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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Neuron / Difference Rectifier PCBs
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Music Tech DIY  
Author Neuron / Difference Rectifier PCBs
andrewF
UPDATE 4/3/14 panels in stock, see pics below
10hp (pots mounted on PCB) AU$22
$5 shipping per order

DIFF RECTIFIER / NEURON BUILD MANUAL includes schematics & BOM


I keep getting asked about these so have sent off a design for a pcb containing 1 of each of these circuits. Ordered 100, so plenty to go around.
The Difference Rectifier has 4 inputs (two + & two -) and two outputs. The Neuron has two inputs and one output. There is a pad labelled 'ext' where extra inputs can be added if desired (use a 100k resistor attached to the jack).
All inputs for both circuits can be wired to attenuating pots if required. The two pots on the PCB are the critical Offset and Invert controls for the Neuron. The Offset is slightly modded from the previous Double Neuron PCB as it now ranges between +V and -V and its effect is halved by the 200k resistor, giving a greater useful range from the pot.
Schematics and demos - Difference Rectifier and Neuron


The PCB is small so will suit Euro builders. Approx 1.5 by 2 inches.
The 2 board mounted pots (both 100k) are 1 inch apart, the idea is to mount the PCB to the panel with threaded pots. There are 2 mounting holes otherwise if you want to attach the board some other way.

Expect AU$10 each including shipping anywhere, add AU$8 per board for extras. (ie 2 PCBs = AU$18 shipped, 3 PCBs = $26 shipped, etc)
Should be here in a month, please indicate if you want in this thread. I will pm and request payment once the PCBs are here, tested and ready to ship.





edit Batch 1 sent out to

frozenkore 4
rod serling fan club 4
Ringstone 4
appliancide 2
Cyklopljud 2
Glitchpop 2
Negativspace 4
ear ear 2
Themanthatwasused 2
willzyx 4
Boothnavy 4
Pfurmel 4
Asterisk 4
aL Pariah 4
defenestration 4
Raisinbag 4
Theabsent 8
Dreamlost 3
Janvanvolt 4
Lordofthebored 2
Fetideye 2
Luka 4
moogah 4
fluxmonkey 4
cleaning lady2

edit 6/3/2013
batch 2 shipped
boards shipped:
very angry mobster 4
dmitri 4
clorax hurd 3 + 3 double neuron
fonik 4
jjsynth 4
photon 2
rosch 4
Dego 4
iL 4
falafelbiels 2
withakay 2
spotta 4
rowman 4
pre55ure2
macumbista 4
synchromesh 4
limpmeat 4
transistor logic 2
synthcube 10
decaying.sine
4 PCBs for me please.
Pfurmel
I'll take 4 of these also, if that's ok.
negativspace
Same! Gotta have a couple in the Euro... can't have Neurons without euro after all. zombie
wetterberg
Please desrcribe these two circuits with words. Please.

I think I get the difference rectifier, but honestly an explanation beyond "look at the scope" would be lovely smile
Luka
Yeah i might grab a quad SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger! SlayerBadger!
defenestration
4 PCBs for me, thanks much!

what's the largest 'neural network' you've ever patched? even just two neurons feeding a third seems like it would be interesting. . . . or is it kind of a waste of time? I suppose it might depend on your perspective.
andrewF
wetterberg wrote:
Please desrcribe these two circuits with words. Please.

I think I get the difference rectifier, but honestly an explanation beyond "look at the scope" would be lovely smile


The Diff Rect....needs a better name, behaves as per these equations:



Basically the voltage on Vin- is subtracted from the voltage on Vin+. The value left then goes to Vout+, if it is more than 0V, or to Vout- if it is less than 0V.
So, as the name implies you are getting the difference between the input signals and that difference is then rectified to the +ve or -ve outputs.

As there are no caps in the signal path, it will happily deal with audio rate signals as well, so is an interesting waveshaper and even acts a bit like a VCA....let's say audio gate hihi
For me it is most fun just to feed it signals from LFOs and get a lot of complex envelopes from it.

The neuron is from "A general purpose analog neural computer" by P. Mueller et al and modified for use in a synth. The circuit is an "idealized version of a typical biological neuron." It feeds thru the postive rectified portion of the input signal and mixes that with positive and negative going pulses (or spikes or gates) when the threshold (set by the offset pot ) is crossed.
The 1st op amp stage is a summing rectifier. This stage output is fed to a comparator, the inverted positive rectified signal and the comparator output, via an attenuator, are summed and inverted at the final output stage.

