What are you using for end of chain reverb and delay?

[studio460]

. . . I have a Capistan or a Space Echo in the list but I have some doubts about how they'll work as an end of chain (not as sends).

If you're referring to the Boss RE20, i don't recommend it. Its reverb sounds absolutely horrible—extremely metallic, shallow and shitty (I plan to trade mine in at Guitar Center so I don't get an irate Reverb buyer). Stick with the Strymon units for this—can't go wrong with any of them! By the way, all of my pedals work fine patched with my modular directly (not as sends).

. . . I've found my best bang for the buck is to use a tiptop zverb and echoz in each send and return. These modules are mono in stereo out, so I didn't find a lot of use for them at first, but they work perfectly in this capacity. Each module has 24 algorithms, so almost endless combinations . . .

So I re-organized my pedals and reverted them all back to synth-duty, since I've found I really prefer having modular-effects in the rack. I just ordered both the Tiptop ZVERB and ECHOZ in black from Detroit Modular using points and discount codes, so not too bad. Also, having more individual effects-modules in the rack will ultimately be more useful for me than say, a Tiptop Z-DSP. Also, I think the new Tiptop units sound really good, offer decent variety (24 algos per unit), and look really attractive as well.

[Bachelard]

Currently FX Aid. I also run my system through a Timefactor but i only use it as a looper.

Or VSTs. I love the M4L Convolution Reverb in Ableton Live, and the Sonic Charge Echobode. Those are probably my 2 go-to for post-recording reverb/delay.

[Accelra]

Since I was unconvinced by Eurorack reverbs, I've stuck with the following:

Meris Mercury 7, Strymon BigSky, Strymon Volante, Source Audio Collider, Neunaber WET, 2x Roland RE-501 (spring).

I'm interested finding out more about the upcoming Qu-Bit Aurora spectral reverb in terms of Eurorack. Other than that maybe the Chase Bliss Audio CXM 1978 or Universal Audio Golden Reverberator (apparently it wasn't designed for line input though!).

[studio460]

. . . I've stuck with the following: Meris Mercury 7, Strymon BigSky, Strymon Volante, Source Audio Collider, Neunaber WET, 2x Roland RE-501 (spring) . . .

Wow! Can't go wrong with any of those! I got the Source Audio Collider and am pretty happy with it, but now it's married to my Waldorf Quantum and I f'ing LOVE it there! I just couldn't get along using pedals and my modular (also, not enough desk-space), so I put them all back and got the Tiptop modules (and a 2hp Verb) instead.

I think they sound pretty good in the Tiptop demo below. Maybe someday I'll switch back especially since I went and bought those Mazzatron patch bays (which are great!).

[slumberjack]

I guess the issue converting eurorack signals to guitar level.

I don’t believe I’ve ever had a problem with this, even with cheaper pedals. Are you afraid the signal wouldn’t be hot enough? I’m sure a signal booster would take care of this just fine.

Interesting. It’s better to convert. Even for a fx/send path. It’s like if you ran an analog synth directly through pedals without using a DI or preamp.

In Euro there is are a few cheap modules which do that, I have an ADDAC for about 70$...but I never use it, then with the standalone synths too - I never have to use a DI or an amp to get my levels good. Maybe after you patched 4 pedal in a row to filter hum out,

The point being ~ there is different impendance between these 3 enviroments. 9v guitar pedal also has different headroom. You can easily notice that if you run a line level analog synth through something like Boss overdrive/distortion. “To filter out the hum” ~ no ~ by using x pedals in a row. If there is hum somewhere in your setup it will be in the whole signal path. Noise can be managed by noise to db ratio and eliminated that way (by recording hot) but things like interference, ground loops, hum, crackling, reverse phase in your outlet and much much more won’t go away by chaining pedals.

TBH I never had issues like noise or hum, I never used a DI I just thought that could be usefil to balance the signal if problem with the signal rise. I use the pedals always 100% wet and have the dry signal mixed on the desk so the dry signal stays untouched. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!

[studio460]

By the way, does anyone here use a Klark Teknik 3rd Dimension BBD-320 for actual end-of-chain? It's gotten rave reviews and is cheap as chips. I'm starting to collect multiple effects-units, mainly because I'm often using so many concurrent voices, so I don't really have an end-of-chain, use-case, per se.

