[INTEREST CHECK/POLL] VC Clock/audio divider

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I'm interested in...

a PCB with controllers
11
15%
a PCB with a panel
17
24%
a full kit
22
31%
a full kit
22
31%
 
Total votes: 72

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rpocc
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[INTEREST CHECK/POLL] VC Clock/audio divider

Post by rpocc » Sun Aug 17, 2014 3:11 pm

Hi to all.
I have developed a simple, but reliable and affordable hybrid VC clock divider based on cheap MCU, opamp and a comparator.
Possible uses: division of clock signals (especially 24ppqn), Hi-hat rhythm control, APC-alike sounds, unusual sub-oscillator, bit-crushing distortion.

KIT AVAILABLE!

Image Image

Prototype:
Image

>>>Demonstration of breadboarded prototype<<<

The circuit is tested with various wave sources, PCB and panel designs are made, now I'm thinking about making a DIY kits or assembled modules from it. Before I start the production and so on, I would like to understand how demanded this module can be to anybody besides me.
The unit should be affordable like simple Synthrotek modules.

There is a mistake in the poll. Of course, second option means PCB+MCU+panel and there is no 4th option: assembled unit. You can comment here in case of such interest.

By the way, I have successfully prototyped a module that uses MCU only for control and CMOS chips for real signal processing. It was way more complex and had no real advantages over single-MCU solution.

Specs:
Module width: 4hp
Module Depth: 59mm
Net weight: 70g
Module dimensions: 129x20x80mm
+12 power: 15–26 mA
-12 power: 1.5 mA

* Dual voltage controlled clock divider.
* Works from 12v and 15v
* Can work in audio range (Jitter becomes audible at ~5 kHz)
* Visual feedback (LED)
* Output pulse length is equal to length of the input clock pulses.
* Protection from under/overvoltage
* Reconfigurable with jumpers or extension module (coming soon)

2 modes, each have 10/16 Available division factors:
1: /1, /2, /3, /4, /6, /8, /12, /16, /24, /48, (6 extra to be discussed)
2: /1.../16
10 first factors are available with knob and 6 extra factors are available with external CV.

Input signal: any square wave crossing +1v point.
Output: Pulses 0...+5v
Max timing jitter: 20 us
Input CV: 0...+6.4v

Each of two parts contain:
-----------
Jacks:
CV In
Clock In
Clock Out

Pots:
Division

LEDs:
Divided clock
----------

Total parts:
1 PCB, 2 MCU, 3 analog ICs, 1 voltage regulator, about 30—40 passive components, 2 pots, 6 jacks.

What do you think about it? The complexifications (like reset input, additional work modes) are possible, but they will of course rise the price and make the module wider.

Anyone interested in PCB/kit/module?
Last edited by rpocc on Mon Oct 20, 2014 7:18 am, edited 10 times in total.
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euromorcego
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Post by euromorcego » Sun Aug 17, 2014 4:59 pm

sounds great! I would certainly be interested, in particular if it stays affordable like the Synthrotek kits. Either pcb or kit. Best for me is a parts kit, where some crucial components (MCU) are included but common parts (resistors, capacitors and such) must be supplied (also saves the hassle from counting and bagging all those common parts).

What is the CV in good for? There is a clock in, division pot, and then the CV in? The input will probably be normalled, so one can have two clock divisions from one clock?

I hope the pcb will not be too large, mcu, 3 analog ICs, 40 passive components sounds a lot for 4hp. Most cases these days are not very deep anymore. Will it fit in a 6cm deep case?

Maybe you can also consider an XL version with a bit wider panel. I'd love to have two clock input with adjustable division (just like you have) and then some additional logic outs (AND, OR, XOR, ...). Then the module can provide some interesting patterns on its own.

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falafelbiels
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Post by falafelbiels » Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:27 pm

Yeah I would love to have this. 4hp please?

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cretaceousear
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Post by cretaceousear » Sun Aug 17, 2014 5:32 pm

Verra interessing effect ..
I could be interested in a PCB but I was planning on getting Michael Barton's. http://www.bartonmusicalcircuits.com/vcclock/
His can be built a few ways, but I guess yours is simpler in not using a PIC.
Any other important differences ?
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terrafractyl
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Post by terrafractyl » Sun Aug 17, 2014 6:33 pm

yep I'm also in the market for a VC clock divider.
I will now also be tossing up between this one and the Barton.

but yeah Maybe 2 channels will be enough for me.
Thanks!

