Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

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luupp
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Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by luupp » Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:23 am

Hi all,

Long time lurker, first time poster!

Some back story, I'm looking to build a backbone system to go along with my other hardware synths, like Digitone, Vermona etc. so It's important for the system to be in clock sync. I'm not that experienced in eurorack, though I have had a small system before. I was more into classic synths before.

In terms of style, I'm going for the later Autechre, Alva Noto experimental FM-ish style percs and heavily filtered sounds, also similar style drums and percs. But I'm not necessarily looking for feedback on sounds, I'm more curious about if I have enough VCA's/mixers etc. and if there is not a big logic fail in my system. Though all constructive feedback are very welcome!

Thanks you a lot!

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/1123361

Edit: Added link, also forgot that screenshot updates if I change the rack, sorry :D
Last edited by luupp on Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:40 pm, edited 3 times in total.

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chachi
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by chachi » Thu Feb 06, 2020 11:31 am

i have 15u and only had one quad vca and was definitely feeling like i needed another but honestly i got another one and haven’t even used it yet so i’ll bet the intellijel will be plenty for now. i like the look of this system, but i wonder if you’ll keep the Castle in there, volca FM takes up less rack space... :twisted:

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valouxxx
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by valouxxx » Thu Feb 06, 2020 3:00 pm

Maybe more VCAs, as you cans also pass CV control thru it. A mutable Blinds is really nice for it because of its cascading mixing structure, it also acts as simple CV 0/5v send, inverter, offset.
For external sync, you can use a CV.OCD from Sixty Four Pixels. Its an external box with basically all you need : 4 assignable midi track (trig + cv) and 8 other trigs outputs you can set as clocks sources (mult or div of the midi source). You can spare some precious hp for other modules.

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Pelsea
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by Pelsea » Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:34 pm

To design a big setup, it helps to think of it as a group of voices. Each voice can be built on a different signal generator and processor, but all need a couple of VCAs, an envelope, LFO, and probably a filter. (It helps to draw diagrams of each voice.) Include enough mix channels to listen to all voices at the same time. There are some processes like reverb that might be applied to the whole patch-- those are separate.

Once you have your set of voices, look for the parameters you want to control. This will tell you how many more CV sources you need, extra envelopes, more LFOs, sample and hold, keyboard, sequencers, etc. You will seldom need to control everything, so you can round down to a multiple of four. The CV utilities you need will be determined by the CV sources. For instance if all of theLFOs in the case are +/- V, you will need plenty of offsets.

Once you have planned all this out, cut back on voices to match reality.
Books and tutorials on modular synthesis at http://peterelsea.com
Patch responsibly-
pqe

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trickness
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by trickness » Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:40 pm

I’m going to be Mr. Buzzkill/Dad here and impart some thing I learned from experience. Once I got the modular bug I very quickly put together a 12u system, buying all the latest and greatest stuff and it was an awesome feeling having piles of modules to put together. But because I Bought so much stuff, it was almost impossible to really get to know the ins and outs of every single module, all of the capabilities of each one. And even though I read lots and lots of threads about what kind of system to put together, I really just had a hodgepodge of cool shit. I ended up selling most of my euro about two years later.

Fast forward until this year I really missed having a euro system. So what I did was buy a core selection of modules and then really focus on learning them and understand exactly what I was trying to build. Perhaps you’ve already done this but if you haven’t, I would say stick with five or six modules and really master them and once you do you will know exactly what you need to buy next. I have seen this kind of advice given so many times in this forum and I always ignored it. Now when I buy a new module, I know exactly how it will fit into my system and anyone else’s input isn’t really necessary unless I’m trying to decide between two modules with similar functionality. Anyway, enjoy the journey....

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bemushroomed
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by bemushroomed » Fri Feb 07, 2020 2:45 pm

quick impressions..

i have varigate+voltage block, and i'm decently happy but if i bought today i would probably chose something else. Read the varigate thread here especially.. it can be buggy, it can have a clock that isnt totally stable.. it seems to vary a bit between units even (the impression i get at least).

Black Hole seems really outdated to me when we now have such nice module as FX Aid.. Also note that Black Hole does not have sync in for delays (i would personally never buy any effect module that can't sync delays! Such as this or the latest tiptop ones.. totally worthless, imo).

I'd personally chose to just have BIA over also having the Cursus I. I like BIA for harsh sounds, Cursus, not so much actually. Very personal opinion ofc.

There's a mini version of warps, cheaper, smaller.. i didn't like it. just sucks with having so many options and just colors basically to go by.. but sure for a small system it might be a module you learn to adapt to.

Logic modules are fun, i would go for Logica XT, way more fun than the Pico one you have.

Get a PreenFM2 euro version instead of Cursus... the setup above is good for a nine inch nails sound, Autechre, not so much probably.. but its modular so eh, your mileage may vary.

