[NEW] Serge Resonant EQ for Euro by R*S

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Sleipnir
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Re: Resonant Equalizer Modification ?

Post by Sleipnir » Fri Dec 08, 2017 6:07 pm

Hansi026 wrote:It is possible to mod the Reso EQ ? e.g. with an extra panel that contains 11 cv inputs for the frequencies and the feedback ? And as an option, can the knobs at the Reso EQ then acts as attenuverters ?
I wouldn't call that a mod so much as a completely different animal.
You wouldn't be able to "mod" it for that, but you could do the following:
* Use the 11 individual outs (the PCB has the resistors and pins for this) sent to a separate panel
* Send those 11 outs to eleven different VCAs
* Send those 11 VCA outputs to a mixer (or 5)
* Have 11 modulation sources for the 11 VCAs
:eek:
Sure you still want to do that vs. hooking up, say, 3 bandpass filters?

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Midiot
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Post by Midiot » Sun Dec 10, 2017 4:28 am

Sleipnir wrote:
diode_destroyer wrote: This module is for, as the kids say, F*CKING SHIT UP. And it does it quite well.
It self-resonates really well, no input.
Just the output to your mixer, dial-up the res, and tweak away.
"We'll be living in all the oceans now."
(type of music I make.... drone atmospheres, deep late-night beats.)

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Re: Resonant Equalizer Modification ?

Post by cygmu » Sun Dec 10, 2017 5:36 am

Sleipnir wrote:
Hansi026 wrote:It is possible to mod the Reso EQ ? e.g. with an extra panel that contains 11 cv inputs for the frequencies and the feedback ? And as an option, can the knobs at the Reso EQ then acts as attenuverters ?
I wouldn't call that a mod so much as a completely different animal.
You wouldn't be able to "mod" it for that, but you could do the following:
* Use the 11 individual outs (the PCB has the resistors and pins for this) sent to a separate panel
* Send those 11 outs to eleven different VCAs
* Send those 11 VCA outputs to a mixer (or 5)
* Have 11 modulation sources for the 11 VCAs
:eek:
Sure you still want to do that vs. hooking up, say, 3 bandpass filters?
I think it’s even more complicated than that, if you want CV control over the band responses, because the pots that control them are in a weird feedback loop (that I don’t understand — so could be wrong here) so even with the above setup you would still need to wiggle the pots by hand.

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Post by XAXAU » Wed Mar 14, 2018 2:18 am

My 411hz band is dead so I desoldered the caps and soldered in new ones but it´s still dead. The 22k and 510k resistors are correct.

Any tips?

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Post by search64 » Wed Mar 14, 2018 3:56 am

XAXAU wrote:My 411hz band is dead so I desoldered the caps and soldered in new ones but it´s still dead. The 22k and 510k resistors are correct.

Any tips?
Image

Each band follows the same principle and is actually quite simple. If the resistors and caps are correct (and soldered correctly), I'd say check out the IC. U3 in above schematic.

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Post by XAXAU » Sun Mar 18, 2018 11:37 pm

search64 wrote:
XAXAU wrote:My 411hz band is dead so I desoldered the caps and soldered in new ones but it´s still dead. The 22k and 510k resistors are correct.

Any tips?
Image

Each band follows the same principle and is actually quite simple. If the resistors and caps are correct (and soldered correctly), I'd say check out the IC. U3 in above schematic.
Thanks! This one?

Image

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Biom
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Post by Biom » Wed Apr 04, 2018 7:08 pm

Has anyone tried to use ResEQ with external/line signals? Any known issues? Is the I/O module necessary or direct connection is fine?

Planning to use it as an insert in Logic to process mic's: mic -> preamp -> Logic -> soundcard out -> ResEQ -> Logic

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Post by soup » Wed Apr 04, 2018 9:51 pm

Biom wrote:Has anyone tried to use ResEQ with external/line signals? Any known issues? Is the I/O module necessary or direct connection is fine?
As long as you don't go overboard on the resonance it will work fine with line level signals.

