Experience silkscreening DIY panels?

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delayed
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Post by delayed » Thu Apr 24, 2014 6:03 pm

[/quote]

Good luck finding an Epoxy screen ink in a brick and mortar these days... or gloss enamel... Most conventional shops are going "green"

This is the next emulsion I'm going to be playing with:

http://www.silkscreeningsupplies.com/product/CCSVP-Q

Not sure if the latitude is as wide as CCI graphic emulsion or not but it is a one part type which is nice, and solvent friendly.[/quote]


that is what i was looking at also. seems they have a pink version.

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Post by coopersloan » Thu Apr 24, 2014 7:08 pm

delayed wrote: Good luck finding an Epoxy screen ink in a brick and mortar these days... or gloss enamel... Most conventional shops are going "green"
This is the next emulsion I'm going to be playing with:

http://www.silkscreeningsupplies.com/product/CCSVP-Q

Not sure if the latitude is as wide as CCI graphic emulsion or not but it is a one part type which is nice, and solvent friendly.

that is what i was looking at also. seems they have a pink version.
Careful, the Ryonet "HiFi photopolymer" comes in pink and blue, but is only plastisol friendly. To do solvent inks like epoxy/gloss enamel, you want the Ryonet "SVP Hybrid" which comes in only blue as far as I can see. They also sell the CCI for a few dollars more. I'm pretty sure thats a two-parter which needs a diazo primer.

[edit] looking more closely, even the "hifi" pink and blue options are different formulas:
Though Hifi Pink is the most popular we also offer HiFi Blue for printers who prefer working with a blue emulsion.

Industry Comparisons:
HiFi Pink compares to Ulano QTX, Saati
HiFi Blue compares to ChromaBlue, Kiwo Poly Plus

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Emalot
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Post by Emalot » Sun May 04, 2014 4:00 pm

@ehochstrasser:
which "extra translucency sheet" did you use please?

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delayed
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Post by delayed » Sun May 04, 2014 8:10 pm

Thanks for the info. I could not find any of the 2-part at my local store but I was able to score some 75% off 59000 cans. Ended up with two more cans to mess around with. They had several other 75% off series for vinyl and what not, but nothing that I could see any personal use for. Time to place the online order this week.

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ehochstrasser
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Post by ehochstrasser » Mon May 05, 2014 3:57 pm

Emalot wrote:@ehochstrasser:
which "extra translucency sheet" did you use please?
I have one of those sheets taped to my bench where I print the panels and I lay the sheet over the panel and do a test print so I can make sure all the holes line up and such. I think most printmakers use acetate, but for small panels an 8.5x11 sheet of this is fine.



I print my artwork for exposure onto these sheets as well, but from what I've read this isn't actually ideal as it shrinks a little in the printer so I may be switching to Casey's Translucency as someone else mentioned earlier in the thread. The latter is cheaper too.

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delayed
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Post by delayed » Mon May 05, 2014 8:43 pm

You can get a sample pack of that paper cheap ($7USD) off his website to try it out. I just picked up a pack myself.


https://www.caseyspm.com/cgi-bin/casey/translucency

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Post by seanpark » Mon May 05, 2014 9:50 pm

delayed wrote:Thanks for the info. I could not find any of the 2-part at my local store but I was able to score some 75% off 59000 cans. Ended up with two more cans to mess around with. They had several other 75% off series for vinyl and what not, but nothing that I could see any personal use for. Time to place the online order this week.
59000 sounds like a good compromise between ease of application and robustness / solvent resistance. dotcom uses an enamel ink for their panels. I haven't had the gall to swab one with acetone yet.

Was that Plaza with the cheep ink?

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Post by coopersloan » Tue May 06, 2014 11:37 am

Nice on the 75% off. That is a good find. Gloss enamel should have good adhesion to aluminum and be easier to put on than epoxy, too. Remember, they are both solvent inks and should bond somewhat with the material. Gloss enamel is a popular outdoor sign paint when used without a thinner.

I'm going to be messing with inktech GLE for my next panel run which is probably very similar to your 59000.

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Post by delayed » Tue May 06, 2014 12:16 pm

Yes it was Plaza. Other than what was on clearance, their ink is a bit more costly than normal places. DickBlick sells the 59K series for less and they have free shipping and/or 25% off.

