Re-release (and use) of Cwejman S1 MKii in 2019

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BTByrd
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Post by BTByrd » Mon May 06, 2019 3:27 pm

Dave Peck wrote: I also wish we could get a Cwejman S1 MK II available from stock with no long wait and for a low price. Just want to point out that your comment does not reflect how contract manufacturing actually works. Assuming that a company is using a contract manufacturing facility to build their products, rather than their own in-house production capability, they typically have to pay a hefty deposit for the production run to the CM up front, often 50% of all materials, every time they want to start up a new production run of that product. And they may not get finished products until many months later, and they don't actually start getting any of their money back until months after THAT, when Thomann and Sweetwater get around to paying their bills for finished units that they received 60 days earlier.

This can mean that a company has to pay out many tens of thousands of dollars to the CM and then wait half a year or more before they start seeing it come back and pass the 'break even' point. This can be a huge cash flow challenge for a small company that is trying to make a production run of a product that isn't exactly cheap to make. And if they are not careful, this kind of cash flow problem can sink a company because they can literally go broke while waiting for the money they spent to come back in. I've worked in electronics manufacturing since about 1980 in both North America and China and I've seen companies go out of business due to exactly this kind of issue.

Knowing this stuff doesn't do anything to get us readily available affordable Cwejmans, I just thought I'd provide some info about why companies can't always just build whatever they want whenever they want to, even when there are customers ready & willing to buy the product.
Thank you for that, Dave. Genuinely! I admittedly don't know how contract manufacturing works in the synth industry and that was a helpful and concise overview. Though I'm a builder, I don't build synths and it is easy to project issues in one's own industry onto other industries. And I certainly don't want to misrepresent the situation, so thanks for pushing back on my pushback.

I know that's impossible for most synth builders to deliver a product that they build in-house unless they charge a fortune or deliver very slowly. I remember waiting for more than a year for Paul to build me a MOTM 440, but he had always told me "I'm slow, but I do good work." And that made sense to me. And when he kickstarted the E370, that made a lot of sense to me. But because I have no idea about contract manufacturing for electronics, the Cwejman situation just doesn't make sense to me. I'm still not sure it does, but thanks again for providing me with a helpful and concise explanation of the issue.
chiasticon wrote:
BTByrd wrote:I don't get it. But maybe I missed something.
admittedly I know nothing about the inner workings of his business as well. but my first thought is I think you may be over-estimating the demand of Cwejman products. I’d say even scaling up to Moog levels (~60 employees) of production would even be overstating it. and Moog don’t exactly have their lack of people saying their gear is too expensive. but they don’t have waiting lists either (other than newly released synths not yet in production). how many people does Uli employ? thousands, right?

I’m not saying you’re wrong that a shift in business could change things. I just think pointing to Uli and saying “do it like him, it’s easy” doesn’t seem like a reasonable expectation.
Maybe I'm overestimating demand for Cwejman, but I'm certainly not underestimating the supply relative to demand. There's a global Cwejman shortage that I don't understand. And virtually nobody else in the industry seems to have similar problems. I certainly wasn't saying "Do it like Uli" because I don't like a lot of things Uli does. Invoking him was meant to be inflammatory. But I do want to flood the earth with cheaper Cwejman without compromising on quality. Because those designs and circuits are amazing, and I think that everyone would be better for it except predatory collectors who hoard their precious unobtanium in their proverbial dungeon. The Cwejman module market is a speculator's market. I don't care for that kind of bubble, and would like to see it popped so all the cool kids can play with Cwejman Obtanium. Because Wowa does great work! I just wish there was more of it to go around. And it's exciting that there's a new round of S1's about to drop. I just won't stand in line.

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Post by BugBrand » Tue May 07, 2019 1:48 am

Interesting subject.

From my perspective, the view of 'robots' only covers some parts of assembly - production of boards and soldering of SMT parts. But the important hardware is harder - with regular production plants I've found out-sourcing the production of these parts to be problematic, so have always kept this in-house (ie. me soldering or now 1 assistant). Any mistakes made here are time consuming to fix - best to get it right first time, so good attention is needed. So, yes, full contract assembly could be good but, agreed, the start up for this can be expensive and time consuming - certainly it scared me off when I have considered it.

