Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by acidbob » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:12 am

Red Electric Rainbow wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:38 am
acidbob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:39 am
Yeah, I have strongly consideret it but think I would miss the chord function. Do you know if the digitakt can do this as well?
i cannot confirm or deny. i can almost guarantee if you ask on the elektronaut forum you’ll have an answer pretty quickly.
I can do chords now, perfect. I just saw that this is completely similar to Digitone which makes Digitakt even better in terms of sequencing compared to Octatrack :) Thank for leading my to this

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Technologear? » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:46 am

Red Electric Rainbow wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:38 am
acidbob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:39 am
Yeah, I have strongly consideret it but think I would miss the chord function. Do you know if the digitakt can do this as well?
i cannot confirm or deny. i can almost guarantee if you ask on the elektronaut forum you’ll have an answer pretty quickly.
The DT can do 4 note poly chords, that you program per step by turning the 4 note selection knobs (top row), and you watch on the screen each note shift along the display keyboard. Like telling someone where to place their fingers on a piano. Is that the same as the DTone?
(The DT is my primary sequencer, I use it's 8 midi tracks more than its 8 internal sample tracks because of its darn lack of indiv outs)

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Technologear? » Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:47 am

Superfluous response removed

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by acidbob » Mon Nov 16, 2020 10:11 am

Technologear? wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 9:46 am
Red Electric Rainbow wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 8:38 am
acidbob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 7:39 am
Yeah, I have strongly consideret it but think I would miss the chord function. Do you know if the digitakt can do this as well?
i cannot confirm or deny. i can almost guarantee if you ask on the elektronaut forum you’ll have an answer pretty quickly.
The DT can do 4 note poly chords, that you program per step by turning the 4 note selection knobs (top row), and you watch on the screen each note shift along the display keyboard. Like telling someone where to place their fingers on a piano. Is that the same as the DTone?
(The DT is my primary sequencer, I use it's 8 midi tracks more than its 8 internal sample tracks because of its darn lack of indiv outs)
The Digitone is a bit different then I think, here you have a chord "mode" Quick video here

I use this all the time. It's brilliant

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Rost + Licht » Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:17 pm

acidbob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:56 am
Rost + Licht wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:04 am
After years of using a cirklon I can say even an MPC One is better. Also in tying a studio together. It's really a rather boring thing to sit down to. If someone seeks quick and joyful complexity and heaps more happy accidents I recommended the Polyend Tracker. That infamous Steffi jam people talking about here is rather cringe but a good example of what is doable with the cirklon without having to dive down the Marianne trench of menues and calculations as it seems with this sequencer to get any slight resemblance of sth you can come up with an max for live plugin seq in like 10secs.
Polyend Tracker, no thank you. I am just sticking to my Elektron Digitone, only 4 midi tracks, but it can do mostly everything I would ever need
Hm, I first wasn't sure if I should even answer to you crawling out of the woodwork like that, but

>it can do mostly everything I would ever need

And that's your problem here, not the PTs, or anyone elses for that fact. While I use the PTs for internal sequencing and adding that wierd tight rhythmical layer to a bigger composition, I'd go as far and say it literally shits all over the Elektron sequencing from a 'what it can do perspective'. The rising rolls and ratcheting alone just sounds incredible tight. Lots of Randomness possibilities.
Combined with possible MIDI Cc modulation.. ciao.

Always find the Digi-Modules stay kinda locked in a Jam Mode, nothing too impressive over the course of a whole track. But maybe that's just about enough for an Acidbob, I find it boring and only way to mask the lack of progression are hectic p-lock shenanigans. Also the FM engine in the digitone is kind of whack. "Even" compared to a TX81z or DX11. Always kinda meh, makes you urge to fill those 4 tracks instead of working one really unique sound out. It's good for making lots of noise and fast, I give you that.

I'd go as far and say Elektron is one of the reasons for influx of tryhard and anemic "experimental" electronic music. Nicht Fisch nicht Fleisch.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by skkatter » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:09 pm

synthfanatic wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 5:27 am
supersteps is definitely a unique feature that is missing. For those who haven't been lucky enough to have spent time with a Notron sequencer (I think less than 200 were made?) it's a function which allows the user to use a preset waveform to a specific step. You can program different waveforms to different steps on the same MIDI channel so that crosstalk between the waveform occurs which allows for unique effects. Examples where this can be applied include pitchbend, aftertouch, and MIDI delay; pretty cool and unique once you get the hang of it.
I've heard a bit about this superstep function as I have a Genoqs Octopus and they even reference it in their manual for that but I'd love to see or hear the Notron actually doing this.