The offset pot determines when the comparator will 'fire' in response to the input signal and the invert pot sets the level of the signal from the comparator going into the output stage.

Sorry, this description probably doesn't help.

Trying to think of an analogy that may help....Perhaps it is like your partner tickling you, the tickling corresponds to the input signal, tickling with two hands is like two input signals. Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.
Luka
hihi
andrewF
defenestration wrote:

what's the largest 'neural network' you've ever patched? even just two neurons feeding a third seems like it would be interesting. . . . or is it kind of a waste of time? I suppose it might depend on your perspective.


Most I have played with is 4, depends on what you like, but I had fun. It is useful to feedback the outputs to inputs of different neurons.
Just an example (the left sides of the boxes are inputs, right sides = outputs)
nathanxl
andrewF wrote:
... Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.


hihi hihi hihi
ringstone
4 PCBs for me please. That description was worth the money in itself lol

Cheers
Blair
cleaninglady
nathanxl wrote:
andrewF wrote:
... Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.


hihi hihi hihi


signature of the year andrewF !! we're not worthy we're not worthy we're not worthy

I'll take two PCB's. Now i've got a month to stock up on old people wee underpants...
Pfurmel
Andrew, you should become a lecturer, you have such a unique approach to describing electronic circuits.
aL Pariah
I'd like 4 PCBs, please.
the bad producer
I'll have 4 please!
Rod Serling Fan Club
2 of each plz
frozenkore
4 PCBs please
moogah
4 seems like a good number.
fluxmonkey
4 for me, por favor.

the only other reference i've seen to hardware neurons relative to electronic music is from Grant Richter: http://www.musicsynthesizer.com/Neurons/Neurons1.html ... are these similar, or different?
decaying.sine
nathanxl wrote:
andrewF wrote:
... Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.


hihi hihi hihi


This taint enough information.
JJ
Laughing my ass off here. Epical. MY ASS IS BLEEDING
FetidEye
2 for me !! It's peanut butter jelly time!
glitchpop
These seem pretty interesting to me. I'll take two please. Maybe four if I get a new job. hihi
cyklopljud
Two for me Andrew!
appliancide
I will take two. Small PCBs take up less space in my backlog....
raisinbag
I will get 4 PCbsif you promise it will tickle my taint.

Will you pm us when they are in? I sometimes miss stuff.
asterisk
id like 4 PCBs please!
looking forward to it andrew.
andrewF
raisinbag wrote:


Will you pm us when they are in? I sometimes miss stuff.


yep just let me know how many in this thread and I will pm when they are ready
andrewF
fluxmonkey wrote:


the only other reference i've seen to hardware neurons relative to electronic music is from Grant Richter: http://www.musicsynthesizer.com/Neurons/Neurons1.html ... are these similar, or different?


Both are from the same field of research - neural networks - and both have the same principle of threshold initiated responses. Apart from these, they are completely different circuits.
This one is a single neuron, one is good but a network (3 or more) is capable of some very complex behaviour.
In synth terms, it will give unusual envelopes, patterns and waveshaping.

Grant's looks like it is a system or network designed to produce complex trigger arrays. It is based on digital computing concepts postulated by Marvin Minsky (who co-designed the Triadex Muse). I don't know much (or anything) about that side of the field, nevertheless the demos are great and I wish someone would do a PCB for it.
Willzyx
Looks cool!

Put me down for 4
boothnavy
Yes, four.
nathanxl
Pfurmel wrote:
Andrew, you should become a lecturer, you have such a unique approach to describing electronic circuits.

I agree.

Ill have 4 of these PCBs. Thanks.
Will the Neurons work with the double neuron PCB you released a while back?
decaying.sine
nathanxl wrote:
Pfurmel wrote:
Andrew, you should become a lecturer, you have such a unique approach to describing electronic circuits.

I agree.

Ill have 4 of these PCBs. Thanks.
Will the Neurons work with the double neuron PCB you released a while back?


Good Q.
andrewF
nathanxl wrote:

Will the Neurons work with the double neuron PCB you released a while back?


Yes the neuron circuit is almost the same. What is different is it is just one Neuron and the other circuit is the Diff-rectifier, plus the PCB is very small so will suit any panel format.
home_listening
I'd also be interested in 4!

Thanks, that feedback array looks very interesting
ear ear
Two for me, please. thumbs up
KnobHell
Is there a schematic and a bom?
DreamLost
I'll gladly take 3 PCBs if available.

