DIY - Elektor Vocoder - General Build Thread

From circuitbending to homebrew stompboxes & synths, keep the DIY spirit alive!

Moderators: Joe., lisa, luketeaford, Kent

Post Reply
User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sat Jan 19, 2019 11:35 pm

jbdiver wrote:
elmegil wrote:I have mouser BOMs for each board, but I know for a fact because I had to dig through my parts stock that they are not entirely accurate. Plus they omit things that aren't available at Mouser, like the transformer, the solder pins, etc.
Thanks elmegil, these Mouser projects were a huge help. I can't imagine how long it took you to create these. :hail:

I spent a couple hours and verified all of the components in the linked projects against the current BOM. The differences are listed below. I could see how it's possible to update the quantities in these shared projects, but I couldn't figure out how to add new components.

A couple things to note: I didn't add any of the solder pins to my project BOMs because I couldn't tell if the pins listed were compatible with the project BOM. I added IC sockets to my change list below. These are kind of expensive from Mouser so remove if you already have a pile or plan to buy them cheaper somewhere else. Finally, I'm using different phono jacks because I bought tons of these in bulk for previous projects.
Thank YOU!

I will go make these updates shortly. I get my sockets from Tayda, they're much cheaper and as far as I can tell, the same machined pin sockets I'd want anywhere.


EDIT: Updates are now in place.

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:27 am

jbdiver wrote:PSU

add Mouser 651-1715721 qty=1

IO

add Mouser 575-199308 qty=6

Bandpass

update 10k resistor -- change qty from 24 to 32
add Mouser 575-199308 qty=16
add Mouser 575-1104731441001000 qty=16

Lowpass

update 10k resistor - change qty from 1 to 2
update trimmer resistor (253) 652-3386F-1-253LF change qty from 12 to 1
add Mouser 575-199308 qty=2
Mouser 575-1104731441001000 qty=2

Highpass

update 10k resistor - change qty from 1 to 2
update 68nF cap - change qty from 4 to 1

Switching

add Mouser 575-199308 qty=2
add Mouser 575-1104731441001000 qty=6
add Mouser 575-11044316 qty=1

Noise

update 470R resistor - change qty from 2 to 1
add Mouser 575-199308 qty=1
add Mouser 575-1104731441001000 qty=2
add Mouser 575-11044316 qty=4

Front Panel

Replace red LEDS with part# 696-SSI-LXH312ID
add TE contacts strip qty 100 Mouser 571-170361-1-CT

Replace listed pots with:
add Mouser 858-P160KNPC15A25K qty=1
add Mouser 858-P160KNP0QC20A10K qty=3
add Mouser 858-P160KNP0C20A100K qty=1
add Mouser 858-P160KNP0QC20B10K qty=10
Thanks for this great job !

Only for the suggested LED replacement I'm not sure they will fit in the frontpanel.
According to the datasheet these LEDs are 4.4 mm, on the other hand the cutout in the frontpanel is 4.1 mm.

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:44 am

Fitchie wrote:
elmegil wrote:Any idea for when the I/O module and noise module adjustment procedures will be up?
  • I'll finish those sections later today and will post a message when ready.
The input/output module adjustment instructions are ready. Only the noise generator checklist has yet to be written, that is planned for tonight.

Wolfo!
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:29 am
Location: Belgium

Post by Wolfo! » Sun Jan 20, 2019 11:54 am

Hello guys,

Following the instructions for the input/output module calibration I encountered a problem I can't figure out.
Only power and io module are inserted.
I don't get a wave on pin B of the backplane.
When I insert the sine (500Hz 800mV from a bitscope micro) on the voice input however, I get the sine exactly as described in the instructions on pin A, I can control it with the pot from zero to about 17vpp).
I've changed the opamps in the circuits without results. Triple checked the components and their placement, without results.
Also checked the front wiring, all seems to be ok. Detached the front panel and inserted the sine directly on p14 pin of the io module without result.

Any suggestions on troubleshooting?

User avatar
jbdiver
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 287
Joined: Tue Aug 31, 2010 11:39 pm
Location: Minneapolis, USA

Post by jbdiver » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:44 pm

Fitchie wrote:
jbdiver wrote:PSU

Front Panel

Replace red LEDS with part# 696-SSI-LXH312ID
Thanks for this great job !

