Model 416 Easel Breakout-Box [preliminary interest check]

Discussing some incredible modules that don't quite fit into the other forum categories.

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vgermuse
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Post by vgermuse » Sun Mar 20, 2016 5:15 pm

+1 for option B full. And WOW! USG OMG!

ninGiaBoom
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Post by ninGiaBoom » Mon Mar 21, 2016 9:05 am

+1 for option B diy plus panel!!! this thing is wonderful

Chediak
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Post by Chediak » Mon Mar 21, 2016 10:07 am

niceee

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Post by suhrawardi » Mon Mar 21, 2016 1:37 pm

+1, looks very interesting... :-)

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Post by paranoidmoonduck » Mon Mar 21, 2016 3:37 pm

Just bought an Easel and very interested in the fully built version of it.

x180r19
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Post by x180r19 » Mon Mar 21, 2016 5:14 pm

Definitely interested in the fully built option.

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tailwagger
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Post by tailwagger » Thu Mar 24, 2016 12:11 am

I'll be Easeling again soon. I am FULLY interested. :banana:
On the Easel

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Re: Model 416 Easel Breakout-Box [preliminary interest check

Post by Ernst » Fri Mar 25, 2016 9:03 am

Definitely interested in the fully built option B.

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550b
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Post by 550b » Sat Mar 26, 2016 2:21 pm

Interested in the fully-built Option B!

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:24 am

Image

https://vimeo.com/161040101

Right.
As seen in the video (don't know how to embed it here; please click the link above), the 416 Edge Card with a Program Card inserted, is blocking the left side of the 416 Meta Expander...

A previous version of the 416 Edge Card had a much lower profile, with the Program Card inserted at the front of the Edge Card (which would be incompatible with BEMI's iProgram Card). But it'll still be somewhat in the way.

I'm open to suggestions !


cheers,
_guy

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vanadl138
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Post by vanadl138 » Thu Mar 31, 2016 9:54 am

gddfp wrote:Image

https://vimeo.com/161040101

Right.
As seen in the video (don't know how to embed it here; please click the link above), the 416 Edge Card with a Program Card inserted, is blocking the left side of the 416 Meta Expander...

A previous version of the 416 Edge Card had a much lower profile, with the Program Card inserted at the front of the Edge Card (which would be incompatible with BEMI's iProgram Card). But it'll still be somewhat in the way.

I'm open to suggestions !


cheers,
_guy
Nice animatic. Is there a way to insert the program card into the left side slot of the breakout box, rather than into the easel itself? This way the left side of the panel would be fully accessible.

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studiokpg
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Post by studiokpg » Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:19 am

Great work! :hail: I love the video, but it points out the problem very well. Maybe there's a way to have a slot for program cards on top or side of the expander?

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rkilman
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Post by rkilman » Thu Mar 31, 2016 10:34 am

gddfp wrote:Image

https://vimeo.com/161040101

Right.
As seen in the video (don't know how to embed it here; please click the link above), the 416 Edge Card with a Program Card inserted, is blocking the left side of the 416 Meta Expander...

A previous version of the 416 Edge Card had a much lower profile, with the Program Card inserted at the front of the Edge Card (which would be incompatible with BEMI's iProgram Card). But it'll still be somewhat in the way.

I'm open to suggestions !


cheers,
_guy
Maybe swap the location of the 416 module and the 208 module.

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island
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Post by island » Thu Mar 31, 2016 12:59 pm

gddfp wrote:Image

https://vimeo.com/161040101

Right.
As seen in the video (don't know how to embed it here; please click the link above), the 416 Edge Card with a Program Card inserted, is blocking the left side of the 416 Meta Expander...

A previous version of the 416 Edge Card had a much lower profile, with the Program Card inserted at the front of the Edge Card (which would be incompatible with BEMI's iProgram Card). But it'll still be somewhat in the way.