Thanks!
themanthatwasused
Finally something to get into!
Interested in two when it's ready Andrew.
screaming goo yo screaming goo yo screaming goo yo
Rod Serling Fan Club
Make my order 4 pcbs.
home_listening
Mmm looks like:

2 x 100k Pot 9mm PC mount

1 x TL074

2 x 10uf electro
2 x 100n poly

4 x diode (1n4148?)

3 x 1k
3 x 22k
1 x 200k
2 x 10r
10 x 100k

Parts bin stuff, I like it. hihi hihi hihi
asterisk
i hope clarke will make a dual neuron / dual difference rectifier eurorack panel for this!!!
andrewF
home_listening wrote:
Mmm looks like:

2 x 100k Pot 9mm PC mount

1 x TL074

2 x 10uf electro
2 x 100n poly

4 x diode (1n4148?)

3 x 1k
3 x 22k
1 x 200k
1 x 10r
10 x 100k

Parts bin stuff, I like it. hihi hihi hihi


Thanks Guinness ftw!
just
2 x 10R
yep, any general purpose diodes like 1n4148 will do
The caps are for decoupling; the value is not critical, so the 100nF could be anything from 10nF to 100nF (2.5mm spacing)
theabsent
Edited: we are doing a local group from you andrewF : )

Taking 8 at the moment
defenestration
for the opamp wired as a comparator, have you ever attempted using a dedicated comparator IC instead of a general purpose opamp? perhaps audio rate inputs in particular would reveal some differences?

might perfboard some extra neurons and curious if it's worth checking out
janvanvolt
taking four -4-

--jan
lordofthebored
2 for me, thanks!
clorax hurd
deleted
nangu
I'd like 8. Thanks!!
andrewF
nangu wrote:
I'd like 8. Thanks!!


I only ordered 100 boards in the 1st run, this brings 'wants' to 107 (including 1 for me).
woah love Thanks everyone for your interest.

As soon as the first run has been sent out I will order a shitload more, so expect the 2nd batch by mid-late January.
nangu
I'm happy to wait until January. Good to hear that this run has been such a success!
very angry mobster
I'll take 4 pcb's when the new batch comes in. Thanks smile
dmitri
4 for me please applause ROTFL


andrewF wrote:

Trying to think of an analogy that may help....Perhaps it is like your partner tickling you, the tickling corresponds to the input signal, tickling with two hands is like two input signals. Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.
clorax hurd
andrewF wrote:

As soon as the first run has been sent out I will order a shitload more, so expect the 2nd batch by mid-late January.


Please, are you maybe going to make double-neuron pcbs (as described in the build docu) as well? Because it makes sense to have many neurons (i would like to have 5 or more), but i have no idea what would I do with more than 1 or 2 diff-rectifiers...
andrewF
The diff-rect works well with the neuron, you can use it as part of a complex patch with ins and outs from other Neurons.

An example would be using 2 neurons and 1 diff-rect. Feed the same LFO signal to inputs of both Neurons. Output of NeuronA to + input of diff-rect. output of NeuronB to - input. Then connect the - output of the diff-rect to input of NeuronA, and + output of the diff-rect to input of NeuronB....or the other way around. Twiddle knobs to suit. Use outputs of all three modules to control VCOs, VCFs or whatever you choose.

In terms of $$, it will be almost the same cost to get a bunch of these PCBs, rather than the dual versions. The main difference is the double Neuron PCB has space for an attenuator pot for one of the inputs on the PCB, so slightly less wiring to do.

That being said, if you really want the double Neuron PCB, I get some more if there is space on my next order.....and check if I have any spare in the shed hmmm.....
clorax hurd
Thanks for the patching idea. It makes sense to have them together in the end, so I think I'll be happy with the mixes one. Will take 5 pieces of the new batch of mixed pcbs.
+ if you possibly fine some spares of dual-neuron pcbs in shed, then i would (really!:) take 2 of such pcbs too.

thanks!
fonik
okay, i think i want 4 Neurons/Diff-rect...
jjsynth
Please 4 pcbs for me
photon
I'd like a pair, please.
Adam-V
andrewF wrote:

Trying to think of an analogy that may help....Perhaps it is like your partner tickling you, the tickling corresponds to the input signal, tickling with two hands is like two input signals. Most of the tickling makes you giggle and squirm a bit, but every now and then your partner tickles a sensitive spot, like that little flap of skin between your testicles and your anus, then you lose it, jump in the air and a bit of wee comes out. This is the equivalent of the comparator kicking in, sending the output signal haywire. Your response to the tickling is, of course, the output signal. The wee is the equivalent of the op amp going into saturation.