Also thoughts like how someone might want to run a company - do they want to be a manager, controlling what others do, or remain getting their hands somewhat dirty? Personally my head is not so good at letting go of certain areas! - it has been a very gradual process getting to where some areas can be completely out-sourced, and then a great assistant can be trusted to complete more involved steps. But I still keep some parts of production in my own hands. I have wondered about more assistants, but my brain is small and the responsibility is not something I really want.

I don't want to try to compare myself to Cwejman, but I have felt some similarities being happy to not push production too fast. Luckily I have not had the super hype aspects which do lead to quite unsavoury market ways.. Personally I tend to like 'keep it small' but it is a hard balancing act in the fast world today. Wowa keeps on keeping on in a steady way - this is good to see in many ways.

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Post by notmiserlouagain » Tue May 07, 2019 2:37 am

Hi BTB, this is NOT meant ad hominem, but my first reflex was "hey what a spoiled brat" (but not my second thought :chug: !). We live in the golden age of synthesis, I can remember when there was only Doepfer, AS, and a couple of orchids around, now I cannot overlook all synth modules and boxes available anymore.
If it has to be a Cwejman, "Little Consumer Boy" (again I´m overdoing it) can´t have it right now, right here, like the iShit, you have to wait, maybe Wowa Cwejman has a life too, maybe he has much different stuff going on? Anyway it´s up to him alone, so this discussion is fencing with the mirror.

Also I have seen small synth manufacturers go down in flames over one wrong decision...

Hope you´re not taken aback, I like to make drastic points :miley:
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Post by peripatitis » Tue May 07, 2019 4:39 am

BTByrd wrote:
peripatitis wrote:Why is noone complaining about Macbeth's prices or availability?
I think it is unfair to blame Cwejman for the craze, he doesn't really capitalize on it and we treat him as if he is coca cola refusing to make more coke's.
He might choose to have a life instead.

As for the future retro xs, it is not a poor man's s1 mk2, but rather a troglodyte's one,
3 times the xs price seems fair to me :)
The price is fair, but it could be lower and everyone could ball. I can go buy 4 XSs from Jared and polychain them right the fuck now. No waiting, no muss, no fuss. I'd rather do that than wait in line, but fanboys gonna fanboy. Call it a troglodyte's S1 again, sir, and I will invite you to check yourself before you wreck yourself. And don't go trying to bring MacBeth and Coke into this. Please. Wowa's curious business practices seem, to my eyes, to be objectionable in many of the ways that Coke's are. But let's try to keep it funky and focus on the synths and the music. And don't go shitting on Jared's quality product again. It's not an S1 at all. But I can get 4 of them instead, and at this point, I'd rather.
Future Retro are not mfb, the troglodyte comment was more of a joke to exaggerate perhaps the diffence that is though very evident between their semi,which i had for a couple of year, and the S1.
I was very excited to get that xs but quite soon it was clear to me, it wasn't flexible enough for what I expected a semi mono to be.
That second envelope design was not a good idea, the cv I/O was limited and the wide range of the oscilators was not that useful in the end (also the overdrive range was a bit limited), in the end i only enjoyed the filter.

Personally i found it ok for percussion work, but under no circumstances would i ever compare it with an s1 (which i don't have but have played with).

I don't always like having Cwejman modules, because whenever i get the urge to sell (as often in euro with every module) i know i probably won't get it back. I sold a couple of mine and know...
But i don't accuse Cwejman for that.
Cwejman prices were high from the beggining, when he could probably cover the needs.
I've casualty bought a few of them from stores, as i bought makenoise, intellijel, etc..I don't think this is a marketing strategy.

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Post by BTByrd » Tue May 07, 2019 5:25 am

Great thoughts. Good to hear from another maker to help get perspective... especially a builder like BugBrand! I also wish I could flood the world somehow with cheaper versions of your product, but I understand your drive to control assembly and do everything in-house. I've gotten to play with a BB system once, and only briefly... but I just loved the sound (as do my friends who are lucky enough to own them).