:)
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Stides
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Post by Stides » Sun Aug 17, 2014 7:09 pm

This seems great to me! :bacon:

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rpocc
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Post by rpocc » Mon Aug 18, 2014 1:13 am

euromorcego wrote:sounds great! I would certainly be interested, in particular if it stays affordable like the Synthrotek kits. Either pcb or kit. Best for me is a parts kit, where some crucial components (MCU) are included but common parts (resistors, capacitors and such) must be supplied (also saves the hassle from counting and bagging all those common parts).
Of course, in case of kit I will include a programmed chip.
euromorcego wrote:What is the CV in good for? There is a clock in, division pot, and then the CV in? The input will probably be normalled, so one can have two clock divisions from one clock?
In current design I plan to use switching jack socket, so either pot or CV in will be used to control the divisions.

Scenario for pot: You have some source of clocks (MIDI-CV converter with MIDI clock output, DIN SYNC module, etc) and you just need one or two particular divisions like quarter and 16th notes for your sequencer. So, you set corresponding divisions with pot and you're happy.

Scenario for CV in: You want to animate some percussion instrument with a sequencer (like in my crappy video), so you insert the jack into CV in, get a fast clock source (Master clock, LFO, etc) and go tweaking.

Scenario for both: sub-osc with fixed or controllable transpose.
euromorcego wrote:I hope the pcb will not be too large, mcu, 3 analog ICs, 40 passive components sounds a lot for 4hp. Most cases these days are not very deep anymore. Will it fit in a 6cm deep case?
Yes, current PCB design involves a Doepfer-style perpendicular single PCB having dimensions about 10x5 cm.
euromorcego wrote:Maybe you can also consider an XL version with a bit wider panel. I'd love to have two clock input with adjustable division (just like you have) and then some additional logic outs (AND, OR, XOR, ...). Then the module can provide some interesting patterns on its own.
Thanks for the advise. I will think about it. Right now I'm after narrowing.
cretaceousear wrote:Verra interessing effect ..
I could be interested in a PCB but I was planning on getting Michael Barton's. http://www.bartonmusicalcircuits.com/vcclock/
His can be built a few ways, but I guess yours is simpler in not using a PIC.
Any other important differences ?
My will use DIP8 AVR.
The main difference is that my circuit is compact utility module when Barton's is more like master clock source, that is wide and complex. Lot of pots, lot of jacks, lot of functions.
What I tried to develop is some kind of 4ms RCD with manual control.
Also my circuit have two completely independable dividers with 2 separate MCUs like 4ms PEG. By he way, switched jacks may be used to clock both circuits with the same wire.
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Post by Karl_Joseph » Mon Aug 18, 2014 10:30 am

I take a pcb with panel and chip please!
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rpocc
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Post by rpocc » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:22 am

I have to wait till I get new right-angle 4ms-type jacks from Thonk since initially I planned to use Doepfer-type, but they are very expensive.

Meanwhile there is a problem with clock reset. If you turn a rate knob manually, you may get divided clocks, that are not syncronized with bars (imagine 16th triplets, that are shifted to one straight 16th).
So, this is not a problem, when you use a sequencer switching rate at exact moments of time or if you have a reset input.

Unfortunately there is no way to place 3 PCB-mounted sockets and a pot on the half-space of the 4hp module with through-hole components. So, there are three options:

1. Leave design as it is (each half: 1 pot, in, out, CV)
2. Assume manual wiring to place four jacks (in, out, CV, reset). There will be hole on the PCB.
3. Make a 6hp-wide module with two jacks (per half) pcb-mounted and two jacks manually wired. Elby-design-style mini-PCBs for additional jacks are not practical iwith such simple module.

What do you think?

As I see, the interest is extremely low, so it is unlikely that I will sell out even 10pcs batch (even if I leave pair for myself), so don't blame me if I drop this project and turn to something more unique.
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Post by paulstone » Fri Aug 29, 2014 3:38 am

:tu: Interest if work also for 15v

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cretaceousear
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Post by cretaceousear » Fri Aug 29, 2014 4:25 am

I bet once you start to sell it, and if you make other modules or PCBs, interest will pick up and you will sell more over time.
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Post by sammy123 » Fri Aug 29, 2014 9:26 am

I'd be interested in a pcb/panel/chip set.

