Knobs Recorders

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bluesmoke
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Knobs Recorders

Post by bluesmoke » Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:14 pm

It seems like the preferred module for recording knobs wiggling is the Flame C3 which has been around for quite a while. I have to say that the Flame C3 looks basically perfect and reasonably priced but I wonder if there are other alternatives out there. Perhaps something with a clock input and the option to loop the recordings every X number of bars.
Last edited by bluesmoke on Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:22 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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Carrousel
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by Carrousel » Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:34 pm

Tete and tetrapad together are a brilliant solution for knob recording (although it’s really slider recording obviously). You can record and playback gestures on any of the different tetrapad channel options (including mono and bipolar CV sliders, for standard ‘knob recording’). These gestures can all be looped and synced to a clock for as many bars as you like, with an upper recording limit of something like 5 minutes. I’ve found mine to be a bit temperamental with the clock settings but I got it to work perfectly with some deep settings changes (separating the looper from the clock input and instead syncing it to a trigger with the same repeating period as the desired loop length; then also using the reset input for added security).
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comacomfort
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by comacomfort » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:01 pm

none of the ones i've found are 16 bit or 24 bit, theyre all 12 bit. which is literal garbage, you''ll get stepping on slow movements and harmonics and artifacts when trying to open and close a vca on something with little harmonic content.

So the best knob recorder would actually be a self made one, using a sampler that has dc coupled sampling. Run an offset generator like the intellijel triplatt into a alm squid salmple, and you have 4 recorded knob voltages from a single source

or use an offset generator with rossum assimil80r

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ersatzplanet
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by ersatzplanet » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:09 pm

I use a Planar2. Though not exactly a "knob" it works for me.

If this was a more important thing to me, and I had the cash, the Analogue Systems RS-450 is the box to get. Four channels, 16-bit, up to 14K sampling rate. Cost $1200 in the states though.
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buyingitwontmakeucool
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by buyingitwontmakeucool » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:28 pm

bluesmoke wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:14 pm
What are the options in 2021?
Mostly just shiny objects

Spindrift
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by Spindrift » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:38 pm

Looked into this recently as well. Ideally I would like something that can record any CV source, be it a knob, joystick or for example the Koma Kommander.

The only possible new contender to Flame I could come up with is DROID CV processor which seems like it might be possible to set up as a nice CV recorder. Haven't got one yet though, so not a recommendation, but might be worth checking out.

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SOPiiAC
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by SOPiiAC » Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:43 pm

The new Erica Synths Black Joystick 2 looks like the new king of recorded gestures to me.

bluesmoke
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by bluesmoke » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:15 pm

Carrousel wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:34 pm
Tete and tetrapad together are a brilliant solution for knob recording (although it’s really slider recording obviously).
Solid advice, a tad too big for my rack but Intellijel can't be faulted. Thank you for the recommendation.

bluesmoke
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by bluesmoke » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:23 pm

comacomfort wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:01 pm
none of the ones i've found are 16 bit or 24 bit, theyre all 12 bit. which is literal garbage, you''ll get stepping on slow movements and harmonics and artifacts when trying to open and close a vca on something with little harmonic content.
Something I didn't consider at all honestly but that's right, Flame C3 records at 12 bit. Isn't the output interpolated? It's for a rack I use for live techno/house so it should be okay, surprised no similar alternatives exist. The original Flame C3 is about 10 years old now.

Audiodaan
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by Audiodaan » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:52 pm

I use an Octatrack and FH-2 for this. I can record knob movement on Octatrack midi tracks which are then sent as CV into the rack via the FH-2.

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ferran
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by ferran » Sun Feb 21, 2021 4:54 pm

buyingitwontmakeucool wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:28 pm
bluesmoke wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 12:14 pm
What are the options in 2021?
Mostly just shiny objects
Nihil novum sub sole.

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MvK
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by MvK » Sun Feb 21, 2021 5:52 pm

I find the problem with joysticks is, that you always have to record both axis X and Y. If in a performance you are really happy with the movement on one axis there is no way keeping it while recording the other axis.