Not too make this too much about me, but since I already have... I'm an academic with a business background. But I'm also an experimental home cook and electronic musician in my spare time, and those are creative areas where I can exert almost total control. I am very bad about delegating responsibility. I like DIY -- perhaps too much. I am admittedly a control freak about my own work, again perhaps too much. But I certainly am not a micro-manager of other people's work. Part of why I don't like relinquishing control is that I don't like having power over other people and telling them what to do. It probably doesn't sound like it the way I've been talking, but badgering people around is not my idea of a good time. I'd much rather tell a S1MKII what to do than Wowa. I'm sure Wowa knows better what to do with himself than I do.

I don't have a billion dollars and I'm not a collector, but I do have a couple rare pieces around my own studio, including the Jomox Sunsyn. The Sunyn is an interesting synth with an interesting production history involving an interesting builder of "analog synths without compromise." Boy do I wish there were more Sunsyns in the world, and that you could get them repaired without shipping them back to the one person on planet earth who knows the blueprint. Would my unobtanium go down in value? Sure. But I'm not a speculator or collector, and I didn't pay those prices. (Thanks Niall!) I wouldn't invite you to either

There is a whiff of orchid fever about the Eurorack market. Cwejman's been in that game for a very long time, and they're still making great products. Good for them. I'm sure that part of what enabled their success was doing those limited production runs. Overproduction is certainly more of a problem for the producer than underproduction. God forbid Wowa put himself out of business by making too many synthesizers. I just think they're good enough and that the demand is high enough that he could probably crank out more of them, possibly at lower cost. But what do I know? :despair:

And thank you for your perspective notmiserlouagain. Not taken aback at all; I also like to make drastic points :miley: Again, I don't want to make this about me because mirror-fencing on Muff Wiggler ain't my jam. I'm doing too much of it already, and coming off as Little Consumer Boy isn't a good look. I'd rather spend time talking about the S1 and hearing what it can do than talking about the wait in line. If I don't like to wait in line...you'd better believe that talking about waiting in line is not a valued use of my own time. :deadbanana:

With that spirit in mind, I'd invite you all to go listen to that all S1 techno track that materialobject posted. It's good enough to pay for if you like techno and Cwejman. And I do. :-)

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Post by BTByrd » Tue May 07, 2019 6:25 am

OH so sorry to keep on about this, but...

Another thread asked what modules you'd want if money were no object. Obviously some Cwejman designs popped into my head, so I went looking around to see how much they were selling for. First of all, nobody has any. And those who do are selling them for a trillion dollars on Reverb. But the primary market is just as fucked as the secondary market.

I've tried to explain my exasperation with Cwejman, and it made me look like a bit of an asshole. That's kind of how things work in print on the Internet though. Advocational hazard. But I just want to quote directly from a store that tries to sell Cwejman modules sometimes.
MISCELLANEOUS
We currently do not accept pre-orders for Cwejman modules. For some products, there are waiting lists with pre-orders from the years 2013 to 2017, which are being processed as a matter of priority.
If you’d like to be informed as soon as this module is back in stock, please activate the availability notification via e-mail.
Please note: The number of Cwejman modules is always limited and much lower than the number of interested parties. Therefore, we recommend to order IMMEDIATELY and ONLINE if a Cwejman product becomes available. Enquiries via e-mail or telephone are usually not fast enough.
If the demand is higher than the supply, unfulfillable pre-orders will be deleted. In this case you’ll receive an e-mail. (Pre-orders on the waiting lists mentioned above are excluded from this policy.)


What the actual fuck? People are standing in line for Cwejman and getting their orders cancelled because they cannot be fulfilled. This is the situation I don't understand. This is what I lost my patience with in 2013 (and before). The thing is... I think I *do* understand it, and that's why I came across as an entitled lunatic asshole. Because it seems to me like a bunch of strategic hype mongering that's hurting both consumers and the producer. Sure, this strategy allows Cwejman to drop whatever it wants when it wants and sell it out immediately and never have to worry about inventory sitting around and not getting them paid. And that seems good for for them, but I don't know if it's a best practice. That's all I'm trying to say, in an admittedly provocative way.