Only for the suggested LED replacement I'm not sure they will fit in the frontpanel.
According to the datasheet these LEDs are 4.4 mm, on the other hand the cutout in the frontpanel is 4.1 mm.
The product description for the LEDs in the BOM (SSI-LXH312ID-150) suggest a mounting hole diameter of 4.3-4.4mm, and the Mouser replacement basically has the same specs. Nearly all of the physical characteristics are the same. What am I missing?

https://uk.farnell.com/lumex/ssi-lxh312 ... m%2Fsearch

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:45 pm

There are carrier & voice jumpers on the back of the backplane (I missed these first time through), is it possible voice needs to be jumpered until we're ready for the sibilance expansion?

Edit: I got this backwards. Is the carrier jumper installed? See the back of the backplane.
Last edited by elmegil on Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:48 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sun Jan 20, 2019 12:46 pm

jbdiver wrote:
Fitchie wrote:
jbdiver wrote:PSU

Front Panel

Replace red LEDS with part# 696-SSI-LXH312ID
Thanks for this great job !

Only for the suggested LED replacement I'm not sure they will fit in the frontpanel.
According to the datasheet these LEDs are 4.4 mm, on the other hand the cutout in the frontpanel is 4.1 mm.
The product description for the LEDs in the BOM (SSI-LXH312ID-150) suggest a mounting hole diameter of 4.3-4.4mm, and the Mouser replacement basically has the same specs. Nearly all of the physical characteristics are the same. What am I missing?

https://uk.farnell.com/lumex/ssi-lxh312 ... m%2Fsearch

I did note that when I put the other specified LEDs in, they kind of "peeled" the 4 ribs out and I had to go back and physically remove them on the front panel otherwise it would look like I had a bunch of LEDs with arms & legs :)

Wolfo!
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:29 am
Location: Belgium

Post by Wolfo! » Sun Jan 20, 2019 2:03 pm

elmegil wrote:There are carrier & voice jumpers on the back of the backplane (I missed these first time through), is it possible voice needs to be jumpered until we're ready for the sibilance expansion?

Edit: I got this backwards. Is the carrier jumper installed? See the back of the backplane.
Carrier jumper is installed.

User avatar
jersupereq
Common Wiggler
Posts: 223
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:24 pm
Location: SF

Post by jersupereq » Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:24 pm


Thank YOU!

I will go make these updates shortly. I get my sockets from Tayda, they're much cheaper and as far as I can tell, the same machined pin sockets I'd want anywhere.


EDIT: Updates are now in place.
Great work on the Mouser carts! I noticed some of the resistors have two different types throughout the order (470R for example), some more expensive than the other. Was this done on purpose, I didn't see any requirements in the docs, or could the be combined to save?

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:41 pm

Wolfo! wrote:Following the instructions for the input/output module calibration I encountered a problem I can't figure out.
Only power and io module are inserted. I don't get a wave on pin B of the backplane.
Any suggestions on troubleshooting?
  • That's strange.
    Please look at the below listed schematics, maybe you can try to follow the signal (A33 pin 3/6 > A34 pin 3/6):

    Image

    Temporary bridge G-H and I-J on the backplane !

    Image

    Please check also the vocoder website, the instructions have been modified:
    http://vocoder.eu/io-module-adjustment.html
Last edited by Fitchie on Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:37 pm, edited 3 times in total.

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Sun Jan 20, 2019 3:48 pm

jbdiver wrote:The product description for the LEDs in the BOM (SSI-LXH312ID-150) suggest a mounting hole diameter of 4.3-4.4mm, and the Mouser replacement basically has the same specs. Nearly all of the physical characteristics are the same. What am I missing?

https://uk.farnell.com/lumex/ssi-lxh312 ... m%2Fsearch
  • Here are the Lumex specs:

    Image

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Sun Jan 20, 2019 4:43 pm

As promised the noise generator checklist has been completed as well !

Have a look here:
http://vocoder.eu/noise-generator-test.html

Image

Special thanks to Boogie for the nice scope dumps !!!
:spin:

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:21 pm

jersupereq wrote:

Thank YOU!