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Post by Biom » Thu Apr 05, 2018 2:50 pm

could you, please, be more specific?

Its resonant and feedback characteristics is what I'm after

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Post by soup » Thu Apr 05, 2018 4:55 pm

Self oscillation will be very loud.

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Biom
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Post by Biom » Thu Apr 05, 2018 5:11 pm

What would you recommend? Unfortunately, I don't own one, so need to know beforehand.

I'm also a bit worrying if I may damage the ResEQ itself on its input. Condenser mics are very sensitive and tend to clip (or create feedbacks) easily.

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Post by Sleipnir » Fri Apr 06, 2018 9:29 pm

Biom wrote:I'm also a bit worrying if I may damage the ResEQ itself on its input. Condenser mics are very sensitive and tend to clip (or create feedbacks) easily.
You won't hurt the ResEQ with a mic, unless your mic cable is connected to a wall power socket. It's designed to take a ~4v signal, which is the top end of what a (very strong) mic preamp can put out.
If it goes into howling feedback, well... that's what it's designed for. Bask in the glorious distortion and sidebands. Or turn down the boost.

You could put a line level directly into it, but your signal/noise ratio will likely suffer (again, it's designed for modular signal levels). If it goes into resonance, you will probably need some attenuation to avoid overloading your interface. Try it and see. Is this going to be your only eurorack module?

Curious why your path would be mic > preamp > interface > daw > interface > ResEQ > interface > daw rather than a more direct mic > preamp > ResEQ > interface > daw

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Biom
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Post by Biom » Sun Apr 08, 2018 9:08 am

Sleipnir wrote: You won't hurt the ResEQ with a mic, unless your mic cable is connected to a wall power socket. It's designed to take a ~4v signal, which is the top end of what a (very strong) mic preamp can put out.
If it goes into howling feedback, well... that's what it's designed for. Bask in the glorious distortion and sidebands. Or turn down the boost.

You could put a line level directly into it, but your signal/noise ratio will likely suffer (again, it's designed for modular signal levels). If it goes into resonance, you will probably need some attenuation to avoid overloading your interface. Try it and see. Is this going to be your only eurorack module?

Curious why your path would be mic > preamp > interface > daw > interface > ResEQ > interface > daw rather than a more direct mic > preamp > ResEQ > interface > daw
Thank you for your detailed reply!

I try to minimize my setup to bring it to live performance, so I only use a soundcard (with built-in pre's). The path is a bit tricky, but I'm able to record every track with a very good quality this way, through clean pre's and conversion.

As for the system, I'm trying to remain within 104hp. I have the Vermona TAI-4, but it's definitely not hp-friendly.
Will experiment, as soon as I get the module. Thank you for your help!

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Post by Biom » Fri Apr 13, 2018 1:46 pm

Really sorry for the dumb question, but what is the difference in sound with 22n and 47n film or cog vs styro (Thonk kits vs styrene capacitors for all the bands)?
Last edited by Biom on Tue Apr 17, 2018 5:34 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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FetidEye
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Post by FetidEye » Sat Apr 14, 2018 10:29 am

it has some difference in sound, but it hard to say if the one is better than the other. it just sounds a bit different.
I notice it most with feedback patches

(I have 2 res EQ's, with sliders. one with styro, one with film caps)

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Post by Biom » Sat Apr 14, 2018 11:18 am

Which one do you enjoy more?
I know, it's impossible to describe, but still, how could you describe the difference?
Are they just minor nuances?
Do think it's worth it to replace these caps?

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Post by search64 » Sat Apr 14, 2018 12:39 pm

FetidEye wrote:it has some difference in sound, but it hard to say if the one is better than the other. it just sounds a bit different.
I notice it most with feedback patches

(I have 2 res EQ's, with sliders. one with styro, one with film caps)
Could you record a comparison?

