DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

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mramlu
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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by mramlu » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:20 pm

Hi i just finished building a uGrids it is supposed to be preflashed all smd parts where already soldered. I just added all the hardware. When i turn it on all 3 channel lights flash 5 times at the same time and then that's it. Anyone an idea what that could mean?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by forestcaver » Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:34 pm

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Last edited by forestcaver on Sat Aug 22, 2020 1:06 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Altitude909 » Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:47 pm

mramlu wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:20 pm
Hi i just finished building a uGrids it is supposed to be preflashed all smd parts where already soldered. I just added all the hardware. When i turn it on all 3 channel lights flash 5 times at the same time and then that's it. Anyone an idea what that could mean?
did you install the LED button backwards?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by mramlu » Sat Aug 22, 2020 9:29 am

Altitude909 wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 4:47 pm
mramlu wrote:
Fri Aug 21, 2020 1:20 pm
Hi i just finished building a uGrids it is supposed to be preflashed all smd parts where already soldered. I just added all the hardware. When i turn it on all 3 channel lights flash 5 times at the same time and then that's it. Anyone an idea what that could mean?
did you install the LED button backwards?
I sure did! I just solved it myself and came here to edit my comment. Thanks for your answer though you are absolutely right. It also was quite a mess to remove and re-solder but i managed the module works now. Before i tried re-flashing it which also worked after buying a non knockoff arduino nano, so i guess i'm able to update it know if i want to.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by proonjooce » Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:12 pm

Hi,

Just finished soldering a jakplugg Typhoon. Tried flashing it with my ST-Link and it isn't finding the chip at all. Tried JTAG and SWD. Have built a lot of these modules before but this is the first time something hasn't worked that I couldnt find the problem myself, have to admit I'm a bit stumped as I'm not much of an electronics expert.

Have checked for shorts and bridges and reflowed any suspicious looking pins on the chip.

One thing I have noticed though is that it gets pretty damn hot around the LM1117 when turned on.

I've built 2 of these simultanously and the 2nd one flashed no problem, so it can't be a case of a wrong component or something, must be a dodgy connection somewhere I guess.

I tested the LM1117 (U4) with a multimeter. Testing Input<->Ground gives ~11V but testing Output<->Ground gives nothing 0V.
When I check the other LM1117 (U10) I get 3.3V on Output which is how it should be I imagine.

Have to think this is part of the problem (chip not being powered?) but not sure what would be causing this or how to go about fixing it?

If there is a dodgy connection somewhere and that's causing the components to get hot, is there a chance I've fried something? How will I even know? Apologies for what might be pretty basic questions here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Nucleo » Sat Aug 22, 2020 5:14 pm

proonjooce wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:12 pm
Hi,

Just finished soldering a jakplugg Typhoon......

If there is a dodgy connection somewhere and that's causing the components to get hot, is there a chance I've fried something? How will I even know? Apologies for what might be pretty basic questions here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
First step is to measure across the output of the regulator and check for a short or very low resistance and see if this is causing the hot regulator. They do get warmer than you might expect in normal operation, but not to the point of burning your hand. Can you post some high res photos of the board?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by snowtires » Sat Aug 22, 2020 5:46 pm

proonjooce wrote:
Sat Aug 22, 2020 2:12 pm
Hi,

Just finished soldering a jakplugg Typhoon. Tried flashing it with my ST-Link and it isn't finding the chip at all. Tried JTAG and SWD. Have built a lot of these modules before but this is the first time something hasn't worked that I couldnt find the problem myself, have to admit I'm a bit stumped as I'm not much of an electronics expert.

Have checked for shorts and bridges and reflowed any suspicious looking pins on the chip.

One thing I have noticed though is that it gets pretty damn hot around the LM1117 when turned on.

I've built 2 of these simultanously and the 2nd one flashed no problem, so it can't be a case of a wrong component or something, must be a dodgy connection somewhere I guess.

I tested the LM1117 (U4) with a multimeter. Testing Input<->Ground gives ~11V but testing Output<->Ground gives nothing 0V.
When I check the other LM1117 (U10) I get 3.3V on Output which is how it should be I imagine.