I'll take a couple of these little "Barse Ticklers" from the next run if I may Andrew.

Cheers,
Adam-V
andrewF
Adam-V wrote:
"Barse Ticklers"

Cheers,
Adam-V


seems a good name for the module - thanks w00t
rosch
i'll take 4 of the neuron/barse ticklers if there is another run.
is there a way to receive email notification if a certain member opens a new thread? 8_)
Adam-V
andrewF wrote:
Adam-V wrote:
"Barse Ticklers"

Cheers,
Adam-V


seems a good name for the module - thanks w00t


Putting the anal in analogue!

Cheers,
Adam-V
jimmyambulance
how are people implementing the neurons (especially in euro)?
andrewF
nobody has got PCBs yet, they should have arrived to me 2-3 weeks ago.
I guess the mail gets very busy and a bit slow around December.
Dego
I want four pcbs
iL
i like to get 4 pcbs.

diff-rectifier is great!
falafelbiels
Fits euro? I missed this? I'd like 2 of these PCBs if still available. I need more AndrewF in my setup and my 4U cabinet is taking its' sweet time...
black_spiral
I'll take 4 of these when they're available.
withakay
I am in for 2 PCBs at least, maybe more funds permitting.
andrewF
These arrived, built one today, is good hihi
Will start sending out PMs with payment info tomorrow

Must be one of the easiest DIY builds ever.
themanthatwasused
nanners It's peanut butter jelly time! Rockin' Banana!
raisinbag
My choda tingles with anticipation.
spotta
Can you put me down for four. Cheers thumbs up
dmitri
I take 4 please nanners
negativspace
w00t
andrewF
PMs sent to those that got dibs in the 1st batch.
Seeing everybody wants more than 1 board, I just made it $8 per board (includes shipping)

I will send off for the 2nd batch tomorrow, usually takes 4 weeks to get to my door....so long as xmas and new year aren't in the way
janvanvolt
Just wondering, is there a panel design for euro coming up ?
glitchpop
paid cheers The Chewbacca Defense
fonik
andrewF wrote:
I will send off for the 2nd batch tomorrow, usually takes 4 weeks to get to my door....so long as xmas and new year aren't in the way

i think that's me in the 2nd batch! nanners
andrewF
the following are packed and will be posted 1st thing tomorrow (intended today but it is too late to get to the PO). If anyone has paid and their name is not on the list or I got the numbers wrong ...or something, please let me know.
btw - I donate to Muffs after a board run, there'll be about $50 into the coffers from this one

frozenkore 4
rod serling fan club 4
Ringstone 4
appliancide 2
Cyklopljud 2
Glitchpop 2
Negativspace 4
ear ear 2
Themanthatwasused 2
willzyx 4
Boothnavy 4
Pfurmel 4
Asterisk 4
aL Pariah 4
defenestration 4
Raisinbag 4
Theabsent 8
Dreamlost 3
Janvanvolt 4

now I need a Guinness ftw!

edit:
Lordofthebored 2
Fetideye 2
Luka 4

edit#2:
moogah 4
fluxmonkey 4

edit#4
cleaning lady


all posted
FetidEye
just got back from Egypt, and payed you smile
2nd batch it is w00t
withakay
Hi,

I didn't get a PM re payment.
Not sure how you do this, do you take payment before ordering?

Eitherway, still interested in getting a couple of boards if and when they become available again smile
andrewF
FetidEye wrote:
just got back from Egypt, and payed you smile
2nd batch it is w00t

Egypt! lucky you.....escape the winter.
yours & Luka's will get shipped today

withakay wrote:
Hi,

I didn't get a PM re payment.
Not sure how you do this, do you take payment before ordering?

