Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Cwejman, Livewire, TipTop Audio, Doepfer etc... Get your euro on!

Moderators: Kent, luketeaford, Joe.

Post Reply
Dan S
Learning to Wiggle
Posts: 18
Joined: Sun Jun 28, 2020 11:26 pm

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by Dan S » Fri Dec 04, 2020 1:05 am

Zentek wrote:
Tue Dec 01, 2020 7:29 am
To go over 5Hz, you can use the global clock and set the multiply to x16. This way you could reach 80Hz.
Thanks for the suggestion. It seems to work fine up to x8, but does not loop correctly at x9 and over.
Scope picture show my test at x16, A=D, R=0s, "Filling" set to 100%.
Also, it would be very helpful to have per-envelope multipliers, as opposed to global (I usually allocate 2 channels for ADSR, and 2 channels for LFO).
Thanks again for your help :tu:
Attachments
SDS00001.png

smoo
Common Wiggler
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:34 am

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by smoo » Sun Dec 06, 2020 2:51 am

Question. Is Quadigy also a fast and snappy envelope? I am using the Z4000 which is really fast.

I cant fiind any informtion about that online.

User avatar
mdoudoroff
Super Deluxe Wiggler
Posts: 4225
Joined: Fri Jul 17, 2015 8:10 am
Location: New York City

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by mdoudoroff » Sun Dec 06, 2020 3:17 pm

smoo wrote:
Sun Dec 06, 2020 2:51 am
Question. Is Quadigy also a fast and snappy envelope? I am using the Z4000 which is really fast.

I cant fiind any informtion about that online.
Quadigy isn’t “unsnappy”, but it’s a digital module, and pretty much impossible for it to be utterly latency-free like an analog EG.

Here’s a zoomed-in recording of the same signal through two VCAs opened by the same trigger to Quadigy and Maths, respectively:
2020-12-06 at 3.08 PM.jpg
As you can see, the bottom one (Maths) begins ever so slightly earlier.

Another difference is that Quadigy (below, green trace) produces an 8v envelope, whereas Maths (blue trace) is close to 10v. You can also see from this overlay of the actual envelopes that the latency is generally insignificant, and that both EGs have similarly fast attacks.
B83A3B4C-38A1-4024-8F43-D316F0E88A48_1_201_a.jpg

Jee
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 308
Joined: Wed Sep 16, 2009 2:50 am

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by Jee » Sun Dec 06, 2020 5:04 pm

From my user perspective and in terms of musical approach this difference is totally neglectable.

In the most extreme audio rate triggering that might make a small difference but with more classical use I would definitely say that quadigy is actually quite snappy, still.

The option to bend (strongly) the segment into exp/log curves also helps a lot for fast percussive stuff.
Last edited by Jee on Mon Dec 07, 2020 6:42 am, edited 1 time in total.

User avatar
Zentek
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:15 pm
Location: Belgium
Contact:

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by Zentek » Mon Dec 07, 2020 5:42 am

Background info about "snappy" envelopes in the Quadigy

In a typical analogue envelope generator, the rise time depends on the load time of a capacitor.
The constraint is that a fast rise ideally requires an instant charge of the capacitor, which is not possible as the capacitor should also care for longer times. This explains why many analog envelopes have a range setting so that switching to a smaller capacitor for short range allows a faster charge.

In the Quadigy there are two independent aspects defining the attack timing: the time to initiate the envelope and the rise time once the envelope begins.

We chose to make the Quadigy a quad envelope where all time constants are relating to an overall system clock for reasons of cycle synchronization among others. This creates a little lag in a fraction of a millisecond before the envelope begins. (as in the first image that mdoudoroff posted)

As for the rise time, which is the only aspect that defines the snapiness that could be heard, it fits in 3/10th of a millisecond (curve from 10% to 90% level).
This fast rise time is independent of the overall envelope time, even if decay or release are several minutes long.

Quadigy rise time
Quadigy rise time
The steps in the image are only due to the scope display given that the Quadigy generates envelopes in 4096 levels and implements filters that eliminate all digital artifact.
Last edited by Zentek on Fri Jan 15, 2021 12:15 pm, edited 1 time in total.
Klavis
Fine Modular Designs

smoo
Common Wiggler
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:34 am

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by smoo » Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:29 am

Interesting. I' d have to buy the quadigs to hear it But snappyness to be heard is defined by a very fast step attack, but then its the velocity of the decay and the curve of the decay. I basically wanted to know how snappy the decay is. There are some very good digital EGs around, for instance the ones in the Hydrasynth. I never got warm with the pretty snappy WMD Multimode EG.

User avatar
Zentek
Wiggling with Experience
Posts: 251
Joined: Tue Jun 16, 2015 5:15 pm
Location: Belgium
Contact:

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by Zentek » Tue Dec 08, 2020 12:08 pm

smoo wrote:
Mon Dec 07, 2020 8:29 am
... I basically wanted to know how snappy the decay is...
Exactly as fast as the attack ;)
You can also tailor each curve separately for log/lin/exp continuously.
As an example, the decay may begin with an instant fall (pulse-like) to become a softer slope once halfway.
Such settings are highly effective and versatile for percussive sounds. 8-)
Klavis
Fine Modular Designs

vraufen
Common Wiggler
Posts: 83
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:13 pm

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by vraufen » Tue Dec 08, 2020 7:06 pm

The quadigy is very snappy, I dont think it would leave you wanting

smoo
Common Wiggler
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:34 am

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by smoo » Tue Dec 08, 2020 7:53 pm

great thanks. Ordered.

vraufen
Common Wiggler
Posts: 83
Joined: Tue Oct 06, 2020 6:13 pm

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by vraufen » Tue Dec 08, 2020 9:43 pm

smoo wrote:
Tue Dec 08, 2020 7:53 pm
great thanks. Ordered.
when you get it and are trying to dial in your snappy sound, make sure you adjust the global time for that envelope so your slider range goes from 0-the longest you would possibly want, otherwise you only have the bottom half of the slider for lower values. And though the global time is reduced, you will still see the same ms value range no matter what so keep that in mind.

I usually have the global times for all of them around 45%, since I never really need super long envelopes.

smoo
Common Wiggler
Posts: 147
Joined: Sun Mar 14, 2010 5:34 am

Re: Klavis - Quadigy - Quad Envelope Generator

Post by smoo » Sun Dec 13, 2020 3:09 am

I just played with it and its extremely snappy. Its very fast and extreme settings are possible.

Post Reply

Return to “Eurorack Modules”