Have to think this is part of the problem (chip not being powered?) but not sure what would be causing this or how to go about fixing it?

If there is a dodgy connection somewhere and that's causing the components to get hot, is there a chance I've fried something? How will I even know? Apologies for what might be pretty basic questions here.

Any help would be greatly appreciated!
Try touching up the JTAG soldering, I just had the same problem with another build and that was the culprit.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by proonjooce » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:16 am

First step is to measure across the output of the regulator and check for a short or very low resistance and see if this is causing the hot regulator. They do get warmer than you might expect in normal operation, but not to the point of burning your hand. Can you post some high res photos of the board?
I'm getting ~620 ohms on the working board and around ~45 ohms on the non-working board. Testing between GND and Vout
Last edited by proonjooce on Sun Aug 23, 2020 9:19 am, edited 1 time in total.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by proonjooce » Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:30 am

Update on the Typhoon, tried following the V3.3 line from the Output of the LM1117 on the Diptrace file and reflowing anything that looked a bit dodgy. Plugged it in and was greeted with magic smoke and crackling, the Ferrite Bead FB1 was glowing hot and smoking.

Have to admit I'm at a loss now as to how to get this thing working, any help would be much appreciated.

The schematics and diptrace files can be found here if that's any help to anyone - https://github.com/jakplugg/Typhoon

I've noticed the top of C50 is bridged to the large heatsink pad, could this be the issue?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Nucleo » Sun Aug 23, 2020 4:42 pm

proonjooce wrote:
Sun Aug 23, 2020 7:30 am
...

I've noticed the top of C50 is bridged to the large heatsink pad, could this be the issue?
No that's how it should be. Can you post some clear high res photos? Do you have a current limited adjustable benchtop power supply?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by CamFry » Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:41 am

Hi,

PLZ HELP

I bought a DIY braids and it worked fine at first. As i pressed the encoder the module reboots (I think). Pressing it a few times more the module shuts down. It's not starting up again... I've tried two nifty cases without succes.

Any ideas on how to fix?

THX!

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by CamFry » Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:42 am

Hi,

PLZ HELP
I bought a DIY braids and it worked fine at first. As i pressed the encoder the module reboots (I think). Pressing it a few times more the module shuts down. It's not starting up again... I've tried two nifty cases without succes.

Any ideas on how to fix?

THX!

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:08 am

arthurdent wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 12:25 pm
arthurdent wrote:
Sat Jul 18, 2020 10:48 am
I just finished building Clouds, it was the full kit from synthCube. I just powered it up, the only thing that happens is all 4 LED'S across the top light up and stay lit, nothing else is functional - pushing buttons, turning pots has no effect. Put an audio signal in, nothing comes out. Tried CV signals to the various inputs - nothing. At least there was no smoke or sparks. Any ideas where I should start??
I just heard back from synthCube, they say that it sounds like the ARM is missing the code and/or bootloader. I don't have the resources (software, hardware, and skill set) to do this so I'm sending the completed module back to them, they will load and verify. HOPEFULLY that's all that is wrong with it...
I sent the module back to synthCube to verify that the ARM was programmed, they could get no response from it at all - it was as if there was no communications link between the JTAG and the processor chip. They sent the module back to me, I've spent about 5 hours looking at all of the solder joints - touched up a couple that were a little sloppy - but I can't see any obvious issues and the module still does not respond.

Does anyone have any ideas on where to look?? I've attached a photo of the build in case someone can see something that I've missed.
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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Altitude909 » Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:45 am

whats the current draw on the +12 and -12

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Flounderguts » Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:25 am

From that photo, one of the legs of the ARM looks like it's bridged to C19. And worth tidying up over near C17.
There's a bridge on the connector by the reset button...is that your power connector?
C43 doesn't look bedded in.
Bridge on the 8731?
Check C50 and C30...are they bridged?
Are all the jacks soldered in?

