[AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

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kristop
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:51 am

Can anyone direct me to how to wire up the Gate Booster currently available from Synthcube? I can't find any documentation on that board at all. Also it comes with 2 ferrite beads and 2 100n caps, but the board is marked for 4 100n caps.

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fallout
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Thu Jan 28, 2021 7:38 am

kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:04 am
Glad this issue was on this page. Noticed while actually sitting down to start calibration that my noise just thumped and my sample & hold didn't work. Swapped the LM301 with one I had in my parts drawer and presto. Glad I have 9 more in case other issues arise.
Glad it you got it working!
kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:51 am
Can anyone direct me to how to wire up the Gate Booster currently available from Synthcube? I can't find any documentation on that board at all. Also it comes with 2 ferrite beads and 2 100n caps, but the board is marked for 4 100n caps.
The 2 pin header on the corner of the PCB are your Gate/Trigger outputs and from what I understand they are labeled incorrectly and should be swapped.

'Gate in' is pin #3 on the 3 pin header.

I don't think you need to use the ferrite beads.

You could reference the pics in the build guide to see what goes where. I hope this helps!

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by LED-man » Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:27 pm

kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:51 am
Can anyone direct me to how to wire up the Gate Booster currently available from Synthcube? I can't find any documentation on that board at all. Also it comes with 2 ferrite beads and 2 100n caps, but the board is marked for 4 100n caps.
https://www.dsl-man.de/display/TTSH/TTSH+Gatebooster
################################
TTSH Support Page and other DIY Projects:
https://www.DSL-man.de

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:27 pm

LED-man wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:27 pm
kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 12:51 am
Can anyone direct me to how to wire up the Gate Booster currently available from Synthcube? I can't find any documentation on that board at all. Also it comes with 2 ferrite beads and 2 100n caps, but the board is marked for 4 100n caps.
https://www.dsl-man.de/display/TTSH/TTSH+Gatebooster
Thanks, I did come across this... the destinations aren't as much of a problem as where to hook up on that board. Seems like the supplied parts kit could use an update to this new board, which makes it all the more confusing.

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fallout
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:24 pm

kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:27 pm
Thanks, I did come across this... the destinations aren't as much of a problem as where to hook up on that board. Seems like the supplied parts kit could use an update to this new board, which makes it all the more confusing.
This should do the trick. Remember to swap the gate and trigger outputs (2 pin connector).
Attachments
IMG_6794.jpg

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Fri Jan 29, 2021 12:50 am

fallout wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 10:24 pm
kristop wrote:
Thu Jan 28, 2021 2:27 pm
Thanks, I did come across this... the destinations aren't as much of a problem as where to hook up on that board. Seems like the supplied parts kit could use an update to this new board, which makes it all the more confusing.
This should do the trick. Remember to swap the gate and trigger outputs (2 pin connector).
Aha! Thanks. See this build does have the 100n caps on either side of the power header.... Hm.

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synthcube
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by synthcube » Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:28 pm

Question for the group regarding questions around the 2N5460 . We have stock from two makers here-- On Semi and Fairchild--- and they appear to test with different pinouts (!)

What are people's experiences with this please?

2N5460 comparison.jpg
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KSS
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by KSS » Fri Jan 29, 2021 4:39 pm

^Not sure what you're asking?
Experience is yes, that kind of thing is normal.
Twist the body 45 degrees -off the axis 'line' of the legs- and the DS-SD leg swap -when necssary- is easier.

AKA no big deal. <-- When you read the datasheets.

Old school DIY build instructions often had visuals like you've done here to show the different parts which might be supplied with the kit so a proper build could be made with the parts one received.
Treat utility modules as stars instead of backup singers.
Treat power supplies like Rockstars instead of roadies!
Chase magic sound, not magic parts.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by amonti » Fri Jan 29, 2021 9:36 pm

synthcube wrote:
Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:28 pm
Question for the group regarding questions around the 2N5460 . We have stock from two makers here-- On Semi and Fairchild--- and they appear to test with different pinouts (!)

What are people's experiences with this please?


2N5460 comparison.jpg
My experience is when I'm heads-down building, I don't test new components, and if I built the order myself on DigiKey/Mouser, I only verify that the right value/part is in the right place. With 3rd-party/eBay suppliers, I'm more careful, but for my Synthcube parts, unless otherwise indicated, I trust they match the BOM specs - including pinouts.

