[DEMOS ADDED!] Mutant Hihats eurorack DIY PCB/panel sets

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What are you interested in?

1x PCB set w/ euro panel ($59)
10
13%
1x PCB set w/ euro panel + vactrols + headers ($69)
65
82%
More than one PCB set w/ panel and parts
4
5%
 
Total votes: 79

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wadesey
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Post by wadesey » Tue Oct 21, 2014 8:07 pm

ablearcher wrote:Finally finishing the hi hats, a little confused by the stack up. Best I can figure (for the two headers on the side) put a female header on the control pcb, female header on the middle pcb (which long pins go through into the header on the control, and male headers on the top pcb. Is that right? Some of the electrolytics are kinda tall so it only works if some bare pin from the header is left exposed between top and middle pcb.

Image

(Not soldered yet, just holding together)
Could someone confirm that this is the best/correct way to stack? I just sat with the PCBs and headers for 30 minutes spinning them around and looking at the photos and couldn't find a way that I was 100% confident was correct...

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jbdiver
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Post by jbdiver » Wed Oct 22, 2014 9:52 am

I'm pretty sure that's how I constructed the header stack on my build. I ran into problems stacking the long pin headers. I'm not convinced that these are designed to stack. Sometimes the long pins didn't make clean contact with the female header, leading to some frustrating troubleshooting. I ended up tinning the long pins before inserting them into the female header. This created a tighter fit and more secure connection. Maybe I was stacking these headers wrong, but I couldn't figure out better way to do it.

My recommendation for hex is to more clearly document the position and alignment of these stacked headers in the build documents.

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hexinverter
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Post by hexinverter » Wed Oct 22, 2014 2:33 pm

The Mutant DIY projects really put the "Y" in "DIY" ;)

Unfortunately I just don't have the resources to put together nice diagrams and things like header stacks explanations for the Mutant DIY stuff, so, pictures with annotations will have to do. This is lifted from the MHH assembly tips PDF, and should illustrate how the stack works, as you can discern which is the male and which are the female headers:

Image

RE: the stacking headers -- I have yet to encounter what you describe, jbdiver. It is possible though that too much heat while soldering, or other mechanical effects could damage the orientation of the pins and cause a misalignment when connecting them.
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wadesey
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Post by wadesey » Thu Oct 23, 2014 2:50 pm

hexinverter wrote:The Mutant DIY projects really put the "Y" in "DIY" ;)
I totally understand the need to keep the capital-emphasized "Y" :tu:

I got the headers sorted now, thanks! But as I'm testing have another question... I've attached an mp3 of the background noise/VCA bleed and was wondering if this was normal, and if not, any idea what could cause it? It's present when using the internal oscillator or external source and the level of the noise is constant no matter what the input level is set to. When the drive is turned to maximum, the tone of the noise changes and gets "crunchier". I used TL072CP throughout and swapped the LM13700N with another to rule that out. Unless those suffixes are a no go? I triple checked transistor and capacitor values and will go back for a triple check of resistor values.
The settings in the mp3 are: internal osc, drive 0 on both, input at 12 o'clock, filter on, triggered by Silent Way "trigger".
Attachments
MHH Noise.mp3
(124.38 KiB) Downloaded 10 times

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wadesey
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Post by wadesey » Tue Nov 04, 2014 6:45 pm

wadesey wrote:
hexinverter wrote:The Mutant DIY projects really put the "Y" in "DIY" ;)
I totally understand the need to keep the capital-emphasized "Y" :tu:

I got the headers sorted now, thanks! But as I'm testing have another question... I've attached an mp3 of the background noise/VCA bleed and was wondering if this was normal, and if not, any idea what could cause it? It's present when using the internal oscillator or external source and the level of the noise is constant no matter what the input level is set to. When the drive is turned to maximum, the tone of the noise changes and gets "crunchier". I used TL072CP throughout and swapped the LM13700N with another to rule that out. Unless those suffixes are a no go? I triple checked transistor and capacitor values and will go back for a triple check of resistor values.
The settings in the mp3 are: internal osc, drive 0 on both, input at 12 o'clock, filter on, triggered by Silent Way "trigger".
In case anyone else has this same problem, it was the too tall 33uF capacitor on the middle pcb causing a short where it touched the back pcb. Using a cap shorter than the 63v Nichicon would prevent this, since they're taller than the female header and 12mm spacer. Unless I did something wrong with the headers, which is totally possible!

