VERBOS ELECTRONICS

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zerodivide
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by zerodivide » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:08 am

Does the Foundation Oscillator have an fm input?

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technicoloraudio
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by technicoloraudio » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:35 am

zerodivide wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:08 am
Does the Foundation Oscillator have an fm input?
I believe the CV in modulates frequency through an attenuverter, which should allow for FM via a bipolar modulation signal up through audio signals. Could be wrong, but I’ve used the CV input on the HO and Furthrrr Generator with similar results (even though they both have dedicated FM inputs too). I’ve found it useful for mulling a plucky envelope and having one control the VCA and one to the CV input on the oscillator. Then I’ll take an output from another oscillator and run that through a different VCA modulated by a slower LFO and into the FM input. The results are pretty similar if the FM and CV inputs are switched.
Im curious on the Foundation Oscillator what the sound would be like if the Timbre and Richness controls were getting the envelope and CV In was getting audio rate modulation or vice versa.
will trade two mediocre cats for anti-nautilus.

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mritenburg
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by mritenburg » Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:42 am

technicoloraudio wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:35 am
zerodivide wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:08 am
Does the Foundation Oscillator have an fm input?
I believe the CV in modulates frequency through an attenuverter, which should allow for FM via a bipolar modulation signal up through audio signals. Could be wrong, but I’ve used the CV input on the HO and Furthrrr Generator with similar results (even though they both have dedicated FM inputs too). I’ve found it useful for mulling a plucky envelope and having one control the VCA and one to the CV input on the oscillator. Then I’ll take an output from another oscillator and run that through a different VCA modulated by a slower LFO and into the FM input. The results are pretty similar if the FM and CV inputs are switched.
Im curious on the Foundation Oscillator what the sound would be like if the Timbre and Richness controls were getting the envelope and CV In was getting audio rate modulation or vice versa.
Yes, you can use the exponential CV input for FM, but it’s not unipolar linear FM like on the Complex Osc and Harmonic Osc. I won’t go into the differences, benefits, and drawbacks of linear FM compared to exponential FM. There are plenty of threads here on the topic.

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technicoloraudio
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by technicoloraudio » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:03 pm

mritenburg wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:42 am
Yes, you can use the exponential CV input for FM, but it’s not unipolar linear FM like on the Complex Osc and Harmonic Osc. I won’t go into the differences, benefits, and drawbacks of linear FM compared to exponential FM. There are plenty of threads here on the topic.
I'll have to dig into those threads, I really only started to appreciate all non-vibrato uses for FM only after getting a Digitone :despair:

Flohr is in my local synth club and showed me the magic of throwing envelopes into the FM input (and consequently the shape input, which seems pertinent to the Verbos Foundation Oscillator) of STO for percussion magic and now it seems to work its way into most of my patches.
will trade two mediocre cats for anti-nautilus.

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by mritenburg » Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:14 pm

technicoloraudio wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:03 pm
I'll have to dig into those threads, I really only started to appreciate all non-vibrato uses for FM only after getting a Digitone
Yeah, FM techniques excel at all kinds of bass, percussion, bells, bangs, clangs, metallic, and glassy sounds.

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by zerodivide » Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:40 pm

technicoloraudio wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 12:03 pm
mritenburg wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 11:42 am
Yes, you can use the exponential CV input for FM, but it’s not unipolar linear FM like on the Complex Osc and Harmonic Osc. I won’t go into the differences, benefits, and drawbacks of linear FM compared to exponential FM. There are plenty of threads here on the topic.
I'll have to dig into those threads, I really only started to appreciate all non-vibrato uses for FM only after getting a Digitone :despair:

Flohr is in my local synth club and showed me the magic of throwing envelopes into the FM input (and consequently the shape input, which seems pertinent to the Verbos Foundation Oscillator) of STO for percussion magic and now it seems to work its way into most of my patches.
So basically being a big FM guy, if I was going to downsize from the Verbos CO to the foundation Osc I would lose a lot eh? Only considered this move to free up space in my rack but seems I would lose too many possibilities

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by mritenburg » Sun Apr 05, 2020 6:54 pm

zerodivide wrote:
Sun Apr 05, 2020 2:40 pm
So basically being a big FM guy, if I was going to downsize from the Verbos CO to the foundation Osc I would lose a lot eh? Only considered this move to free up space in my rack but seems I would lose too many possibilities
You would lose linear FM, but not FM completely. If you do tonal music it could be an issue, but if you are doing more experimental stuff I don't think it's a huge issue. You would lose the modulation oscillator, so you would need a new FM modulator in addition to the Foundation Osc.