The problem in this market isn't lack of demand for Cwejman. There's tons of demand for Cwejman! Just look at the prices in the secondary market! The circuits are so good, and that's why people want to buy. But they also want to buy because of demand that was manufactured by management. Good for them there too! However, Cwejman seems a bit too precious about their own product for everyone's good. It sure seems like they could sell more of everything to everyone and make more money and everyone'd be better off except the chumps on Reverb. Seems.

But what do I know? Nothing about building synths, that's for sure. So take my opines here with a big rock of salt. But after you take that salt, re-read the quote from Schneiders Laden and tell me that something weird isn't going on here. If you know the missing piece to that puzzle, please let us know. And if you've got some killer S1 jamz, please let us hear them. I'd frankly rather hear those than explanations of business practices.

peripatitis wrote: Future Retro are not mfb, the troglodyte comment was more of a joke to exaggerate perhaps the diffence that is though very evident between their semi,which i had for a couple of year, and the S1.
I was very excited to get that xs but quite soon it was clear to me, it wasn't flexible enough for what I expected a semi mono to be.
That second envelope design was not a good idea, the cv I/O was limited and the wide range of the oscilators was not that useful in the end (also the overdrive range was a bit limited), in the end i only enjoyed the filter.

Personally i found it ok for percussion work, but under no circumstances would i ever compare it with an s1 (which i don't have but have played with).

I don't always like having Cwejman modules, because whenever i get the urge to sell (as often in euro with every module) i know i probably won't get it back. I sold a couple of mine and know...
But i don't accuse Cwejman for that.
Cwejman prices were high from the beggining, when he could probably cover the needs.
I've casualty bought a few of them from stores, as i bought makenoise, intellijel, etc..I don't think this is a marketing strategy.
Good thoughts on the XS, and no worries about the troglodyte comment. You're right that the S1 is in another league above the XS, and I feel you on the second envelope design. The native envelopes are most useful for percussion and snappy bass sounds, which is 99% of what I use mine for. For everything else, there's the Voyager. I use both in conjunction with a 5U system, so I can patch in CV from the Modcan Quad Env or LFO or whatever and it takes care of the limitations I find most limiting. "Breaking out" of the system is important when you're dealing with semi-modulars. The S1 is great because it's really fully modular but behind one panel. It's one giant supermodule!

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Post by flo » Tue May 07, 2019 7:13 am

Schneiders used to take preorders on everything from Cwejman (but of course you only had to pay once it was actually available). For obvious reasons, that wasn't the most intelligent strategy and it only worked up to some point. I think that's where this new policy is coming from. Remember it's a Schneiders policy, not a Cwejman policy.

But you don't need to go through dealers anymore, just preorder from Maho / the Japan page. They list what's going to be produced next so you can plan ahead. It might be worth it to let Maho know if you're seriously (!) interested in something, even if it says "preorder is full" - some people don't follow through with their preorders, so you can get a chance instead. Then you "just" need to have the money ready when the time comes.

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Post by chiasticon » Tue May 07, 2019 8:39 am

BTByrd wrote:Sure, this strategy allows Cwejman to drop whatever it wants when it wants and sell it out immediately and never have to worry about inventory sitting around and not getting them paid. And that seems good for for them, but I don't know if it's a best practice.
and maybe that's all it comes down to...? :despair:

worth noting on prices: even though people ask ridiculous prices for them on Reverb and eBay, Cwejman doesn't try to gouge people. for example, I don't think the S1 price has changed much over time. I bought one in 2008 for $2900 and it was a deal at the time. pretty sure it was $3500 new then, and it's $3600 now. again, eleven years later. I had a bunch of modules as well, but I don't recall what I paid for them now, to be able to compare.

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Post by BTByrd » Tue May 07, 2019 10:33 am

Maybe that's all it comes down to. And good enough! Let Cwejman run Cwejman. I'm just saying that I don't appreciate this as a customer, which is why I'm not.

Anyway, the asking prices for new S1's is perfectly fair. I'm sure they could charge even more for them and sell even less of them if they wanted to.

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Post by materialobject » Wed May 08, 2019 12:44 am

speculate all you want as to the motives + business practices of Cwejman but the dude did fix my S1 mk II for free, after i broke the power supply..

those don't sound like the actions of someone motivated by greed...

