattefjaes » Sun Feb 02, 2020 8:11 am

I don't think it's enough to look at how many are on sale- look at slightly unreliable metrics like how many you see in racks on Modulargrid too- there's a lot of them about. If there was some reliable way to look at "churn" ratio, that might be a more informative measure.

People buy and sell mods all the time. There are a lot of Mutable mods, so it's expected that you'd see quite a lot of Mutable mods bought and sold. If anything, it might be surprising that there aren't more listed for sale. Maybe some are bought and sold on a hype wave as the new hawtness- the buyer made the default Clouds sound and got bored with that.. some others (like Ripples) are so generally useful that they move around less? I don't know.

That said, people like novelty, and are always trying to cram new modules in their racks. If any manufacturer doesn't make anything new for a bit, that means their modules are, by definition, not the new hawtness and might get moved. Add to that people doing stuff like swapping Clouds (to stick with that example) for a small Monsoon to keep the functions but free up HP and there's a potential for "liquidity". It certainly doesn't mean they're not good or wanted modules, there's a lot of good stuff there.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by @green » Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:58 am

The most popular answers so far are:

1. market share is high so of course we’ll see a bunch for sale

2. New modules were (and will probably continue to be) extremely popular and hyped upon release and some may dump quickly to buy something else (cycle repeats)

3. No real way to quantify this observation given the data we have access to.

4. Hogwash, I’m keeping them!

5. Clones do it better in less space

6. The number 23 ( maybe not popular but I found it humorous)

Am I leaving any out?

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by Ceres » Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:02 am

Now do Doepfer, then Toyota. We need to get to the bottom of this.
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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by starthief » Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:23 am

thetwlo wrote:
Sat Feb 01, 2020 11:41 pm
as much as I think you are 100% correct you should probably note IF you received these modules for free or at a discount. That's a fine line, but it could sound like an ad.
Some were beta test modules, others not. As for "discounts", nothing unusual -- Perfect Circuit 20% off sales when those were a thing, my first RIngs was from a charity auction and the second one was used in a trade, my second Warps (after selling my first one) was someone's DIY build.

In the case of beta test modules, I was asked only to test, and in fact asked NOT to leak anything about them until they were publicly released. I was also never asked to promote, review, demo, etc.

Opinions I share about any module from any brand are 100% my own. I've posted freely about what I do and don't like about every module I've tried, and why I sold the ones that I did.

The day someone offers me a free module for the purposes of promoting it... first I will question their wisdom, because I don't do videos, don't have a Twitter account, cancelled my Facebook account, and my album sales are meager. I don't even put much effort into promoting my own music. And second, I will refuse to say nice things about any module that doesn't deserve it, and third, I absolutely will put a disclaimer in anything I say about that module.

So, no. That wasn't an ad.

Ceres wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 10:02 am
Now do Doepfer, then Toyota. We need to get to the bottom of this.
I'm not selling my Toyota. :mrgreen:

(Also that was not an advertisement for Toyota, but full disclosure, I got 0% APR when I bought mine and would be happy to talk about how I hate the way the back window gets incredibly dirty incredibly quickly for some reason and wish it had just a half inch more headroom :hihi:)

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by goiks » Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:08 am

A small percentage of used listings is probably due to people wanting to conserve rack space - people who bought MI-made modules to start and now see a plethora of smaller, cheaper clones.

Also, many MI modules may appeal to those just starting out, and as they learn more and see where they want their system to go they find more specialized alternatives and swap.

But mainly #1.
@green wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 9:58 am
The most popular answers so far are:

1. market share is high so of course we’ll see a bunch for sale

2. New modules were (and will probably continue to be) extremely popular and hyped upon release and some may dump quickly to buy something else (cycle repeats)

3. No real way to quantify this observation given the data we have access to.

4. Hogwash, I’m keeping them!

5. Clones do it better in less space

6. The number 23 ( maybe not popular but I found it humorous)

Am I leaving any out?
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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by @green » Sun Feb 02, 2020 12:37 pm

goiks wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:08 am
Also, many MI modules may appeal to those just starting out, and as they learn more and see where they want their system to go they find more specialized alternatives and swap.
I totally get this, but then my advice would be to hold on to them because after you figure out how quick they are to getting complex sounds going for improv flow, you’ll want them back.

I still really like Braids for this purpose. Like I really want the sound of multiple oscillators ring modded right this second and oh wait all of my vcas and function generators are being used. No problem for Braids.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by kesserich » Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:07 pm

goiks wrote:
Sun Feb 02, 2020 11:08 am

Also, many MI modules may appeal to those just starting out, and as they learn more and see where they want their system to go they find more specialized alternatives and swap.
I think this is more dominant that people want to admit. New users often gravitate towards MI modules. As an example, there was A LOT of hype around clouds/rings a couple of years back and anyone just getting euro at the time would have been tempted to purchase both of them. I'm not saying they aren't good modules but I do think the communities adoration was a bit overblown.

I'd say the same thing with Braids which I bought when I was just getting started. Everybody raved about it so I gave it shot and while I liked the fact it offered so many different models, I quickly discovered that the comparing the CSAW mode to an actual analogue saw was night & day. Or the 808 kick to a real analogue kick. Granted I might be more of snob than some but it's really interesting to me that the deficiencies in those models were rarely mentioned in public forums.

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Re: Why are people selling Mutable Instruments?

Post by StillNotWorking » Sun Feb 02, 2020 1:35 pm

This thread had me searching local ads. Interestingly I've found that of those going all out of modular MI modules seems overrepresented.

Speculating if these people found they can do much MI in the box or simply not coming to terms with the workflow? Or as other mentioned, there is a lot of them out there.
looking for service manual for the Clavia ddrum AT or ddrum III

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