I have been using enamel house paint with okay results. It is a bit to thin to use right out of the can, and I usually leave it out to sun bake dry for 24-48 hours. I have not messed with anything since last year before the cold and I am looking forward to playing around with some different inks. I have cobbled together black, white, green, and red now to play with. Plus some glow powder to mix in with the white.

Now if only a CNC or large Whitney Roper press would fall out of the sky for me.

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Post by coopersloan » Tue May 06, 2014 2:13 pm

I was told by someone while researching this stuff that the difference between a 'paint' and 'ink' is surface tension. An ink has the solvent property to get in to the pores of the metal and bond properly. even a 'sign paint' enamel is not an ink meant for screens, rather stencils, for that you need a proper 'ink' like the nazdar you picked up.

Never though about the possibilities of a good punch before... :moneyburn:

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Post by kdjupdal » Fri Jun 20, 2014 4:45 am

I just want to give some advice regarding the ezscreenprint kit.

Did anybody else here try it? Despite the name it is not necessarily easy. Maybe because of the metal printing, or the fine details that are required on synth panels.

I have tried it several times now and got varying results. It is possible to get nice results, but this is important:
- exposure time. Dont expose it for too long
- be sure to carefully clean all the residue in water after the screen is developed. This is one mistake I made and it is really important.
- to be sure to get a good result don't design with too fine details.

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Post by GiliRose » Fri May 27, 2016 11:45 am

Well, I hope two years later this isn't too late :-)

DSC, after seeing your clip - I hope you can can pitch in some more:

I saw you use Silkscreen to lay down the initial BLACK background
with one screen, and once dried, proceed with a 2nd layer of WHITE
for the Ticks and Text.

I am trying to setup for producing nice MU/Dotcom style blackface panels.
My initial idea was to powder coat the bare aluminum with a nice black silky texture,
and then do the White artwork with a Silkscreen procedure.
However, the aluminum for MU style panels need to be masked on those
angled edges - which is quite a nuisance!
After seeing your method I was thinking - hey - that looks way better and
a more elegant way for achieving the same end result!

What is your experience with this, and what would you suggest?
I did hear someone rant about silk-screening direct to bare aluminum,
and that way better results can be achieved by silk-screening on to a
base powder coat?

Cheers

Gil
Too many guitars and PC's, Kurzweil K2600X, K2600R, K2500, Roland D-50, JD-800, JD-990,
JX-10, Casio CZ-1, Yamaha SY-77, TX-7, Novation Bass Station II, Ensoniq SQ80, Ensoniq VFX-SD,
Korg Poly-800, time and patience. and a soldering iron.

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Post by DSC » Sun May 29, 2016 7:44 pm

Hi Gil,

The short answer is 'yes' you can print the entire panel, edge to edge. There are a couple of advantages in doing this and one major drawback. First the advantages are custom colors, complete uniformity and even more creativity as far as design. Custom colors as you can mix a very specific color. If someone wanted PMS #485 red as the panel color, you could nail it. Where powdercoating is really good these days, they are still not quite there. Some custom powder houses can mix you that color, but the odds of them repeating it in the future would be difficult. That leads to uniformity. Color mixed ink can be kept on the shelf ready to print quickly. As long as you used a scale to measure out your ink and kept record of what you used last, you should in theory keep that same color next time around. And of course you can go crazy with texture design if one chooses to.

I have done what you are suggesting with the Moog Werkstatt Mod I made. I used clear scotch tape and masked the edges and then printed the entire surface. Came out great. Pic of that and other completely colored printed panels, edge to edge.


Image

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However, the big drawback is durability! Properly powdercoated panels are 10 times more durable! I have been asked how I powdercoat panels, so I will drop this here even though it could be posted in a separate thread, this really pertains to the discussion. I also wanted to give more detail to the exposing of the screens and wash out process too. So here we go.


First is prep. Here is a fresh cut panel hot from the CNC router. I use glass bead blasting media and blast the entire surface, back and front.

Image


Once blasted there should be no reflection and the panel will feel very rough to the touch.