Eitherway, still interested in getting a couple of boards if and when they become available again smile


The 1st batch are all accounted for, when the 2nd batch arrive I will pm you requesting payment. It is enough just to say you want some on this thread for now.
Here's the build manual, its on my DIY site in the data section, link is also at the top of the 1st post of this thread:
Diff rectifier / Neuron build manual
glitchpop
Hey andrew I got mine the other day.
applause

Beautiful little things! Do you get them made locally or send them OS? Just curious for my own future pcb scheming. It's motherfucking bacon yo
andrewF
Futurlec do them, usually takes a month for the boards to arrive from the day the order is submitted.
Be careful to check prices ordering from their international site (US$) or the Australian site (AU$), the international site often works out 20% cheaper
themanthatwasused
Boards are here AndrewF.
Thanks
Luka
mine arrived andrew cheers


probably silly question and rememds me when i found an 'idiots guide to nano technology' book smile but ...


do you have any begginers literature to discuss implementation of neuron function blocks. trying to find an interesting way to implemenet.
andrewF
Probably best to search "simple neural networks" and choose a page that suits you, check images too for some ideas.

Here are a couple I like (of course tweak pots to suit)
glitchpop
Luka wrote:


do you have any begginers literature to discuss implementation of neuron function blocks. trying to find an interesting way to implemenet.


Great question!

Now for a stupid question.

I haven't wired 3 pin - 10 pin (euro) power before. Does this look ok? Looks ok to me but I wanted to check with people who know more. I'd rather look stupid now than when I plug it in. FUUUCCKKKK!!!
andrewF
Looks right, except you will only need 3 wires. no need to double up each one.

At least if you get it wrong, the worst that will happen is a dead TL074 BOOM!
glitchpop
Ok thanks andrewF! nanners
Luka
just doing a little research - luckily i found an article which uses NN (back propagation) to examine a topic in my field. so it is all starting to make sense.

sort of reminds me of using the klee. multiple stages all combining to created an output sequence - only when the multiple arbitrary inputs are combined and tweaked do you start to find an output in tune and to your liking

i think i might grab another 4 andrew
glitchpop
Yeh I'm thinking I might get some more as well. twisted

I don't have (can't find d'oh!) any 200k resistors can I use a 220k?
andrewF
glitchpop wrote:
Yeh I'm thinking I might get some more as well. twisted

I don't have (can't find d'oh!) any 200k resistors can I use a 220k?


yes, it will just reduce the maximum offset slightly and increase sensitivity of the offset pot a little as a trade-off w00t
rowman
I'll take 4 plz
FetidEye
mine just came in today (in nice wrapping paper hihi )

thanks!!
pre55ure
Don't know how I missed these, I'll take 2 if theres another run.
Rod Serling Fan Club
Curious to see anyone's panel ideas for inspiration.
andrewF
pre55ure wrote:
Don't know how I missed these, I'll take 2 if theres another run.

yep Batch #2 should be here in 3 weeks.

Rod Serling Fan Club wrote:
Curious to see anyone's panel ideas for inspiration.

This is a bit lame (a 5 minute effort during morning coffee) but it at least shows what is needed. I added an extra input for the neuron and renamed the 'invert' pot as 'response' (this is discussed in the build manual).
ear ear
Is there a standard symbol for a neuron, as there are - for example - for logic gates?
nathanxl
Found this interesting.
http://www.beam-wiki.org/wiki/Symbol_for_Connecting_Neurons

@ AndrewF: You could make your own symbol and release it for everyone to use on their panels...
ear ear
There's also this.

andrewF
ear ear wrote:
There's also this.



These are McCulloch-Pitt cells which evolved into or were replaced by the AND, OR, NOR, etc logic gates we use now.

Apart from these there does not seem to be any standard symbol for the neuron, usually they are just drawn as a series of circles, sometimes triangles with an 'N' in the middle.
As the neuron on this PCB is more an analogue circuit with a digital element (comparator), perhaps a variation of the Pitt cell with a triangle wave will do?
cleaninglady
Just paid for my two... w00t
frozenkore
Got mine yesterday, thanks!
macumbista
Put me down for four of the second batch pls!!!!
synchromesh
I'd like to put my name down for four PCBs from the second batch, thanks! This is fun!
limpmeat
I'll take 4 as well
transistor logic
i am down for two of these
falafelbiels
I am broke
frozenkore
falafelbiels wrote:
I am broke


Welcome to the club w00t
andrewF
falafelbiels wrote:
I am broke

sad banana
Hope you at least have the necessities to keep you going Dinner at the Y Guinness ftw! smokin'
Anyway, If this batch runs out I will get more. Some people want to build them for selling as complete modules, so I need to keep a good supply.
falafelbiels
Just broke for modules. To be honest I bought a module kit yesterday, not an expensive one though...
frozenkore
Rod Serling Fan Club wrote:
Curious to see anyone's panel ideas for inspiration.