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by The Junglechrist » Tue Apr 07, 2020 8:53 am

Patch of the day with the Verbos rig :



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My label Concrete Collage : https://concretecollage.bandcamp.com/

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by trickness » Wed Apr 08, 2020 7:28 pm

Just added a bunch of Verbos modules to my rack - Mini Horse, VMS, the new ATC, Multi-Delay, Multi-Env, + Scan & Pan. All are working great out of the box and are just blowing my mind - I owned a bunch of Mark’s modules when I first ventured into euro 6 years ago, and didn’t really know how to use them beyond like a standard synth voice. Now I really appreciate all the CV out and in, envelope outs, the amount of modulation and signal you can send around is incredible and really unique (like a delay with 8 individual repeat audio taps out AND 8 envelope followers)...Yeah I know a lot of it is influenced by Buchla so maybe unique isn’t the right word but compared to other modules in my rack the philosophy he brings to his module design really is special imho) - Having a great time now that I’ve gotten back into euro and following this thread to see the incredible things everybody’s doing. Just great stuff!

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Tumulishroomaroom » Thu Apr 09, 2020 6:14 am

I agree ! I have somewhat the same trajectory and I think you really need to be a bit aware of modular synthesis to fully open to them. I definitely wasn't when I first got those modules.

Yesterday I tried to use the ATC in the return path of the FX send to get more control, fuzz and filtering, never did that before but that works quite well. Also I'm using the DFP more and more with the CO (with a Lxd after since the ATC was used on FX path duties) and I must say I really love the results.

Here's a quick loop with both :


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Tumulishroomaroom
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Tumulishroomaroom » Tue Apr 14, 2020 6:19 am

CO and DFP make a great combo, the dual CV inputs for the frequency really come in handy, same with the resonance. Stuff I'm sometimes missing with the ATC. It's nice to change it up sometimes. Random Sampling acting as the CV hub and sending modulation everywhere and the Multi Delay is pitch shifting the CO.


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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by shockletit » Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:07 am

Does anyone have any experience with the Verbos Power Board? I'm considering picking one up with some modules (Verbos funnily enough... I think I've got the bug) and can't find any info on it online. I'm thinking that perhaps it is no longer manufactured? The picture I have of it is a red board with 20 power headers on it - Verbos Electronics Power Board printed on it and has a black rectangle sticking up on it (power supply itself?) that has CINCON EC9BW-24S15 in white. I can only assume it's of the same quality of Verbos modules and that it would be a perfect power supply for Verbos modules, but thought I'd ask around. I believe that it was initially purchased when Verbos was in the states and I intend to use in UK. Don't think that will be an issue, as it apparently has a wall wart imputting to power to the board in the case, but if anyone knows, I would be most grateful for any info. Thanks.

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Eurtrude » Tue Apr 14, 2020 12:09 pm

shockletit wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 11:07 am
Does anyone have any experience with the Verbos Power Board? I'm considering picking one up with some modules (Verbos funnily enough... I think I've got the bug) and can't find any info on it online. I'm thinking that perhaps it is no longer manufactured? The picture I have of it is a red board with 20 power headers on it - Verbos Electronics Power Board printed on it and has a black rectangle sticking up on it (power supply itself?) that has CINCON EC9BW-24S15 in white. I can only assume it's of the same quality of Verbos modules and that it would be a perfect power supply for Verbos modules, but thought I'd ask around. I believe that it was initially purchased when Verbos was in the states and I intend to use in UK. Don't think that will be an issue, as it apparently has a wall wart imputting to power to the board in the case, but if anyone knows, I would be most grateful for any info. Thanks.
I have one + the black case, that hosts my Verbos modules :). It's actually the case that had been made for their first system (composition system).
Here are the specs of the power supply :
Output (Maximum): 1.2 A @ +12V / 1.2A @ -12V / 1A @ 5V
It comes with a 2.4A universal AC Adapter.
The case itself is very VERY shallow. Only 20mm deep modules will fit in the bottom row and for the upper one, maybe 40 or 50mm max.

If you have more specific questions, don't hesitate :)

shockletit
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by shockletit » Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:59 pm

Thanks, that was quick. Do you know what modules the Verbos composition system contained and how many HP wide the case was?

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Paul_N » Tue Apr 14, 2020 2:24 pm

I have one as well - it is 6U @ 84hp.

Tom mentioned that they are going to be announcing some new systems soon, as well as making cases available for anyone who has a predominately verbos system. Given that SuperBooth is right around the corner, I’m hoping that they make some announcements. Their modules are extremely sensitive to power. I spent some time talking w/Detroit Modular, and the fellow (wish I could remember his name) mentioned that they only recommend Doepfer power supplies for verbos, but had also said that some of the newer Pittsburgh Modular structure cases w/newer power supplies are ok.

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Eurtrude » Tue Apr 14, 2020 4:07 pm

shockletit wrote:
Tue Apr 14, 2020 1:59 pm
Thanks, that was quick. Do you know what modules the Verbos composition system contained and how many HP wide the case was?
I think, but can be wrong, that the initial composition system included only Harmonic Osc, Complex Osc, Amp & Tone, Dual Four Pole and Voltage Multistage. I also think that the case was, then, 2 X 84HP.

Then it got bigger with the Multi-enveloppe and Scan&Pan. The touchplate keyboard, etc.