StrangeAttraction
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by StrangeAttraction » Sun Feb 21, 2021 6:30 pm

Ehem
Search feature, people. I literally started like two threads about this in the past two months.
BTW - I purchased Voltage Block to do the knob recording thing. It's not a precise knob recording, but it doesn't the job, especially for a noisy techno

viewtopic.php?f=16&t=244671&hilit=knob+recorder
viewtopic.php?f=16&t=238704&hilit=knob+recorder

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Dcramer
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by Dcramer » Sun Feb 21, 2021 7:01 pm

I’ve got the Flame C3 with the latest firmware and yes, it’s quite nice. You can get it to record one incoming CV instead of the knob on this version. I haven’t noticed any stepping but then I’m usually using it for modulate-the-modulator kinda stuff. You can also have it start on a trigger and do a one shot. If every channel had all the features of chan one it’d be great 👍

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Peng33
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by Peng33 » Sun Feb 21, 2021 7:19 pm

I know that the Squarp Pyramid can record CV (or create CV via a touchpad), so you could record the CV resulting from knob movements, I would venture to guess. And the Eurorack equivalent is the Squarp Hermod, so again, I would venture to guess this is also capable of doing so, but correct me if I am wrong.

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evs
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by evs » Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:29 am

comacomfort wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 2:01 pm
none of the ones i've found are 16 bit or 24 bit, theyre all 12 bit. which is literal garbage, you''ll get stepping on slow movements and harmonics and artifacts when trying to open and close a vca on something with little harmonic content.

So the best knob recorder would actually be a self made one, using a sampler that has dc coupled sampling. Run an offset generator like the intellijel triplatt into a alm squid salmple, and you have 4 recorded knob voltages from a single source

or use an offset generator with rossum assimil80r
The Flame Quad cv recorder is 16bit!

And the Blackbox can record cv..

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LDT
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by LDT » Mon Feb 22, 2021 5:03 am

Peng33 wrote:
Sun Feb 21, 2021 7:19 pm
I know that the Squarp Pyramid can record CV (or create CV via a touchpad), so you could record the CV resulting from knob movements, I would venture to guess. And the Eurorack equivalent is the Squarp Hermod, so again, I would venture to guess this is also capable of doing so, but correct me if I am wrong.
Yup, I use my Hermod for knob recording. Works like a charm.

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Spacelordmother
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Re: Knobs Recorders in 2021

Post by Spacelordmother » Mon Feb 22, 2021 7:53 am

evs wrote:
Mon Feb 22, 2021 2:29 am
And the Blackbox can record cv..
Yup -- I do this with my Duatt into Bitbox Micro. Specs say it records at 24 bit. Works great!

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minimalist
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by minimalist » Mon Feb 22, 2021 8:25 am

I have the Flame C3 mk2 and think it is great. This module (and its destinations) are the only modules I re-patch when playing. It's just like three extra hands. I never felt that 12bit was a problem as it isn't something I notice.

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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by EPTC » Tue Feb 23, 2021 1:19 am

Love LOVE my Pot Action Recorder from EMW
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StrangeAttraction
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by StrangeAttraction » Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:46 am

I got Voltage Block for motion recording. It isn't quite the same, as it's step recording per clock pulse, but it gives you 8 channels of modulations.
Flame C-3 mk2 is still on my mind though.
I have also recorded knob twiddling nto Ableton MIDI clips followed by ES-9 for MIDI to CV conversion. Works well. Pretty sure any MIDI-to-CV convertor would work well here.

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ersatzplanet
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Re: Knobs Recorders

Post by ersatzplanet » Tue Feb 23, 2021 2:19 pm

StrangeAttraction wrote:
Tue Feb 23, 2021 4:46 am
I got Voltage Block for motion recording. It isn't quite the same, as it's step recording per clock pulse, but it gives you 8 channels of modulations.
Flame C-3 mk2 is still on my mind though.
I have also recorded knob twiddling nto Ableton MIDI clips followed by ES-9 for MIDI to CV conversion. Works well. Pretty sure any MIDI-to-CV convertor would work well here.
For recording CVs to MIDI you can also use a ADDAC221 or other CV to MIDI CC converter though the Expert Sleeper stuff is great for this too. The advantage of the other modules like the ADDAC one, is that you can also directly control MIDI synthesizers or hardware without the computer. I use a Doepfer A-190-1 to drive my Nord Modular from CV controllers in my modular for instance. I could easily record them also If I wanted to keep them. The monster is the RS-450 of course, but you have to pay a bunch to get it.
-James

James Husted - Synthwerks, LLC - www.synthwerks.com - info@synthwerks.com - james@synthwerks.com
Synthwerks is a proud member of the Mostly Modular Trade Association (http://www.mostlymodular.com).
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