I would have to know in advance that the pinouts were different or have a very clear note in the parts bag indicating the alternate configuration. For the 2N5460, yes, even ones that are marked with a manufacturer code can be fake; mine were clearly "Fairchild", but I only determined that they were fake after they were installed.

Oddly enough, I've since installed an SOT23 J177 on an SOT23 to DIP adapter board and it appears to be working quite well - not sure why more people aren't recommending the J177 as an alternate to the 2N5460.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:53 pm

Having trouble with my ADSR... Sort of the same as described a few days back. My A/D/S are all instantly 10v when manually fired and instantly back to 0. My R moves up to 10v wh3n I move the slider up and the stays there.

Could this be related to the 2N5460 and the pin out issue being talked about above?

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:45 pm

kristop wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:53 pm
Having trouble with my ADSR... Sort of the same as described a few days back. My A/D/S are all instantly 10v when manually fired and instantly back to 0. My R moves up to 10v wh3n I move the slider up and the stays there.

Could this be related to the 2N5460 and the pin out issue being talked about above?
If the parts were provided in a Synthcube kit, I would say it's very possible and even likely. If you have a transistor tester, I would desolder them and see if first they test as JFETs (and not BJTs), mine didn't. It sounds like a few of us had the same problem.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by amonti » Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:57 pm

fallout wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:45 pm
kristop wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:53 pm
Having trouble with my ADSR... Sort of the same as described a few days back. My A/D/S are all instantly 10v when manually fired and instantly back to 0. My R moves up to 10v wh3n I move the slider up and the stays there.

Could this be related to the 2N5460 and the pin out issue being talked about above?
If the parts were provided in a Synthcube kit, I would say it's very possible and even likely. If you have a transistor tester, I would desolder them and see if first they test as JFETs (and not BJTs), mine didn't. It sounds like a few of us had the same problem.
Completely agree, but my AR and ADSR weren't firing at all - just a drone. I checked here before I started debugging and saw a post to check the 5460s, and sure enough, mine were BJTs. I had a spare 5460 and the ADSR came to life, then I added a J177 and the AR started working as well.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:08 pm

I don't have a tester.... Is it a matter or rotating them, or do I need new 5460s?

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fallout
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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:11 pm

kristop wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:08 pm
I don't have a tester.... Is it a matter or rotating them, or do I need new 5460s?
If I didn't have a tester, I'd replace them with good 2n5460's and save yourself the hassle of desoldering, soldering, desoldering.. etc

It's likely you got the same parts as the rest of us.

Also make a note that other 2n5460's might have a different pinout and you will have to swap pins. Check the datasheet of whichever ones you get.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:34 pm

fallout wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:11 pm

If I didn't have a tester, I'd replace them with good 2n5460's and save yourself the hassle of desoldering, soldering, desoldering.. etc

It's likely you got the same parts as the rest of us.

Also make a note that other 2n5460's might have a different pinout and you will have to swap pins. Check the datasheet of whichever ones you get.
But is not just a pin out problem with these ones then?

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:48 pm

kristop wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:34 pm
fallout wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 6:11 pm

If I didn't have a tester, I'd replace them with good 2n5460's and save yourself the hassle of desoldering, soldering, desoldering.. etc

It's likely you got the same parts as the rest of us.

Also make a note that other 2n5460's might have a different pinout and you will have to swap pins. Check the datasheet of whichever ones you get.
But is not just a pin out problem with these ones then?
It doesn't appear to be but I haven't tested personally. Check who manufactured the 2n5460's you received and then check their datasheets for their pinouts.

The TTSH v4 PCB pads are orientated for pins 1(D) 2(S) 3(G) on the 2N5460's. For instance, I used Motorola 2n5460's whose pinouts are 1(S) 2(D) 3(G) and I had to swap pins 1 and 2.

Honestly, I'd save myself the trouble and just replace them with proper 2N5460's.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by Jaytee » Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:00 pm

fallout wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 5:45 pm
kristop wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 4:53 pm
Having trouble with my ADSR... Sort of the same as described a few days back. My A/D/S are all instantly 10v when manually fired and instantly back to 0. My R moves up to 10v wh3n I move the slider up and the stays there.