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Post by BTByrd » Wed May 08, 2019 5:32 am

I have no problem with greed. I'm an egoist and a capitalist. Cwejman does right by the customers who are lucky enough to be able to buy their products. I don't have any problems with their quality or pricing. The prices are fair and the service is very good, from what I've gathered. And the circuits are some hot fire. I'm not accusing them of gouging. But I am accusing them of under-producing their product relative to demand for it. And that's fine! Let them do them.

But these practices have created a cult of scarcity and an absurd secondary market that makes the primary market even more impossible to navigate. I don't want to pay too much for Cwejman and I don't want to sit around on a waiting list whose wait may never even pay off. Which is why I choose not to even try. Let others chase unicorns.

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Post by Dave Peck » Wed May 08, 2019 4:07 pm

Why do you keep assuming that this is some kind of intentional 'strategy'? It is far more likely that the guy just doesn't usually have (or can't often get a loan for) the huge amount of money required for the deposit to pay to the CM when starting up a new production run. Or if he DOES have it, it's still likely that he can't afford to shell it out and wait eight or ten months (while all of his bills go to collections) before he starts getting that money back from the sale of completed product.

It could easily just be a cash flow issue. And it happens all the time in the electronics manufacturing industry and a ton of other industries as well.

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Post by BTByrd » Wed May 08, 2019 9:47 pm

Because nobody else in the industry seems to have chronic under-delivery problems while using contract SMT assembly? Again, I don't know the industry so I should shut up. I don't know if it's a conscious strategy. And maybe it's not, and I should definitely cut Cwejman some slack. I don't know why things are the way they are. But they're under producing relative to demand, and it's been that way the entire time I've been a wiggler, and it's been something that's puzzled me the entire time I've been a wiggler. I have wanted their products, but I have not wanted to seek them out. It's bothered me as a potential customer, because I want to give them my money but I don't want to have to work to give it to them. I have thought about this since before I joined, and I have perhaps too many thoughts on the subject. That's a lot of pent up goo, and apologies for shooting it in Cwejman's direction. All peace and love to Cwejman and their business. I love their products and the engineering mind who designed them. That's some fire right there. Just like that S1 acid techno jam I'm still bumping...

Who has more sounds?!

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Post by ranix » Thu May 09, 2019 1:32 am

BTByrd wrote:Because nobody else in the industry seems to have chronic under-delivery problems while using contract SMT assembly?
you said "nobody" but I think you meant "everybody"

making stuff that works is, like, hard

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Post by BTByrd » Thu May 09, 2019 10:28 am

ranix wrote:
BTByrd wrote:Because nobody else in the industry seems to have chronic under-delivery problems while using contract SMT assembly?
you said "nobody" but I think you meant "everybody"

making stuff that works is, like, hard
I meant "nobody." You thought I meant "everybody," but I didn't. Perhaps I'm overlooking a bunch of other manufacturers (I've been inactive in my purchasing for a while) but I've never been asked to wait in line for years for SMT-assembled products from anyone else in Eurorackland. And I've bought from pretty much everyone else in Eurorackland (or had at one point). The only waiting lists I've ever been on were for literal Kickstarters or for thru-hole products assembled entirely by hand. I don't want to single anyone out as being especially awesome, but just looking around my medium-sized Eurorack system... there are 17 other companies in there apart from Cwejman, and literally none of them have had production issues on a similar scale. I haven't seen any stores putting up signs for their brands talking about years-long wait lists and cancelled orders. I was able to buy all these modules easily, without fuss, "off the rack." These companies didn't make me work to be their customer, even though they had excellent products that I would probably have tolerated a moderate wait time for.

Anyway, I said what I meant.

But let's hear some more S1 sounds! I think I'm going to get to play with a MKI along side a MKII soon, and I'm really excited about it. Heretofore, my only options have been to either have a friend with access to Cwejman, or to pay scalper prices, or to wait half a decade for the drop.

It's good to have friends. Share your S1 sounds, friends!