I will go make these updates shortly. I get my sockets from Tayda, they're much cheaper and as far as I can tell, the same machined pin sockets I'd want anywhere.


EDIT: Updates are now in place.
Great work on the Mouser carts! I noticed some of the resistors have two different types throughout the order (470R for example), some more expensive than the other. Was this done on purpose, I didn't see any requirements in the docs, or could the be combined to save?
NO, this was definitely not done on purpose. They could be combined, definitely. If you can point out what values aside from 470R I can double check them.

Thanks

Edit: 470R is updated on the noise BOM, that one had a single much more expensive 470 on it. I didn't find 470R anywhere else other than Noise and Switching.
Last edited by elmegil on Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:33 pm, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sun Jan 20, 2019 6:26 pm

Fitchie wrote:
elmegil wrote:I'm not entirely clear on what is being suggested in the Switching interface adjustment procedure.
  • What exactly do you want to have explained?
This section in particular:
Step 1 - Switching to voiced or unvoiced

Trimpots P1 and P2 preset the switch to voiced or unvoiced as required. This can be done by alternately uttering ‘A' and 'S' sounds in the microphone. Depending on the results, the sensitivity can be readjusted if necessary.

Trimpots P3 and P4 preset the trigger point of the comparators and must be adjusted simultaneously with P1 and P2.
I thought the *switch* switched between voiced and unvoiced, so I'm not clear what you mean "preset the switch".

User avatar
jersupereq
Common Wiggler
Posts: 223
Joined: Sat Aug 16, 2008 9:24 pm
Location: SF

Post by jersupereq » Mon Jan 21, 2019 1:01 am

elmegil wrote:
jersupereq wrote:

Thank YOU!

I will go make these updates shortly. I get my sockets from Tayda, they're much cheaper and as far as I can tell, the same machined pin sockets I'd want anywhere.


EDIT: Updates are now in place.
Great work on the Mouser carts! I noticed some of the resistors have two different types throughout the order (470R for example), some more expensive than the other. Was this done on purpose, I didn't see any requirements in the docs, or could the be combined to save?
NO, this was definitely not done on purpose. They could be combined, definitely. If you can point out what values aside from 470R I can double check them.

Thanks

Edit: 470R is updated on the noise BOM, that one had a single much more expensive 470 on it. I didn't find 470R anywhere else other than Noise and Switching.

I’ll take another look in a little bit I think there might have been a couple others plus a few that a KAO might have been cheaper. Thanks again!!

Wolfo!
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 19
Joined: Wed Jun 03, 2015 4:29 am
Location: Belgium

Post by Wolfo! » Mon Jan 21, 2019 10:41 am

Fitchie wrote: Temporary bridge G-H and I-J on the backplane !

Image

Please check also the vocoder website, the instructions have been modified:
http://vocoder.eu/io-module-adjustment.html
One should clear his browser cache now and then ...
The two bridges did the trick!

Do they have to stay for the filter adjustment?

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Mon Jan 21, 2019 4:07 pm

Wolfo! wrote:The two bridges did the trick!
Do they have to stay for the filter adjustment?
Problem solved !
:tu:

As long as you do not insert the sibilance expansion cards, both bridges must be applied.

If you want to use the sibilance expansion, the carrier signal (pin I & J) should be interrupted and routed through the switching boards.
The speech signal (pin G & H) must always be connected.

Image

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Post by Fitchie » Tue Jan 22, 2019 1:17 am

All,

I have made the drawings a little clearer and also the website has been updated with this information:
www.vocoder.eu/jumper-settings.htmll

:help:
  • Here you can see the connections of the carrier & voice signal for the vocoder is his basic configuration:

    Image

    In this case connect pin G + pin H and on top of that also pin I + pin J.
    These connections can be made either by wire on the foreseen pins at the right side of the backplane, either by bridging both solder jumpers at the backside of the backplane.


    And here you can see how to connect the carrier & voice signal for the vocoder with the sibilance expansion:

    Image

    In this case only connect pin G + pin H, either by wire on the foreseen pin at the right side of the backplane, either by bridging the proper solder jumper at the backside of the backplane.