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Post by sake » Wed Dec 03, 2014 11:59 am

It seems that both caps on the middle pcb (33uF and 220uF) are too tall (11mm). Spacers are 12mm but the solderjoints on the upper pcb touches the caps.

How did anyone else fixed this? Shorter caps? If so, which?

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Menocu
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Post by Menocu » Wed Dec 03, 2014 12:41 pm

I'm horribly impatient, and also a horrible crafts-person. That said, I just finished this build, and to address the cap height issue, I just stole the plastic spacers from some 2.54mm male headers, and put them on some of the pins on the female headers. That bought me enough space for the caps to fit comfortably, and the female header pins still seem to make good contact.

Kind of a hack-y quick fix, but it worked for me.

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gbiz
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Post by gbiz » Wed Dec 03, 2014 1:25 pm

I used the same Nichicon caps. I cropped the component leg that would have touched the top of the cap dead flush to the PCB. That provided enough clearance in itself, but to play it safe i added a washer under each of the spacers.

This isn't the first layered board project i've seen with minimal clearance like this. I tend to check for it as i'm assembling. It's part of that "Y" bit ;)

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Post by sake » Mon Dec 08, 2014 3:42 am

Well, i also fixed it by adding a washer ;) good idea

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Post by puzo » Sat Mar 28, 2015 11:26 am

i was hoping for some advice and assistance.

For the 220pf capacitors I used wima film capacitors but see from the photos, Hex has used ceramic. what, if any difference will this make, very noob question.

I have tried to search the potential difference between using ceramic and film capacitors but havnt found anything that i understand and helps me.

Am i desoldering or am I ok?

thanks for advance

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hexinverter
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Post by hexinverter » Sat Mar 28, 2015 5:58 pm

puzo wrote:i was hoping for some advice and assistance.

For the 220pf capacitors I used wima film capacitors but see from the photos, Hex has used ceramic. what, if any difference will this make, very noob question.

I have tried to search the potential difference between using ceramic and film capacitors but havnt found anything that i understand and helps me.

Am i desoldering or am I ok?

thanks for advance
Either works just fine in this case :tu:
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puzo
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open decay time

Post by puzo » Mon Jun 29, 2015 6:00 am

I have finished the hihats. As with all my hex projects, very intuitive layout, nice solder pads, simple designs and smooth build. The hihat module works well, responds to trigger and led's light as they should, filter, overdrive and mode switch all good.

Having problems with the open decay. The decay knob doesnt effect the decay time at all, i have what seems like max decay time, the trim pot on the back doesnt change this either.

any advice?

bleedmachine
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Re: open decay time

Post by bleedmachine » Wed Sep 09, 2015 7:29 am

puzo wrote:Having problems with the open decay. The decay knob doesnt effect the decay time at all, i have what seems like max decay time, the trim pot on the back doesnt change this either.

any advice?
I'm having the exact same problem... Any ideas where to look?

puzo
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Post by puzo » Wed Sep 09, 2015 1:22 pm

seems a few people have this problm. i was recommended to look through the vactrol circuit part, i did that and dont seem to have an issue there, although i'm not sure what an issue would look like :bang: , the other recommendation was to adjust the trim pot alot, the pot apparently has a very quite but audible click when reached the end. when you have reached one end of the trim pot keep turning the other way to see if this changes it.

i got very frustrated with mine and havnt investigated much further.

i have no experience to other advice but my thoughts were maybe a duff pot?

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mbroers
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Post by mbroers » Wed Oct 14, 2015 8:09 am

two build questions: will this run on 15v without modification? also, before I solder the vactrol i was hoping someone could confirm i align the dot with the black side on the pcb and the long sides are up to go to the second two through holes?
thanks!!

Image

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Post by aristote » Sat Oct 24, 2015 2:30 pm

Hi !
I've just finished building this module and i made a mistake.
I've plugged the LM13700 backwards.
i've changed it with a new one, but here is my problem :
the module seems to works well, but there is no internal noise generator.
if i turn the ext. pot down i've got no sound at all. If i turn the ext. pot up or if i insert a signal in the external jack, the module works.