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Post by Biom » Sun Apr 15, 2018 12:48 pm

Asked a fellow builder if there is a difference between these caps. He said: "you bet", though he never assembled ResEq in particular.

Maybe Ralf, himself, would chime in, if not too busy resurrecting the Frequency Shifter :hihi:

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Post by Sleipnir » Sun Apr 15, 2018 1:53 pm

Biom wrote:Asked a fellow builder if there is a difference between these caps. He said: "you bet", though he never assembled ResEq in particular.

Maybe Ralf, himself, would chime in, if not too busy resurrecting the Frequency Shifter :hihi:
If you don’t like the sound now, you won’t with different caps.
If you *do* like the sound now, then stop fretting about microscopic differences and make some noise.
If you haven’t built it yet, then maybe go do that.
:despair:
Note that the reason Thonk uses mixed caps is the caps for the 2 lower bands in poly are about the size of an entire human thumb, and somewhat of an adventure to even place on the board.
Just IMO (of a person who *has* built one, with mixed caps, and is just fine with it as-is).

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Post by search64 » Sun Apr 15, 2018 2:32 pm

You’re missing the point. I just want to hear for myself what the effect of different caps is.

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Post by FetidEye » Mon Apr 16, 2018 3:18 am

I'll try to record some differences

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Post by soup » Mon Apr 16, 2018 10:07 am

You could always build one with sockets and swap out the caps. I built one with styrene and it sounded fantastic.

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Post by Biom » Tue Apr 17, 2018 6:10 pm

Sleipnir wrote: If you don’t like the sound now, you won’t with different caps.
If you *do* like the sound now, then stop fretting about microscopic differences and make some noise.
If you haven’t built it yet, then maybe go do that.
:despair:
Note that the reason Thonk uses mixed caps is the caps for the 2 lower bands in poly are about the size of an entire human thumb, and somewhat of an adventure to even place on the board.
Just IMO (of a person who *has* built one, with mixed caps, and is just fine with it as-is).
Well, unfortunately, I don't own both versions, so I can't compare them to answer my question myself.
As I'm not an engineer, I'm not sure, if the differences are microscopic or not, that was also a part of my initial question. I think it's the right thread to ask such questions, correct me, if not.
I totally understand Thonk approach, BUT many builders here are still quite adventurous) I also heard that CGS builders used styro exclusively for their bands on Res EQs.

As far as I get the whole idea and genius behind this module, it's about subtleties and micro-control of every tiny harmonic aspect of the sound with the ability to add it's own life and even kind of "pseudo-acoustic" information to a sound. A truly advanced sculptural instrument, rather than being an utilitarian one. Thus, the question is still there.

I'm totally not a FLAC fan, but we all are here for a reason.
Making noise is the final goal of all this, I agree, but you don't need any modulars for that, really

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Post by FetidEye » Fri Apr 20, 2018 5:59 pm

So, I just tried a comparison.
Turns out there is quite a lot of sound difference.

With a bassdrum and a feedback path (upper output directly to input),
these are the results:
no recordings yet, soon! my girlfriend tried to sleep :)

Styrene: much more bass and low distortion. the feedback tipping point is a higher knob setting.

Film: a lot of punch, more easy to tip over to resonant squelches. I rather like the sub on this one. less easy to overdrive on the bass side. more weird sounds.

I'll test more later, with noise input and no input feedback.

m

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Post by Biom » Sat Apr 21, 2018 8:22 am

Fantastic!

There's also a thread viewtopic.php?t=92901&postdays=0&postorder=asc&start=0 where Dustin (J3rk) said the same thing regarding the use of polystyrene and polypropylene in resonant filters. I guess, your observation was very common if not the same! Interesting.

Can't wait for the audio!
Thank you for your tests! I guess, this would be interesting to those who haven't built the module yet or thinking about building the 2nd one :hihi:

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