Image

I built a custom rack in the same dimension as the oven racks. This way I can move the various racks around within the cabinet. Both HOT and COLD states! You can see I have two powdercoating guns set up. I use one dedicated to matte black and the other for other colors.

Image

Ground is very important in the powdercoating process. Your panel must be conductive and must have a ground wire attached in order for the panel to evenly receive the powder to the surface. Every time I am about to start with the powdercoating procedure I always activate the circuit and touch a corner of the part and wait for a spark. Once I have a spark I have a complete and ready circuit.

Image

Once coated I gently move the part to the oven rack. Based on this size panel you can see you can easily stack panels so you can achieve more quantity per baking cycle.

Image

Fresh and hot out of the oven. If you use a domestic oven, like I am here, make sure NO FOOD ever goes into it again! DO NOT USE YOUR FOOD OVEN FOR BAKING POWDER COATINGS IN!!!

Image

Straight to the cooling rack underneath and in a few minutes you are ready to go! You can use special heat tape to mask off the edges of your MU panels. This is easier to deal with than screenprinting and again is so much more durable. If you make a mistake in powdercoating, just blow it off and start over. :tu:

Image





***SCREEN MAKING TIPS***

I had a few PM's last time that I was not able to get around to, so here are some answers to some of the questions I received.

Image

You need a good vacuum table to insure your film lays completely flush to your screen. You want no light creepage around your film.

Image

Here I have my vacuum pump hold down the screen. The porous rope around the inside of the frame insures even suction across the surface of the frame.

Image

Here on the exposing glass side you can see the neoprene holding the screen flush to the glass.

Image

You want adequate back lighting of the screen as you wash them out. Very easy to see what has come out and what needs a little more water. I use a 1350PSI pressure washer to wash out my screens. HOLD THE NOZZLE 3 - 4 feet away from the screen while washing the emulsion out of the screen. Any closer you can blast the emulsion out of the screen.

Image

Once you are satisfied with the result, IMMEDIATELY remove as much water from the emulsion as you can! I have a stack of newspaper around that I grab a couple of sheets from and lay one on each side of the screen. Do not let them stay there long. 10 seconds against the surface and that is it. Otherwise your newspaper will be glued to the emulsion. After that use compressed air to insure no water is in your image areas.

Image

Then use a heater and immediately remove whatever is left.

Image

While at this point waiting for your screen to dry, you can use a screen filler or Elmer's glue to fill in your pin holes and other dirt that caused open areas in your screen. Apply to the back side only! You want your squeegee blade to have a sheer surface to print against, so make corrections to the back side of the screen only.

Image

Hope this helps and sorry for taking soo long to answer those who asked questions last time. 8-)
Last edited by DSC on Sat Jun 27, 2020 11:06 am, edited 3 times in total.

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Post by Huba-Swift » Sun May 29, 2016 8:05 pm

I have plans to silk-screen some Yusynth panels, but have a few questions. I have no exposure unit, I've been told that I can do this using the suns UV rays. However, how do i time this correctly, or is this a poor way of doing it? secondly, I also want to silkscreen PCB's and am looking at Nazdars black etch resist ink. Could this ink also work to silk-screen panels?

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Post by DSC » Wed Mar 15, 2017 1:24 am

Bumping this as I am getting a few questions about how you can get started!

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Re: Experience silkscreening DIY panels?

Post by DSC » Tue Jun 30, 2020 3:37 pm

Bumping this thread again as I am starting to get more questions!!!

Here is the link to a CNC thread where I posted more pics on that topic.
viewtopic.php?f=17&t=233870

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Re: Experience silkscreening DIY panels?

Post by Stoneyards » Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:15 am

Thanks for bringing this thread back up.. It answers a number of questions I had.

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Re: Experience silkscreening DIY panels?

Post by DSC » Sat Jul 04, 2020 2:36 pm

Stoneyards wrote:
Sat Jul 04, 2020 11:15 am
Thanks for bringing this thread back up.. It answers a number of questions I had.
I know it might seem intimidating to start down this road, but you can pull it off (pun intended) for a pretty reasonably cost as far as up front costs go. You can purchase a couple screens from Sunbelt and use a local carwash to reclaim your screens.
Link to their site. https://sunbeltmfg.com/

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