What can i check to fix the internal noise generator problem ? Is there schematics available ?

Edit :
just read the manual, this is supposed to work this way :)
EXT CONTROL
This controls the volume of the sound source you are using. NOTE that if nothing is plugged into the EXT input, the EXT knob controls the volume of the INTERNAL sound generator (and thus the volume of both hihats at once)!
Thanks !

puzo
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Post by puzo » Wed Oct 28, 2015 5:28 am

email hex for the schematic files, he had some issues with plagiarism, he'll freely send them, just keep em to yourself

flts
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Post by flts » Tue Dec 08, 2015 4:00 pm

My friend built one of these in our three man "soldering workshop"... The closed hihat works fine, but the open hihat does not trigger at all. There is no light on the trigger LED, nothing comes out from the OH output. Triggering the closed hihat causes a small click on the OH output, oddly enough.

For now we tried checking the solder work and reflowing any suspicious looking joints, and measuring that there's at least some contact all through the PCB stacks from top to bottom. I'll continue helping him the next time but no idea what to do next...

...I've already sent mr. Hex an email about the issue and requested schematics for troubleshooting. However, did anyone have the same issue and if so, how did you fix it? Or does anyone have an idea what to specifically look for?
Never stop loving music

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Post by flts » Fri Dec 11, 2015 10:31 am

no reply from hex. if anyone happens to have the schematics, could you share them with me, or at least help with pointing out which components should be checked & which things traced first when open hh isn't triggering? would be nice to get into troubleshooting this.
Never stop loving music

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Post by flts » Sun Dec 13, 2015 7:14 am

Fixed the issue by thoroughly inspecting and reflowing the joints, d'oh.

Now another issue seems to be that the closed hihat trigger (?) is bleeding to open hihat output. Every time the CH triggers, the OH output produces a very loud click. Is this normal?
Never stop loving music

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Post by flts » Sun Dec 13, 2015 1:08 pm

^- My friend said this was fixed by adding slight amount of extra height/space between bottom and middle PCBs - it may be that the bottom PCB was either flexing a bit, or the electrolytics were shorting between the boards (despite having a piece of electrical tape as "insulator" on top)

So I guess it's fine now!
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Post by a773 » Sun Dec 20, 2015 5:42 pm

Is this bom up to date?


Is there a build manual available somewhere? Mouser card?

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Post by flts » Mon Dec 21, 2015 3:09 am

I guess you already found the BOM, build manual and cart via the BD thread. Same info applies here - check the BOM carefully, you'll need a few extra things beside Mouser cart and what comes with the PCB + panel.

One thing I'd suggest would be to replace the electrolytics in the Mouser cart with a bit lower profile ones. The ones in the cart are a tight fit, as mentioned above my friend had a weird issue with the hihats until he added a bit more space between the two bottommost PCBs so that the tops of the electrolytics weren't touching the middle PCB. That works fine, but if you want to do it an elegant way, just get low profile electrolytics instead.
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gbiz
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Post by gbiz » Mon Dec 21, 2015 6:09 am

To save people having to find the BD thread in future, the assembly doc, BOM etc are here http://www.hexinverter.net/mutant-hihats

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Michiel
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Post by Michiel » Tue Dec 22, 2015 9:32 am

Just completed a successful build of the HiHats yesterday with the Mouser cart.

Some comments:
- superfluous 680k resistor in the BOM
- don't forget the IC sockets, there's a note, but I forgot them.
- agree with the comments on shorter capacitors. You only need to replace two, C13 and C29 - the latter one was the more problematic. Alternatively if you don't push them all the way down on the PCB there might be enough room to tilt them. I just inserted a washer as was suggested earlier.

Stacking the three PCBs with the long headers is a bit of a puzzle but pretty easy. There are at least two solutions with the parts on the BOM (I think I used a different one from the official one, but it works fine.) Check continuity before soldering them, I'd suggest.

The dot on the vactrol indeed has to be aligned with the dark part of the outline on the PCB - see question by mbroers above, but no answer given in the thread so far.

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