[Lindstrommodular]

If it's a purely end of chain effect, I do it using a computer

[Accelra]

By the way, does anyone here use a Klark Teknik 3rd Dimension BBD-320 for actual end-of-chain? It's gotten rave reviews and is cheap as chips. I'm starting to collect multiple effects-units, mainly because I'm often using so many concurrent voices, so I don't really have an end-of-chain, use-case, per se.

I've been tempted since I love the Roland chorus sound. Rare to see the original rack units come up.

[DoverBeach]

Mimeophon and desmodus versio. If I need something different I use the octatrack. The effects on the octa aren't the best but sequencing, p-locking , crossfading effects can lead to great results.

[dubonaire]

I use a Doepfer spring reverb, Eventide H9, Strymon BigSky, Strymon NightSky and Valhalla Supermassive.

Do the Eventide H9 and Strymon receive the eurorack signal directly? Do the pedals work well with eurorack levels? I have a Capistan or a Space Echo in the list but I have some doubts about how they'll work as an end of chain (not as sends).

I interface my Eurorack with balanced I/O modules so I can't really help.

Strymon says its pedals can take up to 8dBu so the signal might be a bit hot. Also note that Strymon pedals can be configured for instrument or line level.

[ZenitSar]

Chronoblob and whatever reverb is on the board or amp. If recording I usually do all delay and reverb in the box.

[hel1]

Erica Synths Black Stereo Delay, and an FX aid are my weapons of choice at this moment.

[flashheart]

By the way, does anyone here use a Klark Teknik 3rd Dimension BBD-320 for actual end-of-chain? It's gotten rave reviews and is cheap as chips. I'm starting to collect multiple effects-units, mainly because I'm often using so many concurrent voices, so I don't really have an end-of-chain, use-case, per se.

I've been tempted since I love the Roland chorus sound. Rare to see the original rack units come up.

It's not really an effect, more of a very subtle chorus 'stereoiser' / thickener. The effect is v nice but it's not the same as the usual Roland chorus sound at all. I'd regard it more as part of an FX chain rather than a thing on it's own.

[flashheart]

I guess the issue converting eurorack signals to guitar level.

I don’t believe I’ve ever had a problem with this, even with cheaper pedals. Are you afraid the signal wouldn’t be hot enough? I’m sure a signal booster would take care of this just fine.

Interesting. It’s better to convert. Even for a fx/send path. It’s like if you ran an analog synth directly through pedals without using a DI or preamp.

In Euro there is are a few cheap modules which do that, I have an ADDAC for about 70$...but I never use it, then with the standalone synths too - I never have to use a DI or an amp to get my levels good. Maybe after you patched 4 pedal in a row to filter hum out,

The point being ~ there is different impendance between these 3 enviroments. 9v guitar pedal also has different headroom. You can easily notice that if you run a line level analog synth through something like Boss overdrive/distortion. “To filter out the hum” ~ no ~ by using x pedals in a row. If there is hum somewhere in your setup it will be in the whole signal path. Noise can be managed by noise to db ratio and eliminated that way (by recording hot) but things like interference, ground loops, hum, crackling, reverse phase in your outlet and much much more won’t go away by chaining pedals.

TBH I never had issues like noise or hum, I never used a DI I just thought that could be usefil to balance the signal if problem with the signal rise. I use the pedals always 100% wet and have the dry signal mixed on the desk so the dry signal stays untouched. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!

If you want to reduce noise a DI is the last thing you should use, it's designed to drop a signal to microphone level for feeding into a mic preamp. Generally you need to attenuate eurorack to work with pedals / line level. Impedance matching doesn't really matter with pedals, they've mostly around 1MOhm input impedance which euro is fine with. The one possible exception is overdrive/distortion pedals which are designed to interact with the guitar's volume knob (which has a much higher impedance) and a DI won't fix this.
I usually send my Euro directly into a TC Hall of Fame and an MXR Carbon Copy w/o issues.

It’s better to convert. Even for a fx/send path. It’s like if you ran an analog synth directly through pedals without using a DI or preamp.