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Post by thermisonic » Mon May 13, 2019 4:30 am

I think the main point here is he checks and calibrates every module (maybe with Maho too?). Did anybody ever complain that the received a Cwejman anything with a defect? They have a deserved reputation for quality. That is where his time is taken, along with creating new designs, and ramping up production would need passing that to other people. And I don’t think that’s what he wants to do. The market economics are a by product of that, not the other way around.

Just my reading of it....

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Post by flo » Mon May 13, 2019 9:26 am

thermisonic wrote:I think the main point here is he checks and calibrates every module (maybe with Maho too?).


Yes. That's why I was asking whether the robots should do the quality control, too.
thermisonic wrote:Did anybody ever complain that the received a Cwejman anything with a defect?
Yes. It seems to happen more frequently now with the larger batches, which is why I was implying that the small ones probably weren't a bad idea.
thermisonic wrote:They have a deserved reputation for quality.
Sure, but making mistakes is only human, and the larger the batches, the higher the probability.

Cheers :guinness:

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Post by BTByrd » Mon May 13, 2019 12:38 pm

If that's what it takes to keep quality high, more power to Wowa and all apologies for my big mouth. I'm a friend of quality at the end of the day, and I thought he might be able to scale up batch size without sacrificing it. But if that's not the case... keep those batches small and the product great! Because it's a great product. :banana: :cwejman: :banana: Did I mention that all of the audio coming out of my Eurorack passes through AI-2s? They're real nice. :nana: I wish I could buy more of them.

It's very difficult as a creative person with high standards to delegate effectively... in part because finding people who share your standards is almost impossible. These problems are magnified by a factor of a million or so when you're trying to get anything manufactured at scale. Manufacturing is a tough business. I am more familiar with the food world, and I understand why some of the best chefs in the world only have one restaurant where they work 120 hour weeks. It's the only they can maintain their own standards and deliver the product they want to deliver. Hand checking each unit yourself (or with one other person you trust very much) sounds like the sort of thing I might try to do, just because I'm a neurotic perfectionist who would want to deliver the highest quality product.

All my sympathies and much love to Cwejman. Apologies again for my ramblings if small batch sizes are the cost of delivering something that works well. I just feel like there's got to be a better way!

I'm still waiting on some more hot S1 jams. That acid is fire tho. :sb:

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Post by gentle_attack » Mon May 13, 2019 9:57 pm

flo wrote:Sure, but making mistakes is only human, and the larger the batches, the higher the probability.
So you're saying if he makes 10, maybe 1 is flawed
But if he makes 100 then 15 or 20, or more, are flawed? :hmm:

I'm not sure that's how this works. The AMOUNT of people complaining online might go up, since if there's only one guy with an issue, you might not hear about, but if there's 10 people out of 100, or 100 people out of 1000, then the count of issues has gone up and you're more likely to hear/see something about it.

But probability is not the correct term for that.
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Post by monads » Mon May 13, 2019 11:55 pm

I've been quietly watching this thread till now. Some of the flaws weren't related to manufacturing issues but actual design flaws that users caught/presented later...and subsequently resolved by Mr. Cwejman. I'm good with smaller batches. If you're an earlier adopter then be prepared for revisions thereof. That's the way tech goes.

Mr. Cwejman actually does an excellent job managing/supporting all his product line given the lead time. Yes I understand the small batches issues and pain for waiting. But other manufactures follow the same lead....i.e. Sequentix Cirklon? Yup. If you're gonna call out Cwejman why not call out other manufactures as well?? This thread is not being fair to Mr. Cwejman. Start another thread and call out similar manufactures (eurorack, hardware, etc.) for not satisfying user demand. I only threw out Sequentix because they offer euro rack compatible modules that become unavailable sometimes/don't align with their core product the Cirklon availability. And a new Cirklon is a 2+yr wait???? :bang:

Anyhow, this is a niche market. So we have to understand and appreciate that :bananaguitar:

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Post by gentle_attack » Tue May 14, 2019 8:21 am

monads wrote:I've been quietly watching this thread till now. Some of the flaws weren't related to manufacturing issues but actual design flaws that users caught/presented later...and subsequently resolved by Mr. Cwejman. I'm good with smaller batches. If you're an earlier adopter then be prepared for revisions thereof. That's the way tech goes.