I'm open to suggestions !


cheers,
_guy
Wow, brilliant :hail: 'Make your dreams come true' :banana:
Easel + 416 Meta Expander & Snoopy a big show

reverberation
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Post by reverberation » Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:01 pm

Do it! / Interested!

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yan6
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Post by yan6 » Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:41 pm

A longer ribbon cable and the expanded can be placed elsewhere?

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captnapalm
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Post by captnapalm » Thu Mar 31, 2016 3:45 pm

yan6 wrote:A longer ribbon cable and the expanded can be placed elsewhere?
Yes, this. I'd say let the user decide how the boats are arranged.

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Thu Mar 31, 2016 5:55 pm

Thank you all for the suggestions !

The move the Program Card slot to the 416 idea has circulated my brain for a while, but I abandoned it for several reasons:
  • - It means a complete redesign of *everything* --> another month or more lost.
    - There's not really any space left in the Expander.
    - It's mechanically quite challenging.
    - My IDC cable crimping tool only goes to 50. :-) Such a design would require a 60-pin IDC assembly...
As I said before, the first Edge Card designs were of a much lower profile (Program Card in front), but that only shaves off .75", which is still a bit in the way of the 416 Expander.

I've been using my old 644 Expander hoovering slightly above the Easel on an adjustable laptop stand, which I've found quite satisfactory. Whenever I want to use a Program Card (*), I simply slide the stand a bit backwards to give room for it. Not super-elegant, but it does work.

(*) I seldom use Program Cards within the Easel + Expander environment, because once you start cross-patching, the Program Card loses most of its appeal & functionality. And no, there's not going to be a secondary Expander-Program-Card thing... :-)

I have another idea, but will first test that in my 3D simulator. Hang on...


For now, I'm inclined to just house the Expander in a simple, bog standard 19" boat, and leave its positioning to the user; as some of you suggested. Sliding the boat a bit to the right or backwards works well, I guess, but it's not the most aesthetically-pleasing solution. Though it's not the end of the world either.


I'll be back.

_g

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boops
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Post by boops » Sat Apr 02, 2016 5:23 am

Really Nice work...
My solutions:
With the almost finished PMB (preset manager Box for 208 rev2 ,i dont know atm If it càn work with the Bemi easel)
It Will use the 56 edge connector too,but as it an external little device No problemo with the access of the expander boat
viewtopic.php?t=140876&highlight=
Imho,the easel,+expander+Preset manager should be a great design tool ,for live and studio sessions.
My solution for the external expander boat (created one year ago)

Here the result with a bemi case
Perhaps ,with a 5U or 6U boat ,the PMB or another 56 edge slot càn be put In the left side of the mega expander?

Image

Image

Image

Image
Image
Wood cheeks possible,too

Image
FS :custom buchla 203 style càbinet ,skiff new design,boat ,hardware for diy cabinet ,easel case ,new 1u to 10u to 56u and more. / New 208 buchla card 12 /
HQ small case buchla psu PCB
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewt ... 93#3118393
https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewt ... highlight=

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Sun Apr 03, 2016 12:40 am

boops wrote:Really Nice work...
My solutions:
With the almost finished PMB (preset manager Box for 208 rev2 ,i dont know atm If it càn work with the Bemi easel)
It Will use the 56 edge connector too,but as it an external little device No problemo with the access of the expander boat
viewtopic.php?t=140876&highlight=
Imho,the easel,+expander+Preset manager should be a great design tool ,for live and studio sessions.
My solution for the external expander boat (created one year ago)
How do you bring out the edge connector to your PMB, Boops ?

I've seen your designs for the external boats before, and they're nice. But I'm inclined to leave the choice of something like that (side cheeks) to the user, and just offer a simple 19" boat for the 416 Expander. That way the user can position the 416 Expander anywhere he/she sees fit.