Generally, from the look of that pcb, you aren't getting enough heat in the joints to let the solder flow, and snap into place via surface tension. That may be from a loose tip, too low temperature, or a dirty tip. Clean and tighten your iron, tin it nicely (and keep it tinned...I do it every 5 to 10 joints), and set it to around 330 to 350 C. Then go over your board, and wait to see the solder turn bright silver and snap into place on each connection. Some no-clean solder flux might help, but use it sparingly!
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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:33 am

Flounderguts wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 10:25 am
From that photo, one of the legs of the ARM looks like it's bridged to C19. And worth tidying up over near C17.
There's a bridge on the connector by the reset button...is that your power connector?
C43 doesn't look bedded in.
Bridge on the 8731?
Check C50 and C30...are they bridged?
Are all the jacks soldered in?

Generally, from the look of that pcb, you aren't getting enough heat in the joints to let the solder flow, and snap into place via surface tension. That may be from a loose tip, too low temperature, or a dirty tip. Clean and tighten your iron, tin it nicely (and keep it tinned...I do it every 5 to 10 joints), and set it to around 330 to 350 C. Then go over your board, and wait to see the solder turn bright silver and snap into place on each connection. Some no-clean solder flux might help, but use it sparingly!
Thanks for the comments.

C19 is connected to the ARM there at Pin 47.
The gunk around C17 was residual flux from some touch-up.
The bridged connecor by the Reset button is the JTAG - that bridge is called out on the schematic.
C43 looks good.
Bridge on the 8731 - there by design.
C50 & C30 bridge - by design.
Jacks are soldered in solid. YEAH you can see voids from the top side, solder did not flow all the way through but I checked continuity and all is good.

I solder at 650F - 343C. Tip was cleaned and re-tinned routinely after every 4-5 joints. All of those joints were bright and shiny when they were done. (I use a Hakko FX-888 FWIW). I think they just got dulled from sitting. This was my first build with 603's so the joints aren't visually perfect but I checked each one with a 7X hand lens as I went.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:40 am

Altitude909 wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:45 am
whats the current draw on the +12 and -12
DUNNO - I need to make up a cable so that I can connect my Fluke between the busboard and the module. I'll work on that. Thanks.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:56 am

arthurdent wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 11:40 am
Altitude909 wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 9:45 am
whats the current draw on the +12 and -12
DUNNO - I need to make up a cable so that I can connect my Fluke between the busboard and the module. I'll work on that. Thanks.
OK - I have 116mA for the +12 and 12mA for the -12. The MI website calls out 120 and 10 for the factory module.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by batchas » Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:16 pm

@arthurdent : I don’t know the orientation of diode, ICs etc, but I guess this is the first thing you checked.
I’m aware you checked for continuity, but maybe as you need to have contact with the component to check it, very little pressure is applied on the component, so it shows all is ok while actually it is not well soldered and when the check if finished there's actually no contact on a joint. Maybe...
It’s always very difficult to say from top view on a photo but pers. I’d re-solder C43, R56, R49, C24, R51, C10 etc. they should at least look like R37, C21, cause on the photo they do not look good.
Crossing fingers you find the issue!
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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 4:05 pm

batchas wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 3:16 pm
@arthurdent : I don’t know the orientation of diode, ICs etc, but I guess this is the first thing you checked.
I’m aware you checked for continuity, but maybe as you need to have contact with the component to check it, very little pressure is applied on the component, so it shows all is ok while actually it is not well soldered and when the check if finished there's actually no contact on a joint. Maybe...
It’s always very difficult to say from top view on a photo but pers. I’d re-solder C43, R56, R49, C24, R51, C10 etc. they should at least look like R37, C21, cause on the photo they do not look good.
Crossing fingers you find the issue!
YEAH, the first thing I looked at was whether the directional components - IC's, diodes, polarized caps - were in place correctly.

When I check continuity, I work from the schematic, look at where the signal into a component is coming from and I go back to that component to ensure I have a good connection between the two. Then I trace the output of the component to the next item in line and check continuity there to ensure I have a good connection. So I'm not just checking the component/pad joint. I checked the specific items you called out and they all seem to be OK connection-wise. But it looks like I'm stilll going to go through and re-work a BUNCH of joints anyway, only because I'm hoping to avoid the inevitable, which is replacing the ARM processor chip...