Mr. Cwejman actually does an excellent job managing/supporting all his product line given the lead time. Yes I understand the small batches issues and pain for waiting. But other manufactures follow the same lead....i.e. Sequentix Cirklon? Yup. If you're gonna call out Cwejman why not call out other manufactures as well?? This thread is not being fair to Mr. Cwejman. Start another thread and call out similar manufactures (eurorack, hardware, etc.) for not satisfying user demand. I only threw out Sequentix because they offer euro rack compatible modules that become unavailable sometimes/don't align with their core product the Cirklon availability. And a new Cirklon is a 2+yr wait???? :bang:

Anyhow, this is a niche market. So we have to understand and appreciate that :bananaguitar:
SEQUENTIX has a preorder list, and let's you know when you might get the kit?

He also makes like 1 product and a couple add-ons, so it doesn't seem as willy nilly as Cwejman (and I mean that just as in if you want a QMMF you have no clue when it might even be made next, much less the time to start mashing F5).
Control Skiff ||Big Case || cv.ocd || TT303v2 || Manther || OP-1 OP-Lab|| Octatrack Digitone RYTM || BX-8 BX-16 || Monologue KP3+

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flo
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Post by flo » Tue May 14, 2019 8:54 am

gentle_attack wrote:
flo wrote:Sure, but making mistakes is only human, and the larger the batches, the higher the probability.
So you're saying if he makes 10, maybe 1 is flawed
But if he makes 100 then 15 or 20, or more, are flawed? :hmm:

I'm not sure that's how this works. The AMOUNT of people complaining online might go up, since if there's only one guy with an issue, you might not hear about, but if there's 10 people out of 100, or 100 people out of 1000, then the count of issues has gone up and you're more likely to hear/see something about it.

But probability is not the correct term for that.
I'm very careful with my wording and I meant probability :hihi:

Yes, the effect that you are more likely to hear about it can be crucial, too. But you are assuming in your example that there is unlimited time. Don't you think that quality control has to be done faster (per module) when larger batches are suddenly introduced? Having to rush the process increases the probability of unnoticed issues.

Edit: typo.
Last edited by flo on Tue May 14, 2019 9:02 am, edited 2 times in total.

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Post by flo » Tue May 14, 2019 9:01 am

monads wrote:Some of the flaws weren't related to manufacturing issues but actual design flaws that users caught/presented later...and subsequently resolved by Mr. Cwejman.
Yeah, some of them. That also predates the large batches, e.g., the infamous MMF6 symmetry CV bug. There have been a few manufacturing issues, though. Multiple people complained that the distortion section on their MMF1s does nothing, for example. I have one like that, too - brand new out of the box. And yes, I should send it off to repair soon (it's not acutally in my rack for a long time yet). I also have a QMMF4 where the gain CV is clearly calibrated much hotter on one band than on the other three, it's much easier to get it to distort (which I kinda like, as you can exploit the gainstaging more radically with that band). Some people were having issues with their new PH8. And so on...

Just to be clear, I don't want to diss Wowa, not at all, I love his stuff and Cwejman is by far the most prominent manufacturer in my rack! However, the examples show that proper quality control is very important for his modules.

Cheers :guinness:

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jbdiver
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Post by jbdiver » Thu May 16, 2019 11:57 am

What people often forget about are the Cwejman stuff that never sold well in the market but which were still built to extraordinarily high standards: S2 mono synth, subrack, Zaehl module, DP-2, etc. Any one of these would elevate the status of the designer into elite territory. The guy probably spent a year of his life making some of these things, and when sales weren't successful he just moved on to new things. IMO, the total sum of his career in terms of output is truly epic.

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BTByrd
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Post by BTByrd » Mon May 20, 2019 10:52 am

I've been a fan of Electrypnose since I came across "Funked Up" back in 2007. I believe he even had an S1 way back in those days. Anyway, here's a video from a couple years ago rocking the S1 on a scope in a musical context. Every time I hear this machine, it makes me want one.

[video][/video]

Video only has 80 views and is over 2 years old. I suppose the market for Cwejman-related awesomeness might be smaller than I'd originally guessed.

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