*edit* Just found the Octopus superstep chat: https://medias.audiofanzine.com/files/g ... 470185.pdf
In the Genoqs Octopus manual they are called "hypersteps" (cheeky!): http://genoqs.net/wp-content/uploads/20 ... E_v500.pdf

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by acidbob » Mon Nov 16, 2020 1:58 pm

Rost + Licht wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 12:17 pm
acidbob wrote:
Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:56 am
Rost + Licht wrote:
Sat Nov 07, 2020 1:04 am
After years of using a cirklon I can say even an MPC One is better. Also in tying a studio together. It's really a rather boring thing to sit down to. If someone seeks quick and joyful complexity and heaps more happy accidents I recommended the Polyend Tracker. That infamous Steffi jam people talking about here is rather cringe but a good example of what is doable with the cirklon without having to dive down the Marianne trench of menues and calculations as it seems with this sequencer to get any slight resemblance of sth you can come up with an max for live plugin seq in like 10secs.
Polyend Tracker, no thank you. I am just sticking to my Elektron Digitone, only 4 midi tracks, but it can do mostly everything I would ever need
Hm, I first wasn't sure if I should even answer to you crawling out of the woodwork like that, but

>it can do mostly everything I would ever need

And that's your problem here, not the PTs, or anyone elses for that fact. While I use the PTs for internal sequencing and adding that wierd tight rhythmical layer to a bigger composition, I'd go as far and say it literally shits all over the Elektron sequencing from a 'what it can do perspective'. The rising rolls and ratcheting alone just sounds incredible tight. Lots of Randomness possibilities.
Combined with possible MIDI Cc modulation.. ciao.

Always find the Digi-Modules stay kinda locked in a Jam Mode, nothing too impressive over the course of a whole track. But maybe that's just about enough for an Acidbob, I find it boring and only way to mask the lack of progression are hectic p-lock shenanigans. Also the FM engine in the digitone is kind of whack. "Even" compared to a TX81z or DX11. Always kinda meh, makes you urge to fill those 4 tracks instead of working one really unique sound out. It's good for making lots of noise and fast, I give you that.

I'd go as far and say Elektron is one of the reasons for influx of tryhard and anemic "experimental" electronic music. Nicht Fisch nicht Fleisch.
I am just saying that my experience with Polyend is not good to put it mildly. bugs on bugs.
I am not using the digi as my master, the Machinedrum is the master in my setup, I am using it together with several of these pedals which makes my two machinedrums do per step tempo. Imagine sub steps on the new machine, well the MD can do this as well. http://www.moltenvoltage.com/products/T ... ltage.html Song mode and all that.
I am not saying that Elektron is the king, just saying that I used to do trackers many years ago.
But from my perspective I can do everything blindly on these machines also entire songs.
Also the MD can record all your movements and create lots of random with a few CTR8P machines, then you just add two of them and modulate one with another, this can even be done with MIDI CC and you can create all the LFO's you want, and.
It has song mode, with last step, repeats, and tempo. Rolls no problem, put an LFO on that sucker holding several steps at at time let's you change several steps at a time.
But I totally respect that each person has their way of working. And I somewhat agree with you in what you are saying but all of what you just mentioned even an old machine from 2001 can do. So I am not sure I have a problem.
In this track I used the Miami for drums and the rest is Digitone and external Roland Boutiques, all sequenced and CC controlled from the MD. Might not be a superb track, but I think it's a track/song.
Sorry if I have offended you about PT. But it's just my personal experience wasnt good. Yours might be better.
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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by BlinkyLights » Mon Nov 16, 2020 2:16 pm

dadRabbit wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:10 am
If I'm not mistaken isn't RDJ one of the first users of the Cirklon? That would be my guess why it's so popular among the many other obvious reasons.
How does he have time, with Iron Man and all that?

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by daphnid » Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:52 pm

For x0x style sequencers, it's pretty much down to the Cirklon and the Octatrack. I have a x0x influenced brain, it's what I learned on. I use a few other types of sequencers in eurorack, but remain a x0x slave overall. Sometimes I regret not making myself more familiar with MPCs as I think in some ways they are better master sequencer interfaces, especially for sequencing and performing whole tracks live and adding human dynamics, but here I am.

The Octatrack is and incredible sequencer/sampler, and probably the best readily available x0x seq out there. But the Cirklon is next level, and goes beyond the places that elektron has already elevated the x0x interface to (which were revelatory at the time).

It's also just a gorgeous piece of hardware, if that's your aesthetic, and it is mine. It's a tool fetishist's sequencer in terms of build, function, and to a lesser degree rarity.