User avatar
Vlado
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2018 3:18 am

My frontplate

Post by Vlado » Tue Jan 22, 2019 5:35 am

Hi,

to anyone who might be interested in the look with bigger knobs.

Image

Image

And, yes there is a scratch ... grrrr :evil:

Best regards [/img]

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Re: My frontplate

Post by Fitchie » Tue Jan 22, 2019 6:49 am

Vlado wrote: To anyone who might be interested in the look with bigger knobs.
And, yes there is a scratch ... grrrr :evil:
  • The combination of small and big knobs looks great !

    I see a long wire running to all jacks, so just a small remark: try to avoid earth loops.
    The jacks already are making contact with the front panel as well with the ground connection on all filters.

    The better option is shown below:

    Image

    Very sorry about the scratch, but as I can see on the picture, only some white paint has been damaged on the power label.
    Maybe you can use a white paint pen as used to cover scratches on cars? And if it really bother you, I have 2 spare panels available

User avatar
Vlado
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 29
Joined: Tue Sep 25, 2018 3:18 am

Re: My frontplate

Post by Vlado » Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:03 am

Fitchie wrote:
Vlado wrote: To anyone who might be interested in the look with bigger knobs.
And, yes there is a scratch ... grrrr :evil:
  • The combination of small and big knobs looks great !

    I see a long wire running to all jacks, so just a small remark: try to avoid earth loops.
    The jacks already are making contact with the front panel as well with the ground connection on all filters.

    The better option is shown below:

    Image

    Very sorry about the scratch, but as I can see on the picture, only some white paint has been damaged on the power label.
    Maybe you can use a white paint pen as used to cover scratches on cars? And if it really bother you, I have 2 spare panels available


Hi Fitchie,

thank you for the quick response.

I tried different baquelite knobs and found the handling of the big ones nice, but the scale is covered.

Did i understand it well, that all grounds should be grouped by boards?
If so, I got the point.

Pressing in the LEDs was difficult, so I used a tool (of course plastic) and slipped ... damn onehanded workflow.

Best regards

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Re: My frontplate

Post by elmegil » Tue Jan 22, 2019 9:43 am

Fitchie wrote:I see a long wire running to all jacks, so just a small remark: try to avoid earth loops.
The jacks already are making contact with the front panel as well with the ground connection on all filters.

Speaking of ground...

I'm kind of dubious about the earth ground connection on the power connector. I scraped away paint inside the back where my screw is so that it makes contact, but the screw holes for the panel are painted/coated, so it doesn't seem to me like the front panel (or the top/bottom plates) will be earthed. Is that correct?

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Re: My frontplate

Post by Fitchie » Tue Jan 22, 2019 11:13 am

elmegil wrote:I'm kind of dubious about the earth ground connection on the power connector. I scraped away paint inside the back where my screw is so that it makes contact, but the screw holes for the panel are painted/coated, so it doesn't seem to me like the front panel (or the top/bottom plates) will be earthed. Is that correct?
In all probability, the Parker screws are that sharp that they cut away the paint and ensure enough contact for grounding and shielding (at least for audio purposes).
After closing the 19" it's a good idea to perform a connection check with an ordinary multimeter between the ground pin of the power connector and top/bottom plate.

I did just do the test and can confirm the whole case has been grounded.
Admittedly my screws have already been loosened and fixed quite often.
:hihi:

If unsure connect a grounding strip between the housing and top/bottom plate.

Image

User avatar
Fitchie
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 313
Joined: Sun Aug 30, 2015 1:49 pm

Re: My frontplate

Post by Fitchie » Tue Jan 22, 2019 12:54 pm

Vlado wrote:Did i understand it well, that all grounds should be grouped by boards?
If so, I got the point.
  • Absolutely correct !

User avatar
elmegil
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 2909
Joined: Sun Apr 29, 2012 2:57 pm
Location: Chicago

Post by elmegil » Sat Jan 26, 2019 2:21 am

Input calibration....

"Now your speech input has been calibrated for using line levels."

What if I have a mic I want to use? :D

It seems to me I can always turn down the input pot to use line input but I can't turn up to use the mic if I've calibrated for line levels....

Post Reply

Return to “Music Tech DIY”