Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

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sillyquestions?
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Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:42 pm

Hi,

Was wondering if someone here could explain too me what's going on when I go from a channel on maths into the OSC FM? Cant seem to get the same effect with any other module. Recently sold my maths, could someone tell me a module that does the same thing?

Cheers

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luketeaford
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Post by luketeaford » Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:46 pm

It depends entirely on what CH 1 is-- but let's say it's self-patched and it's a triangle wave at ~5Hz. When you patch to Osc FM it's going Up/Down (or Down/Up if inverted) to its maximum amplitude at that rate.

If CH 1 is a gate that it's slewing, it could be acting as an envelope. It could be an audio rate signal etc.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:58 pm

Ah.. thanks for the reply. I forgot too say I was hitting the cycle button also. Not sure if this changes things.
Cheers

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by luketeaford » Mon Mar 23, 2020 9:09 pm

sillyquestions? wrote:
Mon Mar 23, 2020 5:58 pm
Ah.. thanks for the reply. I forgot too say I was hitting the cycle button also. Not sure if this changes things.
Cheers
Yes, it makes the function repeat :)

So I'm going to assume you've turned on cycle and then sent it to FM your oscillator. That is a unipolar output which is less common on other oscillators. You could use Maths to do half-wave rectification and then get only the positive portion of the waveform or if you have an A172 patch a 0V signal and your oscillator output into it first and then take the MAX OUT.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:35 am

I mean, thanks for the insight.. it’s answerrs like that, that make me feel stupid. I should really learn more about modular instead of just buying 😄

0v? What do you mean? Don’t have an a172z I’ll check it out though. Would this give me the same sound as what happens when I do it with maths? Totally in love with the sound but for me it was the only use for maths and couldn’t justify keeping it for that.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by Dragonaut » Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:11 pm

Most likely you were frequency modulating the oscillator at audio rates. If you send Maths to an FM input it’s either going to make the pitch go up and down slowly (relatively speaking) or very fast. Fast sounds really cool. Slow can be good for some things too.
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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:52 pm

Dragonaut wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:11 pm
Most likely you were frequency modulating the oscillator at audio rates. If you send Maths to an FM input it’s either going to make the pitch go up and down slowly (relatively speaking) or very fast. Fast sounds really cool. Slow can be good for some things too.

Yeah, I mean from what I know it sounded like it could have been this, however.. whenever I stick FM into audio rate LFO it will do something similar, except it's pretty much on ever at one frequency if that makes sense. Where as with maths there was so many different frequencies.. Now i've sold my maths i'm now after something that does the exact same.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:54 pm

What about the befaco rampage? :hmm:

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by luketeaford » Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:59 pm

sillyquestions? wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 5:52 pm
Dragonaut wrote:
Tue Mar 24, 2020 7:11 pm
Most likely you were frequency modulating the oscillator at audio rates. If you send Maths to an FM input it’s either going to make the pitch go up and down slowly (relatively speaking) or very fast. Fast sounds really cool. Slow can be good for some things too.

Yeah, I mean from what I know it sounded like it could have been this, however.. whenever I stick FM into audio rate LFO it will do something similar, except it's pretty much on ever at one frequency if that makes sense. Where as with maths there was so many different frequencies.. Now i've sold my maths i'm now after something that does the exact same.
This sounds like you were patching audio into Maths and cycling it or possibly doing the subharmonics. I don't have a Rampage, but it will probably do the same kind of thing-- I think it has switched modes unlike maths so will only sound like that particular sound in the desired range.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:03 pm

Thanks for the reply Luke. FM was going in to Maths and then cycling it. Cool, something too think about. Shouldn't have sold the maths but I couldnt justify that price for what I was using it for :foul:

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by luketeaford » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:15 pm

sillyquestions? wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:03 pm
Thanks for the reply Luke. FM was going in to Maths and then cycling it. Cool, something too think about. Shouldn't have sold the maths but I couldnt justify that price for what I was using it for :foul:
You mean one of the maths channels was cycling and going into the FM on an oscillator? I would expect that to sound mostly the same except that it's unipolar and it might have to do with the shape of the cycling maths function. In my experience, large changes in oscillator pitch don't happen instantly-- there is a slight or sometimes pronounced slewing that happens so if you do it you can kinda hear this weird "whoosh" sound.