I've played one, I would love one, I know, but I have an Octatrack and it gets the job done. I've also spent years sweating over the OT, learning it, building a repertoire of signature tricks, and the discomfort of learning a new, complex sequencer that costs a couple grand is enough to put me off from trying to get one. Sometimes I wonder what sick shit I'd come up with on a Cirklon but that's a mental trap I try to ignore as much as possible, with any gear. There's also this kind of status symbol aspect to things like the Cirklon that puts me off.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by dubonaire » Wed Nov 18, 2020 1:34 am

dadRabbit wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:10 am
If I'm not mistaken isn't RDJ one of the first users of the Cirklon? That would be my guess why it's so popular among the many other obvious reasons.
I gather from one of Colin's comments that he used a pre-production P3 so yeah, one of the first first users.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Red Electric Rainbow » Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:32 am

daphnid wrote:
Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:52 pm
I've also spent years sweating over the OT, learning it, building a repertoire of signature tricks, and the discomfort of learning a new, complex sequencer that costs a couple grand is enough to put me off from trying to get one.
taking secondhand price mark-ups out of the equation, there isn’t a huge price difference between the two units if purchased brand new.
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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by daphnid » Wed Nov 18, 2020 12:29 pm

Red Electric Rainbow wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 3:32 am
daphnid wrote:
Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:52 pm
I've also spent years sweating over the OT, learning it, building a repertoire of signature tricks, and the discomfort of learning a new, complex sequencer that costs a couple grand is enough to put me off from trying to get one.
taking secondhand price mark-ups out of the equation, there isn’t a huge price difference between the two units if purchased brand new.
Yeah I suppose that's true. I got my OT for $900 though, and it's my main instrument for live sets. I also already have it. For those that don't, I've seen 1st gen Octatracks go for 6-700 in very good condition the past couple years. And they're easy to find. The only Cicklon that you can buy on the internet right now is going for over 3k.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by dubonaire » Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:35 pm

daphnid wrote:
Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:52 pm
I've played one, I would love one, I know, but I have an Octatrack and it gets the job done. I've also spent years sweating over the OT, learning it, building a repertoire of signature tricks, and the discomfort of learning a new, complex sequencer that costs a couple grand is enough to put me off from trying to get one. Sometimes I wonder what sick shit I'd come up with on a Cirklon but that's a mental trap I try to ignore as much as possible, with any gear. There's also this kind of status symbol aspect to things like the Cirklon that puts me off.
I'm not a big fan of steep learning curves, I'm pretty impatient. I honestly don't think Cirklon is a steep learning curve. Maybe it has a shallow learning curve to do most things and then the curve gets a bit steeper if you want to go deep into aux events and the accumulator. But if Octatrack is meeting your needs and you are not very limited by it then the only strong reasons to replace the Octatrack with a Cirklon are for its incredibly solid timing and its I/O capacity. Maybe both together would be cool. I use about five sequencers all the time. One in a sampler and two in my rack on top of the Cirklon, and the DAW of course.

I've never thought of the Cirklon as a status symbol, I really don't get that. It's just a sequencer. It's not the most beautiful piece of equipment and certainly is not the most expensive piece either. That should never be a reason not to get a piece of gear, that's only in your head.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by skkatter » Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am

daphnid wrote:
Tue Nov 17, 2020 11:52 pm
I've also spent years sweating over the OT, learning it, building a repertoire of signature tricks, and the discomfort of learning a new, complex sequencer that costs a couple grand is enough to put me off from trying to get one.
I own both a Cirklon and an Octatrack and I found the Cirklon to be much *much* easier to master (well, almost master, I am always learning!) than the Octatrack. The Octatrack takes pride of place as one of the few things in my studio I have almost thrown out the window in sheer frustration. :)

I'm currently working on a series of Cirklon tutorial videos, somebody posted a link to one of them already but there are three so far:

CK Pattern:
Track Control Values:
Song, Scene, Track pages and instrument definitions:

Next up will be P3 patterns and then the elusive aux events.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by syncretism » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:04 am

6667 wrote:
Thu Nov 05, 2020 11:17 pm
hi there,
<good long shaggy-dog joke/>
Bravo. There are likely more helpful responses in this thread, but I laughed aloud.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by syncretism » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:09 am

skkatter wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am

Song, Scene, Track pages and instrument definitions:

Next up will be P3 patterns and then the elusive aux events.
This is great stuff, and your old FAS radio voice classes did not go to waste. ;)

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Red Electric Rainbow » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:12 am

skkatter wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am
I'm currently working on a series of Cirklon tutorial videos, somebody posted a link to one of them already but there are three so far:

CK Pattern
Track Control Values
Song, Scene, Track pages and instrument definitions

Next up will be P3 patterns and then the elusive aux events.
im a visual learner and based on my experience after watching the CK pattern video, these are gonna be super helpful. much appreciated, seriously.
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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by beatcleaver » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:31 am

skkatter wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am
I'm currently working on a series of Cirklon tutorial videos, somebody posted a link to one of them already but there are three so far:
In all seriousness you've done an immense service to Cirklon users here.

