Stereo FX Switch module

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brandonlogic
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by brandonlogic » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:20 am

what i would do, i think its the most flexible option:
2x befaco stmix
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by brandonlogic » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:51 am

or if you had more stereo sources you could do it this way. use the 'aux' in for the return, if you dont really need an attenuator there since you'd have all the channel attenuators on the effect sender mixer. just another option.

i can hear king tubby just looking at this :rastanana:
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by ege.gonul » Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:58 am

cackland wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:05 am
ege.gonul wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 12:13 am
scragz wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 11:16 pm
cackland wrote:
Mon Feb 10, 2020 10:57 pm
I see this being a really easy module to design and build.
Just a handful of opamps, two knobs, two switches, and no fewer than FOURTEEN jacks.
You guys are overthinking it, crossfader like Doepfer and stackable cable before it going to EFX modules is all you need. Most of the modules has audio inputs which are already buffered so stackcable cables are fine to use with (no voltage drop).
We may be overthinking / over engineering something... however I like the concept and the process of implementing it as an all in one solution.
Than it's not good engineering. Engineering = doing the thing with less stuff or in a cheaper way. There is no reason to combine 3-5 modules while you can achieve the same function without any loss only with a stackable cable and single Doepfer module.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by mosorensen » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:03 am

I think there is a simpler way. Axys basically already does all of the above. First, with audio, I don't really see a need for active buffers, and passive mults are fine.

For dry/wet control, I patch the dry stereo signal into input 1 on Axys. Mult it to the effect, and send the stereo output from the effect to input 2 on Axys. This gives dry/wet control.

If needed, I can use the second half of Axys to select between two different stereo signals, and switch (or mix) what is sent as the dry stereo signal to the dry/wet control. Alternatively, I also sometimes simply use the second half of Axys to mix two stereo signals.

Axys is great for routing in stereo.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by cackland » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:07 am

ege.gonul wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 1:58 am
Than it's not good engineering. Engineering = doing the thing with less stuff or in a cheaper way. There is no reason to combine 3-5 modules while you can achieve the same function without any loss only with a stackable cable and single Doepfer module.
This is simply not true. It all depends on the application. A device may be engineered extremely well, have a significant cost / component count in comparison to other devices. Its application may be the same as other devices on the market, however it does not mean it is not good engineering.

In reference to brandonlogic's patching reference... as you can see, a dedicated module specific to this function minimizes the amount of patching, additional modules / accessories. Sure you can get the same result with modules already on the market, however I like the concept of designing and implementing something as an 'all in one' solution. Just a preference.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by brandonlogic » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:14 am

-edit
Last edited by brandonlogic on Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:43 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by ege.gonul » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:29 am

I understand it's fun to brainstorm and think about modules, but in this case, a 4hp Doepfer module with 2hp buffer can solve this effect to dry switching idea. So I think it is as simple as it gets, I don't see any downsides of this configuration other than no knob to control, and you have to have a CV to fade between dry and wet.
I never trust digital modules without true-analog signal path or dry/wet of effect module is not the right place to switch to source due to gain differences. If you search crossfade in Modulargrid, any one of those modules with a single buffer is all it's needed. Also, I was greeding last week about, four different effects going into Doepfer A-151 Switch Quad or four different effects fed by Doepfer A-151 and then effects go into STMIX. Both situations will have different sounds. The first one immediately cuts the sound and suitable for rhythmic stuff, and the second will be more like a dub effect with tails always present.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by brandonlogic » Tue Feb 11, 2020 2:38 am

Further overthinking brainstorming fun on the subject;

This module except with stereo in/outs instead mono.

Imagine that for a second!

https://www.modulargrid.net/e/low-gain- ... -dubmatrix
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:55 am

The eurorack essentials 2Xflip-sides active can do what the OP requires.
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/eurorack- ... des-active

Image

The 2xflip-sides active seems to offer Mute as well as flip. So you could also mute the signals.
All you have to do is patch it with the dry stereo signal and the wet stereo signal and it will flip between the two. You could also mute the signals altogether.