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by Flounderguts » Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:22 pm

Do you work on an antistatic pad? Cuz ARM chips are easy to pop...
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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by arthurdent » Mon Aug 24, 2020 7:03 pm

Flounderguts wrote:
Mon Aug 24, 2020 6:22 pm
Do you work on an antistatic pad? Cuz ARM chips are easy to pop...
OH YEAH! My "work station" is a big shallow aluminum tray (commercial bakery pan) with an anti-static mat in it, the ground wire from the pad is fastened to the tray and a wire goes from that connection to the ground terminal on the outlet strip that powers the soldering station and the work lamp.

One "discovery" that I made this evening. I normally plug the module into the connector on the busboard and then power up the bus. All four MODE LED's light up in red/green and that's it. Nothing else happens, turning the pots, pushing buttons, providing an input to any of the jacks cause any changes. I had the module powered up and I wanted to inspect a connection so, without thinking, I just unplugged the power cable for the module from the busboard without powering down first. After I did the inspection I plugged the power cable back into the busboard and the LED in the FREEZE switch lit up in addition to the four MODE LED's. Then after about 20 seconds, the Freeze LED shut off, and the other four LED's cascade cycled like an old theater marquee - 3, 2, 1, 4, and then back to 3 which was now lit green and the others were off. I powered the busboard down with the ON/OFF switch, then turned it on again and I was back to the same four lights stuck in the on position. By unplugging the power cable and plugging it back in while the bus was live, I was able to duplicate this occurence 3 more times, each time the Mode LED's cycled in a different pattern. So something was causing the 595 to trigger the lights - or causing the ARM to trigger the 595 to trigger the lights in this fashion and the only thing different from normal that I can see is the mode of power-up.

I think my brain is fried too much right now to try anything else. Gonna grab a beer and unwind, go back at this in the morning.

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by snowtires » Sat Aug 29, 2020 1:13 am

I've got a problem with a Clouds build, I think the STM is not getting programmed? Everything is getting the right voltages, and I thought I programmed the STM but nothing lights up. This is what I get when I try to program the chip:

Code: Select all

vagrant@vagrant-ubuntu-trusty-64:/vagrant/eurorack-modules$ make -f clouds/makefile upload_combo_jtag
openocd -s /opt/local/share/openocd/scripts/ -f interface/stlink-v2.cfg -f target/stm32f4x.cfg -c "init" -c "halt" -c "sleep 200" \
                                -f stmlib/programming/jtag/erase_f4xx.cfg \
                                -c "flash write_image erase build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin 0x08000000" \
                                -c "verify_image build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin 0x08000000" \
                                -c "sleep 200" -c "reset run" -c "shutdown"
Open On-Chip Debugger 0.9.0 (2020-08-20-02:56)
Licensed under GNU GPL v2
For bug reports, read
        http://openocd.org/doc/doxygen/bugs.html
Info : auto-selecting first available session transport "hla_swd". To override use 'transport select <transport>'.
Info : The selected transport took over low-level target control. The results might differ compared to plain JTAG/SWD
adapter speed: 2000 kHz
adapter_nsrst_delay: 100
none separate
Info : Unable to match requested speed 2000 kHz, using 1800 kHz
Info : Unable to match requested speed 2000 kHz, using 1800 kHz
Info : clock speed 1800 kHz
Info : STLINK v2 JTAG v29 API v2 SWIM v7 VID 0x0483 PID 0x3748
Info : using stlink api v2
Info : Target voltage: 3.210492
Info : stm32f4x.cpu: hardware has 6 breakpoints, 4 watchpoints
target state: halted
target halted due to debug-request, current mode: Handler External Interrupt(14)
xPSR: 0x6100001e pc: 0x080004f0 msp: 0x2001ff68
Info : device id = 0x10076413
Info : flash size = 1024kbytes
stm32x mass erase complete
target state: halted
target halted due to debug-request, current mode: Handler HardFault
xPSR: 0x01000003 pc: 0xfffffffe msp: 0xffffffd8
auto erase enabled
wrote 262144 bytes from file build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin in 16.048191s (15.952 KiB/s)
target state: halted
target halted due to breakpoint, current mode: Handler HardFault
xPSR: 0x61000003 pc: 0x2000002e msp: 0xffffffd8
verified 168912 bytes in 3.311236s (49.816 KiB/s)
shutdown command invoked
Is that an error? It's hard to tell sometimes. If that's not an error and the chip is being programmed properly, what else might cause the module to not work, if all of the chips were seated properly and getting the correct voltages (i.e. like how it is for me now)?