(though if you keep it up with those GX1 quips, we're going to have to hunt you down)

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by solitud » Thu Nov 19, 2020 6:48 am

skkatter wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am
I own both a Cirklon and an Octatrack and I found the Cirklon to be much *much* easier to master (well, almost master, I am always learning!) than the Octatrack. The Octatrack takes pride of place as one of the few things in my studio I have almost thrown out the window in sheer frustration. :)
The Octatrack broke me. I know it's an amazing piece of gear in the right hands. But obviously that are not my hands.
I never went into a jammy mood with this thing, it felt always like a stressful highschool math test.

I don't say that I understand the Cirklon in full but that is my summarized experience:
The Cirklon has one record button and if I press that button it records.
The Octatrack has TWO record buttons but no matter which one you press it won't record.

Your tutorials are awesome btw!
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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by daphnid » Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:23 pm

dubonaire wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:35 pm
I've never thought of the Cirklon as a status symbol, I really don't get that. It's just a sequencer. It's not the most beautiful piece of equipment and certainly is not the most expensive piece either. That should never be a reason not to get a piece of gear, that's only in your head.
It's not cheap either, but its status comes more from its rarity. It's definitely a revered piece of equipment that people make a point to bring up if someone has one, at least in my circle.

That shit doesn't prevent me from buying something I want. Just saying it's kind of a put off, that quest for elite/elusive gear.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by dubonaire » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:29 pm

daphnid wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 7:23 pm
dubonaire wrote:
Wed Nov 18, 2020 5:35 pm
I've never thought of the Cirklon as a status symbol, I really don't get that. It's just a sequencer. It's not the most beautiful piece of equipment and certainly is not the most expensive piece either. That should never be a reason not to get a piece of gear, that's only in your head.
It's not cheap either, but its status comes more from its rarity. It's definitely a revered piece of equipment that people make a point to bring up if someone has one, at least in my circle.

That shit doesn't prevent me from buying something I want. Just saying it's kind of a put off, that quest for elite/elusive gear.
Interesting. I’m somewhat removed from my circle but we generally couldn’t care less about things like that. Here’s hoping it’s rarity is soon to be a thing of the past.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Bachelard » Thu Nov 19, 2020 8:43 pm

Leverkusen wrote:
Fri Nov 06, 2020 4:49 am
To me the most fascinating feature, apart from all the quality and quantity related points above, is how tracks can be internally routed to influence other tracks and how then even the amount of that influence can be influenced again by yet another track. Or several of them. And how this can affect all kind of parameters like pitch, delay, length, CC#, tempo, ratchet behavior and what not. All this while keeping the classic 16 step UI in an easily accessable way.
So, the Westlicht Sequencer module has this internal routing thing. Any of the 8 tracks (plus any of the 4 CV ins) can be assigned to one of many, many, parameters on any other track (e.g. pattern selection, mute state, clock division, start/end step, gate/pitch probability, etc.) Each routing can be applied to anywhere from 1 to all 8 of tracks. There are 16 routing slots. It also keeps the classic 16-step UI easily accessible on a generously-sized screen.

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Heavy Metal Kid » Fri Nov 20, 2020 2:20 am

skkatter wrote:
Thu Nov 19, 2020 5:55 am
I'm currently working on a series of Cirklon tutorial videos, somebody posted a link to one of them already but there are three so far
Great videos, thanks!

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by nodog » Fri Nov 20, 2020 5:01 am

Just wanna chime in and say the tutorial video's are awesome. Thank you so much for these skkatter.

I do read manuals and the Cirklon manual is really good but it's still hard to learn some of the not so obvious functions without someone explaining them clearly. I had the simple stuff sussed quite soonish on my own and learned some cool stuff at a Cirklon owners meeting some years ago. Still I feel I'm only using like 25% of the possibilities. These video's are surely helping me to get that percentage a lot higher. Thanks again!

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Re: Sequentix Cirklon - what make it so desirable?

Post by Elephantbud » Fri Nov 20, 2020 6:40 am

I had one for a year. I didn’t like it.
Build quality and features great. Super friendly company, looks nice...
But I didn’t get inspired by it.
From all the sequencers I had in 25 years of making music, I liked the octatrack midi sequencer the most. But I didn’t use the rest of it, so I sold it as well. Right now my favourite is the mfb urzwerg pro mk2!

What makes it so desirable? Maybe the fact that you can’t get one and have to wait 2 years?

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