Edit: its also more useful to post the link to your modular grid setup than to a picture of it.. so people can see it in detail.

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Pelsea
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by Pelsea » Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:29 pm

trickness wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:40 pm
I’m going to be Mr. Buzzkill/Dad here and impart some thing I learned from experience. Once I got the modular bug I very quickly put together a 12u system, buying all the latest and greatest stuff and it was an awesome feeling having piles of modules to put together. But because I Bought so much stuff, it was almost impossible to really get to know the ins and outs of every single module, all of the capabilities of each one. And even though I read lots and lots of threads about what kind of system to put together, I really just had a hodgepodge of cool shit. I ended up selling most of my euro about two years later.
If you take the voice approach, you can avoid being overwhelmed by getting one voice worth of modules at a time. You will always have something to play, and it is easier on the budget. You will also make better choices after getting some experience.
Books and tutorials on modular synthesis at http://peterelsea.com
Patch responsibly-
pqe

luupp
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by luupp » Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:33 pm

trickness wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:40 pm
I’m going to be Mr. Buzzkill/Dad here and impart some thing I learned from experience. Once I got the modular bug I very quickly put together a 12u system, buying all the latest and greatest stuff and it was an awesome feeling having piles of modules to put together. But because I Bought so much stuff, it was almost impossible to really get to know the ins and outs of every single module, all of the capabilities of each one. And even though I read lots and lots of threads about what kind of system to put together, I really just had a hodgepodge of cool shit. I ended up selling most of my euro about two years later.

Fast forward until this year I really missed having a euro system. So what I did was buy a core selection of modules and then really focus on learning them and understand exactly what I was trying to build. Perhaps you’ve already done this but if you haven’t, I would say stick with five or six modules and really master them and once you do you will know exactly what you need to buy next. I have seen this kind of advice given so many times in this forum and I always ignored it. Now when I buy a new module, I know exactly how it will fit into my system and anyone else’s input isn’t really necessary unless I’m trying to decide between two modules with similar functionality. Anyway, enjoy the journey....
Ah yeah, I forgot to mention, I have the case and I'm looking to fill it up slowly, as I will be buying everything I can used. Probably gonna take me half a year or so to fill it, which is fine, because as u said, it will allow me some time to get to know the modules I have.

luupp
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by luupp » Fri Feb 07, 2020 7:35 pm

bemushroomed wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 2:45 pm
quick impressions..

i have varigate+voltage block, and i'm decently happy but if i bought today i would probably chose something else. Read the varigate thread here especially.. it can be buggy, it can have a clock that isnt totally stable.. it seems to vary a bit between units even (the impression i get at least).

Black Hole seems really outdated to me when we now have such nice module as FX Aid.. Also note that Black Hole does not have sync in for delays (i would personally never buy any effect module that can't sync delays! Such as this or the latest tiptop ones.. totally worthless, imo).

I'd personally chose to just have BIA over also having the Cursus I. I like BIA for harsh sounds, Cursus, not so much actually. Very personal opinion ofc.

There's a mini version of warps, cheaper, smaller.. i didn't like it. just sucks with having so many options and just colors basically to go by.. but sure for a small system it might be a module you learn to adapt to.

Logic modules are fun, i would go for Logica XT, way more fun than the Pico one you have.

Get a PreenFM2 euro version instead of Cursus... the setup above is good for a nine inch nails sound, Autechre, not so much probably.. but its modular so eh, your mileage may vary.

Edit: its also more useful to post the link to your modular grid setup than to a picture of it.. so people can see it in detail.
You are totally right about the Black Hole not having a sync, big oompf. Thank you for that.
And yeah, I updated the link, as I also forgot that the picture actually changes if I change the modules lol. Sorry

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Blairio
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by Blairio » Fri Feb 07, 2020 8:02 pm

Pelsea wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 4:29 pm
trickness wrote:
Fri Feb 07, 2020 1:40 pm
I’m going to be Mr. Buzzkill/Dad here and impart some thing I learned from experience. Once I got the modular bug I very quickly put together a 12u system, buying all the latest and greatest stuff and it was an awesome feeling having piles of modules to put together. But because I Bought so much stuff, it was almost impossible to really get to know the ins and outs of every single module, all of the capabilities of each one. And even though I read lots and lots of threads about what kind of system to put together, I really just had a hodgepodge of cool shit. I ended up selling most of my euro about two years later.
If you take the voice approach, you can avoid being overwhelmed by getting one voice worth of modules at a time. You will always have something to play, and it is easier on the budget. You will also make better choices after getting some experience.
+1 on this approach. I built a single oscillator voice, added another oscillator, then a wave folder, then some more modulation sources and a mixer.. and had two (different) voices. A sequencer came next, then a spring reverb.

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dubonaire
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Re: Looking for wigglers advice on my first "bigger" setup

Post by dubonaire » Sat Feb 08, 2020 12:58 am

What do you mean by “backbone system”?

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