Seems like it answers the request. If fading between signals is required then I think you should take a look at the ADDAC805.VS2.
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/addac-system-addac805-vs2

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by Funky40 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:03 am

just read qickly thru the thread.......
hawkfuzz wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 11:42 pm
........but if I had two stereo sound sources and rather than patch and unpatch them I wanted a module to reroute which one was going through an effect module, allowing a dry signal when not going through the effects.
(edit: was written bevore ParanormalPatrolers post / need to check the module you linked to)
personally i think the module you want is NOT existing !
Ideally one would want to have such module in 4 hp, no ? / at least i do !!
and that module is doable. simple
.........not shure on your "out-mix configuration" vs. 2 source modules and 1 FX module


in your case do i see it this way:....in 4 hp: (all in/outs in stereo) ( no controls !! just a switch)
Has:
in A + in B /
out D as a Stereo aux send + a switch which determs if signal A or signal B is sent to the aux send: out D /
IN C for the FX signal to come in back and been added to the mix * /
.....+ a mixer stage which would mix IN A + B + C
...master out.
( no controls at all on this supersimple module ! )

thats 5 pairs of jacks plus a 2pole switch.
easily doable in 4hp !
easily doable as a kit



but "the concept i described" just lacks something. its not flexible enough.
but personally: available as a kit it would be worth it for me to pay some 50-60 maybe 70 bucks.

my personal wish is the other way around:
1 stereo source but 2 FX modules, now switch thru ONE switch to which FX the source Sound goes. Mix the source and the used FX.
:hmm: could also work with the above module by adding just one switch more, not shure ? :hmm:
---> IMHO the trick would be to create such a module that would wourk for more patch situations.
The new WMD module that wass linked is super nice, but it would not do it "for me" for such a patch.



personally i ended up for now to build my own stereo A-B switch module with a funny "bottom or top" in/out configuration ( since the mimeophone has the jacks on top),
adding a WMD Axis stereo crossfader plus a Happy Nerding 3x stereo mixer into the pulk of some stereo modules.
plus i have several more crossfaders around that ( two: WMD Blender plus a IJ ufade ( soon replaced by another HN 2x Crossfade)
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by Rigo » Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:19 am

A-150-8 Octal Manual/Voltage Controlled Programmable Switches ? If you just want to switch, and not mix.
4 channels that work together (2 from input to the 2 effects, and 2 from the effects back), and 2 that take the original input and what comes back from the 2 channels above so you can use that to switch between dry and wet.
And you still have 2 channels of switching left.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by brandonlogic » Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:28 am

A lot of these options may work in theory, but in practice you might find you want individual control of levels and mix.
With my befaco Stmix patch, you have full control of the both send and return mixes.
Crossfaders and switches are not going to give you as much flexibility, which you might not realize Is important until your using it. With crossfaders your stuck with the relative mix of the blend curvature of the crossfader. Which may be ok on the send to the effect but on the return your going to be mixing between a minimum of three stereo channels. I wouldn’t want to use a crossfader for that, I’d want individual pots for each, to get the exact mix I want of the two dry signals and wet signal.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by hawkfuzz » Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:59 am

I really appreciate the post with the patches and ideas. I didn't realize that I may have wanted blend to be a thing, but I do.
Funky40 wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:03 am
my personal wish is the other way around:
1 stereo source but 2 FX modules, now switch thru ONE switch to which FX the source Sound goes. Mix the source and the used FX.
My initial idea I wrote down on a piece of paper was for two stereo sources and two fx modules, but when I made the thread I decided to reduce to clarify the idea. I imagined it was already a module and once I found one FX loop I could find or easily make a solution for another fx.

brandonlogic wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:28 am
A lot of these options may work in theory, but in practice you might find you want individual control of levels and mix.
With my befaco Stmix patch, you have full control of the both send and return mixes.
Crossfaders and switches are not going to give you as much flexibility, which you might not realize Is important until your using it. With crossfaders your stuck with the relative mix of the blend curvature of the crossfader. Which may be ok on the send to the effect but on the return your going to be mixing between a minimum of three stereo channels. I wouldn’t want to use a crossfader for that, I’d want individual pots for each, to get the exact mix I want of the two dry signals and wet signal.
He said ‘never lose the ability to use them regardless of routing’ feel mixers are best most flexible option.
That patch makes the most sense. A lot of patching, but looks great.
Paranormal Patroler wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 3:55 am
The eurorack essentials 2Xflip-sides active can do what the OP requires.
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/eurorack- ... des-active

Image

The 2xflip-sides active seems to offer Mute as well as flip. So you could also mute the signals.
All you have to do is patch it with the dry stereo signal and the wet stereo signal and it will flip between the two. You could also mute the signals altogether.

Seems like it answers the request. If fading between signals is required then I think you should take a look at the ADDAC805.VS2.
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/addac-system-addac805-vs2

Image
Gotta look into this. Looks pretty close to what I imagined initially.