Here's where I'm at right now. I don't know if it's going to work, I need to take a few measurements. If it does, I might use .75" knobs instead of .5" knobs. This is 6hp. The only thing I'm concerned about is the actual board to panel placement. The jacks should fit fine. I thought the red was fitting.



andrewF
Just got the second batch in today, built and tested one.
Pms sent to everyone who has lodged a 'want' post in this thread, if I missed anyone, pls let me know.
Plenty of spare boards available spinning
decaying.sine
Got mine a few days ago! Thanks!
FetidEye
i just finished my 1st one (out of 2) .. it works fantastic and sounds incredible!!! looks very nice on my scope too..
at audiorates it makes very weird harmonics

i'll post some sounds later.
nangu
I'd buy at least 8 Euro panels if somebody wants to do a run..
synthcube
We have our first small batch of PCBs coming and plan a clarke68 panel run for this module plus kits and a few assembled modules, with gracious permissions from Andrewf.
themanthatwasused
synthcube
Please make a frac panel for this as well
help
synthcube
yes, that is the plan, both traditional jack and banana versions
andrewF
synthcube wrote:
We have our first small batch of PCBs coming and plan a clarke68 panel run for this module plus kits and a few assembled modules, with gracious permissions from Andrewf.


Go for it

I'm really happy you are so keen thumbs up

Thanks to all that have bought boards.
I will pack them over the weekend and post on Monday

edit - all packed but Monday is a public holiday, so Tuesday
themanthatwasused
synthcube
that's so cool of you looking after the fracdom!
screaming goo yo
It's peanut butter jelly time! nanners
frozenkore
synthcube wrote:
We have our first small batch of PCBs coming and plan a clarke68 panel run for this module plus kits and a few assembled modules, with gracious permissions from Andrewf.


Awesome! Guess I don't have to order my FPE then thumbs up
synthcube
themanthatwasused wrote:
synthcube
that's so cool of you looking after the fracdom!
screaming goo yo
It's peanut butter jelly time! nanners


i may end up with gobs of leftover frac modules in my shop, but I can think of worse fates applause
andrewF
boards shipped:
very angry mobster 4
dmitri 4
clorax hurd 3 + 3 double neuron
fonik 4
jjsynth 4
photon 2
rosch 4
Dego 4
iL 4
falafelbiels 2
withakay 2
spotta 4
rowman 4
pre55ure2
macumbista 4
synchromesh 4
limpmeat 4
transistor logic 2
synthcube 10

not shipped:
nangu - on hold awaiting order update hyper

If you have paid and are not on the list please pm me.
macumbista
4 boards arrived in Berlin yesterday. Danke schön!!!!
iL
4 boards arrived in hamburg. Guinness ftw!
synchromesh
4 boards arrived in England yesterday. Thanks again! nanners SlayerBadger!
spotta
synchromesh wrote:
4 boards arrived in England yesterday. Thanks again! nanners SlayerBadger!

Snap It's peanut butter jelly time!
falafelbiels
3 boards arrived in Rotterdan hmmm.....
falafelbiels
Whoops, edited away hihi

Supposed to be a pm...
rowman
Got mine too, cheers
rosch
got mine this week too, thank you Andrew
dmitri
got em in freaky frisco. thanks !
jjsynth
Got them here in Switzerland, thanks.
oljud
This is so cool. I want some if there are still any left/is another run.

how would this work with video? I'd be interested anyway, just curious.
andrewF
oljud wrote:
This is so cool. I want some if there are still any left/is another run.


Lots of boards left, just pm me

oljud wrote:
how would this work with video? I'd be interested anyway, just curious.

I haven't tried, it would be interesting.....maybe use a faster op amp, perhaps the TLC074 with a lower power supply voltage? creatorlars or daverj will know.
oljud
Cool! I'll have to think how many I want. I'm thinking eight... but that depends if you're planning to do the dual neuron ones too?

:-)
andrewF
I will be getting some more double neuron PCBs in the next few months as I need more for myself.

Should point out, costwise it is about the same to get 2 neuron/diff rect PCBs compared to a single double neuron. Plus you get the added bonus of the difference rectifiers, which I find to be incredibly useful and versatile little circuits.
falafelbiels
andrewF wrote:
...as I need more for myself.