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Post by LektroiD » Fri Aug 29, 2014 8:16 pm

Great stuff, count me in for a PCB, Panel and chip set if this goes ahead :)

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Post by euromorcego » Sat Aug 30, 2014 4:39 am

1. Leave design as it is (each half: 1 pot, in, out, CV)
2. Assume manual wiring to place four jacks (in, out, CV, reset). There will be hole on the PCB.
i think either is ok. I am fine with wiring jacks (as long as it is only jacks, like in the frequency central and manhattan pcb/panels). But the original design is also fine.

I forgot: are the two staged normalized so that one can either have two divisions from the same input, or maybe even better: another division of the first division (maybe both, selectable via jumper on the back).

If you are unsure about interest, you could use a better title in the thread. It now seems a bit hidden and unspecific. Something like '[INTEREST CHECK/POLL] PCB/PANEL for VC clock/audio divider' would be more easy to spot. And maybe a picture or even demo (even if preliminary, or mock-ups of the panel, the video linked above is a bit difficult to understand, what you see is Orbitals).
And i agree with cretaceousear, once you have the pcb available and there are some figures and successful builds, more people will be interested (of course, you won't sell hundreds, but more than ten should be do-able, depending on price).

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rpocc
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Post by rpocc » Sat Aug 30, 2014 8:45 am

euromorcego wrote:
I forgot: are the two staged normalized so that one can either have two divisions from the same input, or maybe even better: another division of the first division (maybe both, selectable via jumper on the back).
Input 2 will be normalized to input 1. The jumper is interesting idea, I will think about it.
euromorcego wrote:If you are unsure about interest, you could use a better title in the thread. It now seems a bit hidden and unspecific. Something like '[INTEREST CHECK/POLL] PCB/PANEL for VC clock/audio divider' would be more easy to spot. And maybe a picture or even demo (even if preliminary, or mock-ups of the panel, the video linked above is a bit difficult to understand, what you see is Orbitals).
And i agree with cretaceousear, once you have the pcb available and there are some figures and successful builds, more people will be interested (of course, you won't sell hundreds, but more than ten should be do-able, depending on price).
Thanks you for your advises. You're right, I have provided too few information. The video is a quickshot. I'll post better video soon.

Meanwhile this is mock-ups of the module with aluminum and PCB panel. I don't know yet, which method will be cheaper.

By the way, module will work both from 12 and 15v.
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ABC
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Post by ABC » Sun Aug 31, 2014 1:53 am

a rough estimation of cost would be useful, but I've been looking for a simple vc clock divider for a while, so am definitely interested.
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Post by regenbot » Sun Aug 31, 2014 2:11 am

I'm interested :tu:

I think you should make a aluminium panel even though it will be more expensive.

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Post by jonesboy » Sun Aug 31, 2014 12:07 pm

I would be interested in a PCB / chip / panel.

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Post by Reality Checkpoint » Sun Aug 31, 2014 1:35 pm

jonesboy wrote:I would be interested in a PCB / chip / panel.
Me too!

Happy with either aluminium or PCB material panel.

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Post by Raytracer » Sun Aug 31, 2014 7:49 pm

I could be interested.

Does your design use Musical or Mathematical dividing?

Does the reset input trigger instantly or on the next clock input?
1. Leave design as it is (each half: 1 pot, in, out, CV)
2. Assume manual wiring to place four jacks (in, out, CV, reset). There will be hole on the PCB.
I would prefer option 2. I didn't find it difficult to wire the jacks on the Frequency Central ADSR.

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Post by rpocc » Sun Aug 31, 2014 11:27 pm

Raytracer wrote:I could be interested.

Does your design use Musical or Mathematical dividing?

Does the reset input trigger instantly or on the next clock input?
1. Leave design as it is (each half: 1 pot, in, out, CV)
2. Assume manual wiring to place four jacks (in, out, CV, reset). There will be hole on the PCB.
I would prefer option 2. I didn't find it difficult to wire the jacks on the Frequency Central ADSR.
Of course it is musical in terms that output is in phase with beats, so all divisions will correlate on 1st beat
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Post by sonicwarrior » Mon Sep 01, 2014 1:53 am

Does the PCB have mounting holes for non Eurorack formats? I could use one of these in my 5U system.
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Post by yan6 » Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:41 am

I would like one PCB/Panel/MCU, if the price is right possibly two :hyper:

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Post by zoot horn rollo » Mon Sep 01, 2014 6:54 am

Im in for a couple if reset is a feature

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VC divider

Post by acilator » Mon Sep 01, 2014 7:49 am

I'm in for PCB/panel/MCU

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