Again never had problems doing this, synths are mostly line level and you have just have to watch the levels for pedals, DI box does little (and in fact does the opposite of a preamp).
Radial have done a fine job over the years selling DI boxes to people who don't really need them

[Brad s]

Oto bim and bam are the always-on effects, but an fx aid and a parasites microcell give me the cv controlled stuff I need.

Do you use an attenuation module (strymon AA1, ALM SBG, etc...) in between your eurorack and the BIM and BAM?

[Multi Grooves]

Tiptop Echoz delay in euro, OTO BAM for verb. I use Frap CGM which has mono send and stereo return. Occasionally I'll use either a Machine Drum effects or a 301 Space echo that again, I can attenuate the hot signals via the mixer.

Like others have said, I dint see the immediate need to cv the fook outta reverb, so...

[Foghorn]

I guess the issue converting eurorack signals to guitar level.

I don’t believe I’ve ever had a problem with this, even with cheaper pedals. Are you afraid the signal wouldn’t be hot enough? I’m sure a signal booster would take care of this just fine.

Interesting. It’s better to convert. Even for a fx/send path. It’s like if you ran an analog synth directly through pedals without using a DI or preamp.

In Euro there is are a few cheap modules which do that, I have an ADDAC for about 70$...but I never use it, then with the standalone synths too - I never have to use a DI or an amp to get my levels good. Maybe after you patched 4 pedal in a row to filter hum out,

The point being ~ there is different impendance between these 3 enviroments. 9v guitar pedal also has different headroom. You can easily notice that if you run a line level analog synth through something like Boss overdrive/distortion. “To filter out the hum” ~ no ~ by using x pedals in a row. If there is hum somewhere in your setup it will be in the whole signal path. Noise can be managed by noise to db ratio and eliminated that way (by recording hot) but things like interference, ground loops, hum, crackling, reverse phase in your outlet and much much more won’t go away by chaining pedals.

TBH I never had issues like noise or hum, I never used a DI I just thought that could be usefil to balance the signal if problem with the signal rise. I use the pedals always 100% wet and have the dry signal mixed on the desk so the dry signal stays untouched. Thanks for sharing your knowledge!

If you want to reduce noise a DI is the last thing you should use, it's designed to drop a signal to microphone level for feeding into a mic preamp. Generally you need to attenuate eurorack to work with pedals / line level. Impedance matching doesn't really matter with pedals, they've mostly around 1MOhm input impedance which euro is fine with. The one possible exception is overdrive/distortion pedals which are designed to interact with the guitar's volume knob (which has a much higher impedance) and a DI won't fix this.
I usually send my Euro directly into a TC Hall of Fame and an MXR Carbon Copy w/o issues.

It’s better to convert. Even for a fx/send path. It’s like if you ran an analog synth directly through pedals without using a DI or preamp.

.
I have an IME Black Locust "Quad effects pedal amplifier interface" module.
.
It works quite well for inserting effects pedals into Euro.
Plus, you can put it mid chain with no issues.
And it can be used as an instrument preamp (to use with a guitar or mic)
It requires custom dual TS to single TRS cables (not really a problem).
It is one of the first modules that I bought, but until I saw this thread I had totally forgot about it.
Actually I thought I sold it years ago (2015) but just found it in a box.
.
I bought it on EBAY in early 2015
thanks thread.

PS. sorry about the giant stolen quote

EDIT: misspelled quote (quite)

[pricklyrobot]

I’ve got two Boss VF-1’s in the fx sends of my mixer for general stuff. Plus a Volante and an EHX Cathedral on the pedal board that I can swap in for special duties.

Regarding synths into pedals, I guess the totally proper way to do it would be:

synth > re-amp box > pedal > (DI, maybe) > pre-amp/amp (to get it back up to synth level)

But, as others have said, a lot off pedals will give you a decent sound just tweaking levels in and out. Vintage-style fuzzes are the only things I usually have to futz with much.

[nexgen23]

FX Aid, Mimeophon, Beads will each sometimes go at end of chain. I've got a Desmodus on the way, so Desmodus/Electus probably will see a lot of use if I don't decide it has to be Ruina full time

Otherwise, VST plugins. I like several, but the top three are all Valhalla (Delay, Supermassive and Plate).