Have you started eating neurons Andrew?
What are you up to with all these things man?
andrewF
falafelbiels wrote:

What are you up to with all these things man?


world domination Dalek
oljud
Oh, if the price is almost the same I don't see the point in the double ones.

think think think
otoskope
Interesting stuff. So much happens here I can't follow it all. Thanks oljud for telling me about it...
/Palle
synthcube
my little package of pcbs arrived yesterday to get started on prototypes for frac and motm smile

cant wait
oljud
otoskope wrote:
Interesting stuff. So much happens here I can't follow it all. Thanks oljud for telling me about it...
/Palle


thumbs up w00t Guinness ftw!
grilojoe
Sorry to resurrect an old thread, but are these PCB's still available?
andrewF
yes
pm or
KNYST
Interesting designs. I have some simple queries...

Can the Difference Rectifier be used as a common rectifier, as in: a single bipolar signal in -> fully rectified (plus and/or minus) out?

If no signal goes into the Neuron, will it be able to generate offset?
andrewF
If there is nothing on the inputs of the neuron, you can adjust the knobs to get a DC signal from approx -10V to +5V on the output.

If you put a bipolar signal on one of the negative inputs of the diff-rect you get the inverted pos and neg components on the appropriate outputs, see pics (input signal is the uppermost trace). So not quite a common rectifier but almost hihi
Bottom pic is with different freq tri waves on the +ve and -ve inputs
KNYST
Cool! Thanks Guinness ftw!
kurodama
I guess you've all seen this by now, but just in case:
I'm making a panel for this PCB, a dual one (for two PCBs) and I'm almost ready to go into production.
more info here: https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=90763&highlight=

Here's a preview:
mOBiTh
are the PCBs still available please?

I thought I ordered 4 but now I'm not sure?? hmmm.....
andrewF
mOBiTh wrote:
are the PCBs still available please?



yep still got boards w00t
synchromesh
kurodama wrote:
I guess you've all seen this by now, but just in case:


I hadn't seen it - thanks for the pointer! thumbs up
knob_alchemist
I'm in doubt to build this module....curiosity: is possibile with this circuits to have even results similar to a Wogglebug???
andrewF
if you mean - can you get semi-random mad-as-batshit CVs coming out of it.....well yes you can. The diff-rects would be best for that, depending what signals you input.

The wogglebug is a completely different circuit though.
kurodama
here's my latest build.
I might have some for sale soon.



yan6
Oh I hope its not too late for the panel

Edit: argh sold out very frustrating
synthcube
We do still carry some of the clarke68 euro panels for this module in both a single and dual version, if that helps 8_)
yan6
Can someone describe how the switch on the synthcube/Clarke68 panel is supposed to be wired.

Also, my pcb board has 3 'i' inputs, I take it this is a newer version and the 100k for the third input in now on the pcb?

thanks in advance
andrewF
yan6 wrote:

Also, my pcb board has 3 'i' inputs, I take it this is a newer version and the 100k for the third input in now on the pcb?

yes, the newer version of the PCB has 3 inputs and does not need the flying resistor if using 3 inputs.
yan6 wrote:

Can someone describe how the switch on the synthcube/Clarke68 panel is supposed to be wired.

ummm hmmm..... I guesss Clarke68 knows for sure, but I assume wire the outputs of each neuron the the switch, say the centre pin, and then wire the lower pin of the switch to the 3rd input. So a SPST switch will do.
andrewF
Got some NLC Eurorack panels in stock
10hp AU$22 (approx US$19.50)
$5 shipping per order

Still got PCBs: AU$8 each

These are designed so the pots can be soldered onto the PCBs and then attached to the panel, so no need for brackets or wires to the pots and suitable for shallow cases.
CNC'd & screenprinted by Jemal in very fkn sunny WA

The pics are of the same panel, one outdoors in the shade, the other in my shed.
synthcube
happy to report that full kits for the neuron/diff are available now!

http://synthcube.com/cart/index.php?route=product/product&filter_name= neuron&product_id=444

thanks to andrew f for the collaboration and clarke robinson for the panel design.

dual euro kits and MOTM kits coming later this week
MacSynth
yan6 wrote:
Can someone describe how the switch on the synthcube/Clarke68 panel is supposed to be wired.


I second that question. My module is ready to be wired and I can't think of a logical way to wire the switch. The synthcube kits with the clarke68 panel come with two jacks for input and one SPDT-switch for each of the two neurons.
synthcube
We will come back with a diagram shortly
MacSynth
synthcube wrote:
We will come back with a diagram shortly

Great! It's peanut butter jelly time!
andrewF
MacSynth wrote:
yan6 wrote:
Can someone describe how the switch on the synthcube/Clarke68 panel is supposed to be wired.