This is when having my ZOIA helps in trying an idea. You can build with blocks to find what works best. Unfortunately not as much physical input control as I'd like, but it works.
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by Funky40 » Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:26 am

brandonlogic wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:28 am
.......... but in practice you might find you want individual control of levels and mix.
i agree in general, yes.

in a jamming context do i find crossfaders ( stereo where needed) extremly useful !
A gainstaging of the single modules could be patched in front of the X-fader.

so far i have one 3x stereo mix from Happy nerding. its perfect for this. plus the WMD axis.

switches could also be seen as another level of just the same patch.
when it comes to jamms do i definitly want to be able to just change things by the flick of a switch.

personally, to me, its all that stuff that brings the "soundmaker" modules to real shine.
i´m further in process to give this "little helper" stuff more and more space within my rig.

so my personal verdict:
i would not play one way to patch against the other since different patchlevels can exist side by side respectivly behind each other.
One patchlevel for the perfect adjustments, another for the quick changes for example.
yes, this can end with the need that the required modules doubles at some point. the stereo mixer part for example
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by Paranormal Patroler » Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:31 am

hawkfuzz wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:59 am
Gotta look into this. Looks pretty close to what I imagined initially.
Looking at the ADDAC805v2, I think that's your best bet. With the proper CV control, you can do all kinds of crazy.
Seems like you can crossfade between wet/dry stereo signals, and then cross-fade between LR of the output as well. Which is even wilder than you requested!
You'd be able to cross-fade the cross-fade.

You can also set the master into VCA instead of cross-fade, so that gives you cross-fade between wet/dry and then VCA of the stereo signal for muting, or fade-ins or whatnot. I like the on-board attenuversion for everything.

Crap, I think I'm sold. Didn't realize I needed one until this thread :hihi:
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by hawkfuzz » Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:06 pm

:lol: :lol:
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by cptnal » Tue Feb 11, 2020 4:51 pm

Paranormal Patroler wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:31 am
hawkfuzz wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 7:59 am
Gotta look into this. Looks pretty close to what I imagined initially.
Looking at the ADDAC805v2, I think that's your best bet. With the proper CV control, you can do all kinds of crazy.
Seems like you can crossfade between wet/dry stereo signals, and then cross-fade between LR of the output as well. Which is even wilder than you requested!
You'd be able to cross-fade the cross-fade.

You can also set the master into VCA instead of cross-fade, so that gives you cross-fade between wet/dry and then VCA of the stereo signal for muting, or fade-ins or whatnot. I like the on-board attenuversion for everything.

Crap, I think I'm sold. Didn't realize I needed one until this thread :hihi:
On my radar too. Cross fade the cross fade.. :dizzy:

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by igorrr » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:28 pm

When I needed stereo switch – I did dual 4 HP module for that.
Shown in this video

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by hawkfuzz » Tue Feb 11, 2020 5:47 pm

That's nifty.
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by cackland » Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:20 pm

I plan to expand on these ideas and develop a custom module.

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by DanW » Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:46 pm

hawkfuzz wrote:
Sun Feb 09, 2020 11:42 pm
Maybe I'm too zoomed in, but if I had two stereo sound sources and rather than patch and unpatch them I wanted a module to reroute which one was going through an effect module, allowing a dry signal when not going through the effects.

For example, if I have a Morphagene and a SMR and wanted to route them through a Mimeophon at different times or perhaps the same time, but never lose the ability to use them regardless of routing. Usually an effects loop serves this, but that's usually one source and mono.
I made a module for that purpose, or actually a general one for anything. http://dpw.se/product/switch-sw-1/
It's four individual switches so you could use half of that module for stereo. The front panel layout is made for stereo use. CV controllable of cause.
If you then pair it with my Zero module as a controller you can get click free switching from DC up to high audio rate. At audio rate you can get some pretty interesting effects :-)
http://dpw.se/product/zero-z-1-dual-zero-difference/
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by hawkfuzz » Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:13 pm

cackland wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:20 pm
I plan to expand on these ideas and develop a custom module.
Keep me in the loop.
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by cackland » Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:22 pm

hawkfuzz wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 8:13 pm
cackland wrote:
Tue Feb 11, 2020 6:20 pm
I plan to expand on these ideas and develop a custom module.
Keep me in the loop.
Will do :)

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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by hawkfuzz » Tue Feb 11, 2020 9:35 pm

I think this is my idea. I added a order switch for shits and giggles. I bet CV jacks could be added for some functions.
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Re: Stereo FX Switch module

Post by cackland » Wed Feb 12, 2020 2:00 pm

Ok cool.

A few questions. So two stereo in / out. What are the 'osc' jacks? And they cascade into each other?
The switches = 1 into 2, or 2 into one. This is routing the either stereo input A or stereo input B into the output of another?
The other switch = 1 or 2? Same question... how does this affect the routing?
The DW switch = Dry / Wet Switch?
The crossfaders at the bottom? Are they crossfading the dry / wet signal from stereo in A to stereo out A (same with stereo in B)? Or is this crossfading the blend between A and B into the outputs A and B?
The 'blend' at the bottom? Is this 9mm Attenuator pots? What do they do?

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Its good to see other ideas / designs / drawings to gauge how wigglers think about modules and their perception of how they'd use them.

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