I think this is a good selection of effects to have in a rack, Mimeophone is almost a requirement lol, and FX Aid/Desmodus (any of the Versio's) are both really flexible in that they can be different effects, not just a delay or reverb, I need to flash Ruina to myn to check it out, just have not got around to it yet. I have a similar setup (though no Beads, not a huge fan of the Clouds/Beads sound) as well as a Tascam mixer which allows me to route audio into a DAW for VST effects, and then back to the mixer. Any of Valhalla's stuff is ace as hell!

[studio460]

Tiptop Echoz delay in euro, OTO BAM for verb . . . Like others have said, I dint see the immediate need to cv the fook outta reverb, so...

How do you like your Tiptop ECHOZ? I just bought one (don't have it yet). Opinions were rather meh on another board, but I thought its demos sounded great. Also, agree about CV-able reverbs being largely unnecessary, but I did prefer having everything in the rack so that's why I got the ZVERB also (though, I'm sure your BAM sounds great!).

[electrosandwich]

How do you like the Tiptop ZVERB/ECHOZ? I've been eyeing the new Tiptop verbs for end-of-chain also. I'm listening to Tiptop's demo now—sounds pretty good. Can't decide between the ZVERB and ECHOZ so will probably have to get both.

They're fine...nothing that has knocked my socks off, but perfectly serviceable for some delay and reverb in the rack. The biggest drawback is the cryptic algorithm selection. You will need a cheat sheet to remember what the hell the color combinations mean. TBH, I've just given up (I hate cheat sheets), and I just cycle through them until I find a sound I like that matches what I'm going for. With 24 choices...I've rarely not been able to find something I like. The other drawback being mono in / stereo out - so you can't really use them to their full effect in a chain. But as I said, for my particular set up with two mono send/stereo returns, this isn't a problem. I do really like the fidelity control - and that it is CVable. I don't normally do much CVing over effects, but putting a bit of CV on the fidelity input can make some really cool sounds.

[Stoneyards]

Oto bim and bam are the always-on effects, but an fx aid and a parasites microcell give me the cv controlled stuff I need.

Do you use an attenuation module (strymon AA1, ALM SBG, etc...) in between your eurorack and the BIM and BAM?

No, I just run the modular straight into them and out. I do midi clock the delay via pams + expander.

[gonkulator]

Eventide Eclipse. And TC M3000 mostly.

[oofwello]

Use the knob farm Ferry and an outboard stereo reverb https://knob.farm/modules/ferry

I use the ferry with a chase bliss audio meris CXM https://www.chaseblissaudio.com/shop-pedals/cxm-1978

[Multi Grooves]

Tiptop Echoz delay in euro, OTO BAM for verb . . . Like others have said, I dint see the immediate need to cv the fook outta reverb, so...

How do you like your Tiptop ECHOZ? I just bought one (don't have it yet). Opinions were rather meh on another board, but I thought its demos sounded great. Also, agree about CV-able reverbs being largely unnecessary, but I did prefer having everything in the rack so that's why I got the ZVERB also (though, I'm sure your BAM sounds great!).

I think the echoz ok but I don't have too much to compare it to. Like cable tv, I just find myself flicking until I find something interesting (what ever that means) and leave it there for whatever I'm pissing around with.
I cannot say it jumps out at me in anyway but to be certain (with all my biases,) I'd like to try it against others eg chronoblob, modcan, fx aid etc*) just for the audio aspect- not the ergonomics. Though, I think delays are better suited than verbs for CVing and I have had some aurally compelling movements. Just a little a little triangle lfo into the time cv, you know, the amount that's barely perceptible is generally how I roll.
The fidelity can be an interesting way of adding some grit/ dirt.
I have printed off the chest sheet but as all this end-of-chain stuff is currently not my priority, I haven't started making notes of favourite settings.

One word of caution: I run it via a Frap Tools Group module and depending on how your mixer works, you need to think about the gain staging and mix settings in the tip top as well as your mixer. I found it's sounded very meh for a little while until really played around with it.
I'm not one for being massively hung up on colours but the black does look great. It deserves adding to blinken lights favourite modules thread.

Sorry for the ramble-ly nature of my reply, but I hope it helps.


*I almost forgot I have a Roland 301! My dusty memory is that it sounded in a different league... but this is mirrored in their respective price tags.