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by forestcaver » Sat Aug 29, 2020 2:11 am

deleted

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Re: DIY Mutable Unsuccessful Builds

Post by snowtires » Sat Aug 29, 2020 6:31 pm

snowtires wrote:
Sat Aug 29, 2020 1:13 am
I've got a problem with a Clouds build, I think the STM is not getting programmed? Everything is getting the right voltages, and I thought I programmed the STM but nothing lights up. This is what I get when I try to program the chip:

Code: Select all

vagrant@vagrant-ubuntu-trusty-64:/vagrant/eurorack-modules$ make -f clouds/makefile upload_combo_jtag
openocd -s /opt/local/share/openocd/scripts/ -f interface/stlink-v2.cfg -f target/stm32f4x.cfg -c "init" -c "halt" -c "sleep 200" \
                                -f stmlib/programming/jtag/erase_f4xx.cfg \
                                -c "flash write_image erase build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin 0x08000000" \
                                -c "verify_image build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin 0x08000000" \
                                -c "sleep 200" -c "reset run" -c "shutdown"
Open On-Chip Debugger 0.9.0 (2020-08-20-02:56)
Licensed under GNU GPL v2
For bug reports, read
        http://openocd.org/doc/doxygen/bugs.html
Info : auto-selecting first available session transport "hla_swd". To override use 'transport select <transport>'.
Info : The selected transport took over low-level target control. The results might differ compared to plain JTAG/SWD
adapter speed: 2000 kHz
adapter_nsrst_delay: 100
none separate
Info : Unable to match requested speed 2000 kHz, using 1800 kHz
Info : Unable to match requested speed 2000 kHz, using 1800 kHz
Info : clock speed 1800 kHz
Info : STLINK v2 JTAG v29 API v2 SWIM v7 VID 0x0483 PID 0x3748
Info : using stlink api v2
Info : Target voltage: 3.210492
Info : stm32f4x.cpu: hardware has 6 breakpoints, 4 watchpoints
target state: halted
target halted due to debug-request, current mode: Handler External Interrupt(14)
xPSR: 0x6100001e pc: 0x080004f0 msp: 0x2001ff68
Info : device id = 0x10076413
Info : flash size = 1024kbytes
stm32x mass erase complete
target state: halted
target halted due to debug-request, current mode: Handler HardFault
xPSR: 0x01000003 pc: 0xfffffffe msp: 0xffffffd8
auto erase enabled
wrote 262144 bytes from file build/clouds/clouds_bootloader_combo.bin in 16.048191s (15.952 KiB/s)
target state: halted
target halted due to breakpoint, current mode: Handler HardFault
xPSR: 0x61000003 pc: 0x2000002e msp: 0xffffffd8
verified 168912 bytes in 3.311236s (49.816 KiB/s)
shutdown command invoked
Is that an error? It's hard to tell sometimes. If that's not an error and the chip is being programmed properly, what else might cause the module to not work, if all of the chips were seated properly and getting the correct voltages (i.e. like how it is for me now)?
Expanding on this:
Sound passes from the inputs to the outputs and the 'in gain' knob adjusts the volume -so I'm assuming that means the op amps are fine.
I checked both crystals with my budget frequency counter and they are both working and the correct values.
The -10v shunt and both 3v3 regulators are putting out the right voltages.
I hooked up an LFO and all of the jacks are passing voltages to the MCPs, although I don't have an oscilloscope to check the chips themselves.

None of the LEDs light up and none of the other pots or buttons affect the sound. I measured the voltages and the pots are working and affecting the voltage across the wiper, but the module is still dead. I feel like the chip flashed successfully, but at the same time it's acting like the STM isn't even there. Could this be a bad shift register? Bad codec chip? I just don't get it.

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