As for a duplicate of the Easel's edge connector somewhere on the 416 Expander, so Program Cards can be inserted on the 416 Expander instead of the Easel: there's really no room [on the main PCB] for it unless I drop some functionality... (ie. leave off at least one column of knobs & jacks). Even if I'd would like to try that (though I seriously hesitate giving up any functionality) -- just to see if it would work, this would require an enormous amount of work and would certainly push the ETA several months back.
But I'm still looking at possible solutions...

_g

jhulk
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Post by jhulk » Sun Apr 03, 2016 8:33 am

instead of having it plugged in the top could you not have a ribbon cable extender so that the card could be put next to both items like a scsi drive would do from a scsi port so you get easy access
a simple edge connector and idc ribbon to a idc edge connector

would not cost much and would not take much time todo

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gddfp
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Post by gddfp » Sun Apr 03, 2016 5:05 pm

jhulk wrote:instead of having it plugged in the top could you not have a ribbon cable extender so that the card could be put next to both items like a scsi drive would do from a scsi port so you get easy access
a simple edge connector and idc ribbon to a idc edge connector

would not cost much and would not take much time todo
I'm not 100% sure how to visualize your suggestion, jhulk... could you please point me to some sort of related-image or something ?

It's important to know that the current interface & expander setup use a 50-pin IDC connection, while the Easel has a 56-pin edge connector. Any change in the choice of the number of pins of the IDC connector means a rather serious redesign, though I'm certainly not adverse to it if that results in a better product for everyone.

_g

jhulk
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Post by jhulk » Mon Apr 04, 2016 4:58 pm

ok you make a small pcb that is a edge connector 56 pin then on this small pcb which is big enough to take a through hole 56pin idc female socket

male 56 idc plug to 56 way ribbon

make the 56 way ribbon cable that is long enough to go to the side of easel an then a 56 pin idc female edge connector for the cards to fit in

some thing like this .

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-sockets/8600021/

i can only find 60 pin idc versions though through hole versions are 56 pins so you could just make a second smalll pcb with a 56 pin idc socket
https://www.rockby.com.au/searchresSql_ ... &offset=11

so for an extra £15-25 would be a neat solution to the problem with out changing any of your adapter but if its easier to change the adapter to not have the top edge connector but a 56 pin idc which would make it even shorter you could just then use that edge connector on the idc cable extension cord on a small pcb with a 56pin idc socket and the edge connector

jhulk
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Post by jhulk » Mon Apr 04, 2016 5:10 pm

this way if people want it longer they can make up there own idc cable

idc crimps are cheap and only takes a few minutes to make a cable

i used to do a lot of scsi conversion cables for the mpc60 and 3000 and ensoniqs using iodat and acards 7720u and 7720uw

25pin idc to 50 pin and 68 pin just using 25pin ribbon cable

before the raizin monster and scsi2sd came along

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Post by gddfp » Mon Apr 04, 2016 6:47 pm

Ehm, perhaps I'm missing something completely, but what you describe is what I've been doing for the last two years, and what the 416 Edge Card to 416 Expander solution does now...

Or ??

_g
jhulk wrote:ok you make a small pcb that is a edge connector 56 pin then on this small pcb which is big enough to take a through hole 56pin idc female socket

male 56 idc plug to 56 way ribbon

make the 56 way ribbon cable that is long enough to go to the side of easel an then a 56 pin idc female edge connector for the cards to fit in

some thing like this .

http://uk.rs-online.com/web/p/pcb-sockets/8600021/

i can only find 60 pin idc versions though through hole versions are 56 pins so you could just make a second smalll pcb with a 56 pin idc socket
https://www.rockby.com.au/searchresSql_ ... &offset=11

so for an extra £15-25 would be a neat solution to the problem with out changing any of your adapter but if its easier to change the adapter to not have the top edge connector but a 56 pin idc which would make it even shorter you could just then use that edge connector on the idc cable extension cord on a small pcb with a 56pin idc socket and the edge connector

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