I love Maths because you can do so much with it-- very useful for demonstrating a lot of patch ideas even though in some patches maybe you're using all 20hp as just a logic invertor or a mixer or "boring utilities" that people say.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by seta666 » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:27 pm

You can get pretty crazy sounds, I sent 0-coast square into ch1, modulated it with ch2 and then into 0-coast fm...I could jam for hours..there was some more patching involved, I just do not remember...like a slope circuit as an extra OSC..maybe was that one into ch1 :hmm:

...just patch, experimentand gave fun , I do not think you will not break it :sb:

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:35 pm

luketeaford wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:15 pm
sillyquestions? wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:03 pm
Thanks for the reply Luke. FM was going in to Maths and then cycling it. Cool, something too think about. Shouldn't have sold the maths but I couldnt justify that price for what I was using it for :foul:
You mean one of the maths channels was cycling and going into the FM on an oscillator? I would expect that to sound mostly the same except that it's unipolar and it might have to do with the shape of the cycling maths function. In my experience, large changes in oscillator pitch don't happen instantly-- there is a slight or sometimes pronounced slewing that happens so if you do it you can kinda hear this weird "whoosh" sound.

I love Maths because you can do so much with it-- very useful for demonstrating a lot of patch ideas even though in some patches maybe you're using all 20hp as just a logic invertor or a mixer or "boring utilities" that people say.

Yeah, exactly. Well.. i'm not really sure how you would explain it. Maybe you could try it? Or maybe you know what i'm on about. I dunno. Now I think of it, whenever I moved the rise or the fall button with the channel 1 attenuator up towards the top it would do similar noises to what happens when you stick fm into an LFO at audio rate but there was just a huge amount more sound differences and pitch changes ( maybe thats a better way of explaining it )

I guess i'm not at that stage yet, i'm still learning. I can almost never make the sounds I want with my eurorack setup but one thing I wish for now is too get that sound back. One day i'll be a master of it :hmm:

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by luketeaford » Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:41 pm

When you say "stick fm into an LFO at audio rate" I have three questions:
1. FM is "frequency modulation" so I think of that as a thing you patch INTO not patch from "FM" into an LFO.
3. What is audio rate? The LFO? The modulation you're applying to it?
2. Is it possible what you're describing is just an 8V envelope vs a 5V one?

It all just takes practice and experimenting! If you can find an example of the sound you're after, someone here can probably help you.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Wed Mar 25, 2020 7:02 pm

luketeaford wrote:
Wed Mar 25, 2020 6:41 pm
When you say "stick fm into an LFO at audio rate" I have three questions:
1. FM is "frequency modulation" so I think of that as a thing you patch INTO not patch from "FM" into an LFO.
3. What is audio rate? The LFO? The modulation you're applying to it?
2. Is it possible what you're describing is just an 8V envelope vs a 5V one?

It all just takes practice and experimenting! If you can find an example of the sound you're after, someone here can probably help you.
1 - Yeah, I got mixed up there
2 - LFO audio rate I think...
3 - no idea what you're talking about :guinness:

Im not sure I've any sound examples! Not too worry.

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Thu Apr 02, 2020 2:16 pm

Okay... so just too cap this one off.. apologies for coming back too it.

I've literally just discovered that theres a make noise function... it looks identical to one side of the maths except no attenuator. Done a little reading about it and it seems that the function is 1 channel of maths without a few other things.

The output of maths channel one was going into the FM of my oscillator and I was hitting cycle on the maths to achieve the sound I wanted.. I notice the function has the cycle etc... but doesn't have that dedicated output that the maths had (Labeled 1).. is there another place for it that Im missing or is it just not there?

:hail: :confused:

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by Agawell » Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:28 pm

it has +ve and -ve instead

+ve is like turning maths channel 1 attenuverter fully cw
-ve is like turning maths channel 1 attenuverter fully ccw

by the look of it..

if you want to get the attenuverter functionality crossfade the 2 outputs

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Re: Maths channel 1 out, into OSC FM

Post by sillyquestions? » Thu Apr 02, 2020 4:28 pm

Agawell wrote:
Thu Apr 02, 2020 3:28 pm
it has +ve and -ve instead

+ve is like turning maths channel 1 attenuverter fully cw
-ve is like turning maths channel 1 attenuverter fully ccw

by the look of it..

if you want to get the attenuverter functionality crossfade the 2 outputs

Cool, thanks a bunch!

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