Pin 1 = Ground 1, Black
Pin 2 = -12V, White
Pin 3 = Ground 2, Green
Pin 4 = +12V, Red
Is there any difference between Ground 1 (pin 1) and Ground 2 (pin 3) on the original serge power plug, like on the buchla for instance with quiet and noisy ground?
Can I only plug Pin 1/Pin 2/Pin 4 on a simple DIY module where I have only 3 points for power (GND/-12v/+12v)?
Serge ground(s) question
Moderators: Kent, lisa, luketeaford, Joe.
Serge ground(s) question
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FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
Re: Serge ground(s) question
Definitely. Black is the main system ground. In older Serge systems, green was used for +6V, but since the mid-late 70s it has been either chassis or dirty/digital ground. I have a small Serge system where the PSU also powers some Euro modules, as well as DIY 4U and 3U, and it all works fine.batchas wrote:Can I only plug Pin 1/Pin 2/Pin 4 on a simple DIY module where I have only 3 points for power (GND/-12v/+12v)?
Re: Serge ground(s) question
daverj wrote:Based purely on the colors I would guess the green ground is a chassis (case) ground and the black ground is a signal ground.
Good. Thank you!CJ Miller wrote:Definitely. Black is the main system ground. In older Serge systems, green was used for +6V, but since the mid-late 70s it has been either chassis or dirty/digital ground. I have a small Serge system where the PSU also powers some Euro modules, as well as DIY 4U and 3U, and it all works fine.
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FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
I already see Graham pulling out his hairs here if he reads all this.
When I look at all the third-party or DIY modules on my Buchla (now I jump to the Buchla), none is connected to the dirty/noisy/earth ground.
Does it mean that they are not earth-grounded (I mean the metallic front panel)?
Or they indeed are, by using the signal ground (0v) instead, via sockets which are supposed to hold them to the panel?
You know what I mean?
On the board sometimes the corners have holes to maintain the sockets and these holes are not isolated but surrounded by the GND/0v signal path, so if the sockets are metallic and screwed (not glued) to the panel, the panel is then earth-grounded <<< this is the question.
I saw projects where the pcb if not even in contact with the panel for instance, but if my deduction with the signal/0v as earth-ground is right, the same way, the panel would be earth-grounded via pots or audio plugs as these are also signal-grounded anyway (if any pot or audio signal coming in).
I am asking because I have to take this in consideration if I want to turn/modify pedals to modules or even make my own modules (if my panels are not earth-grounded to the pcb, I guess as they are mounted in the metallic boat with other modules, then they are earth-grounded - of course if the boat is grounded via modules like I described before. Which does not mean I shouldn't earth-ground them anyway!).
A lot of "if", "but" and "then"... I hope you understand my concern.
And I don't even talk about the external DIY project of mine which is not even in a boat with other modules... but in its own plastic box where all front parts are on a metallic front panel. I asked all this here because I want to earth-ground this front panel too, depending on your answers/suggestions here.
For now, I mounted a banana plug in the back where I wanted to connect with the other systems (buchla and serge psu ground, earth-ground then, go to format jumbler. I wanted to connect to the same point where these ground signals go). And I thought this panel box would then be earth-grounded as the audio plugs (sleeves) are connected to this banana in the back.
It shows that I am mixing again signal ground and earth-ground.... but when I look at the format jumbler it is also doing so (like all the modules I mentionned before where the earth-ground is not connected to them, but only the signal/0v is).
The format jumbler. ground banana connection (where buchla and serge earth-ground are connected to) is also only an internal connection to all 3.5" plugs screwed on the format jumbler panel: so when an eurorack cable is plugged into any 3.5" plug on the format jumbler, the eurorack is also (earth-?)grounded to the buchla/serge.
When I look at all the third-party or DIY modules on my Buchla (now I jump to the Buchla), none is connected to the dirty/noisy/earth ground.
Does it mean that they are not earth-grounded (I mean the metallic front panel)?
Or they indeed are, by using the signal ground (0v) instead, via sockets which are supposed to hold them to the panel?
You know what I mean?
On the board sometimes the corners have holes to maintain the sockets and these holes are not isolated but surrounded by the GND/0v signal path, so if the sockets are metallic and screwed (not glued) to the panel, the panel is then earth-grounded <<< this is the question.
I saw projects where the pcb if not even in contact with the panel for instance, but if my deduction with the signal/0v as earth-ground is right, the same way, the panel would be earth-grounded via pots or audio plugs as these are also signal-grounded anyway (if any pot or audio signal coming in).
I am asking because I have to take this in consideration if I want to turn/modify pedals to modules or even make my own modules (if my panels are not earth-grounded to the pcb, I guess as they are mounted in the metallic boat with other modules, then they are earth-grounded - of course if the boat is grounded via modules like I described before. Which does not mean I shouldn't earth-ground them anyway!).
A lot of "if", "but" and "then"... I hope you understand my concern.
And I don't even talk about the external DIY project of mine which is not even in a boat with other modules... but in its own plastic box where all front parts are on a metallic front panel. I asked all this here because I want to earth-ground this front panel too, depending on your answers/suggestions here.
For now, I mounted a banana plug in the back where I wanted to connect with the other systems (buchla and serge psu ground, earth-ground then, go to format jumbler. I wanted to connect to the same point where these ground signals go). And I thought this panel box would then be earth-grounded as the audio plugs (sleeves) are connected to this banana in the back.
It shows that I am mixing again signal ground and earth-ground.... but when I look at the format jumbler it is also doing so (like all the modules I mentionned before where the earth-ground is not connected to them, but only the signal/0v is).
The format jumbler. ground banana connection (where buchla and serge earth-ground are connected to) is also only an internal connection to all 3.5" plugs screwed on the format jumbler panel: so when an eurorack cable is plugged into any 3.5" plug on the format jumbler, the eurorack is also (earth-?)grounded to the buchla/serge.
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FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
FS: KESAKO Player & Reverb for Serge and Buchla
Re: Serge ground(s) question
I purchased my Serge modules in the early '80s. They came with a large square 4 pin power connector but only 3 pins were used. Red (+12) White (-12) and Black (Ground).CJ Miller wrote:Definitely. Black is the main system ground. In older Serge systems, green was used for +6V, but since the mid-late 70s it has been either chassis or dirty/digital ground. I have a small Serge system where the PSU also powers some Euro modules, as well as DIY 4U and 3U, and it all works fine.batchas wrote:Can I only plug Pin 1/Pin 2/Pin 4 on a simple DIY module where I have only 3 points for power (GND/-12v/+12v)?
The instructions that came with the kit told you to tie a ground wire to the front panel with the mounting standoffs in one of the 4 corners.Does it mean that they are not earth-grounded (I mean the metallic front panel)?