Could this be related to the 2N5460 and the pin out issue being talked about above?
If the parts were provided in a Synthcube kit, I would say it's very possible and even likely. If you have a transistor tester, I would desolder them and see if first they test as JFETs (and not BJTs), mine didn't. It sounds like a few of us had the same problem.
Fwiw—not saying your hypothesis is wrong or anything—don’t treat those cheap transistor testers as the end word on anything. I occasionally find that a JFET will test as a BJT for some inexplicable reason but invariably still work as expected in-circuit.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:07 pm

Jaytee wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:00 pm
Fwiw—not saying your hypothesis is wrong or anything—don’t treat those cheap transistor testers as the end word on anything. I occasionally find that a JFET will test as a BJT for some inexplicable reason but invariably still work as expected in-circuit.
That could very well be the case, I don't think any of us have tried swapping pins on the transistors provided with the kit so I suppose it's worth a shot. I just hate having to desolder parts more than necessary!

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by amonti » Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:59 pm

fallout wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:07 pm
Jaytee wrote:
Sat Jan 30, 2021 7:00 pm
Fwiw—not saying your hypothesis is wrong or anything—don’t treat those cheap transistor testers as the end word on anything. I occasionally find that a JFET will test as a BJT for some inexplicable reason but invariably still work as expected in-circuit.
That could very well be the case, I don't think any of us have tried swapping pins on the transistors provided with the kit so I suppose it's worth a shot. I just hate having to desolder parts more than necessary!
I double-checked the Fairchild specs before desoldering just in case I had to swap legs, but the specs matched the BOM/board exactly. Both transistors tested as BJT in DCA Pro, while my one spare tested as P-Channel JFET, so I didn’t try swapping legs. I’d be weary of swapping legs on a transistor with clear markings and a matching datasheet. I did buy the Peak tester after some odd measurements with a $20 tester, so I’d be cautious with cheap testers as well.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by fallout » Sat Jan 30, 2021 8:43 pm

Mine were tested with a DCA75 as well, for whatever that's worth. I haven't seen it mis-test anything in the time I've had it but it's not like I've tested hundreds of transistors.

It's a $1 part, swap it and be done with it.

Did I say I hate desoldering? :guinness:

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by ebfx » Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:34 pm

synthcube wrote:
Fri Jan 29, 2021 2:28 pm
Question for the group regarding questions around the 2N5460 . We have stock from two makers here-- On Semi and Fairchild--- and they appear to test with different pinouts (!)

What are people's experiences with this please?


2N5460 comparison.jpg
Unfortunately, I didn't hold on to the originals (from the full kit) after removing them from board. My replacements have the pinout on the right (S-D-G) so I had to swap the pins when installing. At this point I have no way of knowing if the originals were bad, or they had a different pinout that messed them up after the first power on.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by ebfx » Sun Jan 31, 2021 2:41 pm

ebfx wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 6:52 pm
fallout wrote:
Wed Jan 27, 2021 3:56 pm
Now that the noise problem is fixed, I've encountered another problem caused by the LM301AN.

When calibrating the internal clock, I was not able to adjust the period to slower than 1 second. The rate init trimmer would reach a point and the square wave would go flat. I swapped out A42 for one of my spare LM301AN's and the problem was resolved.

@ebfx I'm curious if you encounter this as well.
Hadn't gotten there yet, so I just took a look and I'm seeing the same thing. I've got a friend who's supposed to bring over a couple of LM301's from his stock later this week (all of mine are from Synthcube, his are not). I'll let you know what I find.
Update: The LM301's my friend had were also from National Semi (though with a different date code) and behave exactly the same in my circuit. In addition, I tried the 100k to GND as suggested by KSS but that had no effect either.

Looks like it's time to track down a LM301 from a different supplier. Anyone have any experience with the SMT-to-DIP adapters or am I better off just trying to track down some old stock in DIP packages?

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:45 pm

Oh good.... Both Digikey & Mouser are sold out of 2N5460s. :bang:

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by ebfx » Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:13 pm

kristop wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 3:45 pm
Oh good.... Both Digikey & Mouser are sold out of 2N5460s. :bang:
Got mine from NTE Electronics via DigiKey. Why don't you try www.ntepartsdirect.com and see if you can get them directly? They weren't cheap, and they were packaged pretty poorly, but I got them quickly and they worked great.

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Re: [AVAILABLE] TTSH V4 Build Thread

Post by kristop » Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:23 pm

ebfx wrote:
Mon Feb 01, 2021 4:13 pm
Got mine from NTE Electronics via DigiKey. Why don't you try www.ntepartsdirect.com and see if you can get them directly? They weren't cheap, and they were packaged pretty poorly, but I got them quickly and they worked great.
Just checked, unfortunately, I'm in Canada and their only shipping option is $26USD. Digikey would be ideal as their shipping is $8CAD for 2 day service.

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