I did not bought a composition system (too expensive new), just the modules alone. Then, one day, a guy was selling the case pretty cheap (due to the fact it was very shallow) and I bought it because I was experiencing power supply problems with my CO, using a cheap Meanwell. It's a 2 X 104HP, so probably from a more advanced composition or performance system (i.e. the one they sold later on, when new Verbos modules like multi-enveloppe has been available). Since then, no more power problems, the tracking of my Verbos oscillators is near perfect (which is crucial for the CO when it comes to the melodic side of it).

Also, Analog Heaven seems to have some of the new systems : http://analoguehaven.com/verboselectronics/systems/

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by advrsry » Tue Apr 14, 2020 5:17 pm

I think that those are the old ones (note that they don't include any of the new modules).

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by zerodivide » Wed Apr 15, 2020 1:59 am

those who have the Verbos Complex Oscillator, some questions on inputs I rarely use..

1. When would you want to put something into the FM input of the Modulating Oscillator? Is that if you're using it as a separate oscillator and want to FM that on its own?

2. If I have CV going into either Oscillator's V/Oct, what am I doing with the CV input next it ? Kinda confused on the purpose of "C.v. input." for either osc. Is it just for offset really?

3. If I have the switch in the middle set to FM, but I'm also piping in a waveform from the Modulating Oscillator into the FM input of the Carrier Osc, what exactly is happening? It seems like its somehow doing FM twice because it doesnt sound like it breaks the normal and uses just the input

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The Junglechrist
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by The Junglechrist » Wed Apr 15, 2020 3:41 am

zerodivide wrote:
Wed Apr 15, 2020 1:59 am
those who have the Verbos Complex Oscillator, some questions on inputs I rarely use..

1. When would you want to put something into the FM input of the Modulating Oscillator? Is that if you're using it as a separate oscillator and want to FM that on its own?

2. If I have CV going into either Oscillator's V/Oct, what am I doing with the CV input next it ? Kinda confused on the purpose of "C.v. input." for either osc. Is it just for offset really?

3. If I have the switch in the middle set to FM, but I'm also piping in a waveform from the Modulating Oscillator into the FM input of the Carrier Osc, what exactly is happening? It seems like its somehow doing FM twice because it doesnt sound like it breaks the normal and uses just the input
1. Yes, but you could also use this when the mod osc is synced to the first one, for "sync sweeps", for modulating the speed of vibrato / tremolo, or the FM ratio.

2. The "CV. input" on both VCO is an exponential FM input, while the "FM input" is linear. It mostly have a way bigger range for deeper modulation.

3. What is happening is more FM, possibly with a different shape. It is like mixing two waveform in a mixer before sending those to FM something, exept here you could have Expo FM from the mod bus + linear if pluging it into the "Fm in".

I hope this was helpfull


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Whatisvalis
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Whatisvalis » Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:42 am

Thinking of going with Verbos for oscillators - both Harmonic and Complex.

I've read back a bunch of pages on the potential for occasional issues. Is there anything I should know when buying used? In terms of power I have a TPS80W intellijel power supply and also considering a Mantis for a second case.

The amp and tone sounds great with the above Oscillators but its size is a drawback - how's the optomix combination?

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by mritenburg » Thu Apr 16, 2020 8:24 am

Whatisvalis wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 7:42 am
In terms of power I have a TPS80W intellijel power supply and also considering a Mantis for a second case.
The TPS80W is described on the Intellijel site as an “80 Watt integrated switching power supply.” No where in the description does it state that the supply also has linear regulation. Verbos modules work best with a true linear power supply or a switchIng power supply that has linear regulation. For example, the Doepfer PSU3 is a switching power supply with linear regulation and has been recommended several times as a good choice for powering Verbos modules. Maybe the TPS80W has linear regulation, maybe not. It wouldn’t hurt to ask Intellijel directly. I know they are very responsive to customer requests.

The Mantis case has a uZeus power supply. I’m sure folks here can comment on whether or not they have issues with that power supply.

The Maths+Optomix is a great addition to Verbos modules.

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youkon
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by youkon » Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:09 am

My Arturia case works well with all verbos modules

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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Tumulishroomaroom » Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:47 am

I've had no problem with Verbos modules and Intellijel power supply. 7U, 4U and Palette.
Also I love my Lxd with the CO, I know it's not exaclty the same as Optomix though. But the new Amp & Tone is 10hp, it's quite feature packed for the size now. High gain, great filter, VCA.

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elinch
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by elinch » Thu Apr 16, 2020 10:12 am

„a quiet piece in the quiet time. built around the verbos complex oscillator / filter & noise / amp & tone“
more information on the youtube page




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Whatisvalis
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Re: VERBOS ELECTRONICS

Post by Whatisvalis » Thu Apr 16, 2020 5:22 pm

Tumulishroomaroom wrote:
Thu Apr 16, 2020 9:47 am
I've had no problem with Verbos modules and Intellijel power supply. 7U, 4U and Palette.
Also I love my Lxd with the CO, I know it's not exaclty the same as Optomix though. But the new Amp & Tone is 10hp, it's quite feature packed for the size now. High gain, great filter, VCA.
Yea the new 10hp Amp and Tone is a lot better space wise, maybe that and an Lxd might be a nice set of options.

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