I second that question. My module is ready to be wired and I can't think of a logical way to wire the switch. The synthcube kits with the clarke68 panel come with two jacks for input and one SPDT-switch for each of the two neurons.


I checked back thru Clarke's messages and found this -

Quote:

Idea here is the switch would bring the output of the other Neuron into the 'ext' input. If both switches are flipped, you've got a feedback loop
synthcube
take a look at this
its only a partial view for the switches and connections to EXT and O for the dual neuron

andrewF
I should point out:
if you have the PCBs with the 'ext in', there needs to be 100k resistors between the switches and the 'ext in' hole (see pic).
If you have the 3 input PCBs, no need to add the resistors
MacSynth
Thanks! Just saw this today. Guinness ftw!
flab
http://www.mouser.com/ProjectManager/ProjectDetail.aspx?AccessID=5545e b13b6
ablearcher
reviving the thread to post a song based around the neuron, recorded the melody the first weekend I got the thing built, I think it illustrates the taint tickling qualities well..

really simple melody from sh-101 sequencer running into the neuron along with the output of the vactrol pill and an envelope then fed into the cv input of the rubicon. I don't think any wiggling was involved, the neuron just kept flipping out and acting like jimi hendrix and setting the axe on fire.

drums from a tama techstar and a little bit of melody at the end from sh-101. some delay added to the neuron lead.

[soundcloud url="https://api.soundcloud.com/tracks/231914372" params="auto_play=false&hide_related=false&show_comments=true&show_use r=true&show_reposts=false&visual=true" width="100%" height="450" iframe="true" /]
andrewF
Very nice track

btw neurons are available like this now (no wiring!) -



with white pCB panel -

kurodama
That's a great upgrade! smile
maltemark
On the new PCB, what are the 400x markings for?
andrewF
1N4001 to 1N4004 diodes, they just protect against plugging in the power connector backwards and are not essential for the circuit.
maltemark
Thanks andrew!

I now got the first NLC build for me up and running. I think....! :) Things happen when inputting oscillators or CV into the three topmost ins at least! The bottommost in/out +/- parts are still kind of mysterious to me.

andrewF
maltemark wrote:
Thanks andrew!

I now got the first NLC build for me up and running. I think....! smile Things happen when inputting oscillators or CV into the three topmost ins at least! The bottommost in/out +/- parts are still kind of mysterious to me.



looks good
For the diff-rect, this page might help
http://www.sdiy.org/pinky/data/dif.html
unrecordings
I'm just building a double module from Neuron/Diff Rect boards sourced from Synthcube. I had a single version before but sold it because I wanted to build a dual version. Now the boards I have are slightly different - missing the link and seem to have an extra 1K resistor and an extra Neuron output. Don't suppose you have updated build docs or even just the schematic & board layout for this ?

edit - just realised this is the Version 3 board

apologies if this is covered somewhere, I'm trying to search the forum via the google workaround
andrewF
I guess you have a Clarke68 dual panel and 2 small PCBs that you need to wire to the jacks?

Don't worry about the link, no need anymore.

This thread has some discussion on wiring up these panels, haven't done one myself.
I found:



Schematic is in here, there may be more or fewer inputs and outputs on the PCBs you have, it doesn't really matter. From memory the single neuron Clarke68 panel had 2 outputs, so a resistor was placed on the PCB for this. I think the dual version just has one output per Neuron to the panel and the other goes to the switch.
If your PCBs have 3 inputs you do not need the add the 100k resistor shown the the picture above, as just use the one on the PCB. Only add 100k when wiring inputs to the 'EXT' tab
unrecordings
Nope two single V3 Neuron/Diff Rect boards - i'm building them into MOTM format so didn't get a pcb/panel bundle

I wasn't aware of the Clarke implementation so thanks for that - something to mull over - I might just make this into a 3U monster now
unrecordings
Actually, just a thought

The Neuron isn't restricted to 1/2/3 inputs is it ?
I mean, if I've some panel space, I could wire up say eight inputs with resistors to that Ext pad

Would too many inputs just turn the output to mush ?
(trying not to get too close to the tickling analogy here)
andrewF
unrecordings wrote:
Actually, just a thought

The Neuron isn't restricted to 1/2/3 inputs is it ?
I mean, if I've some panel space, I could wire up say eight inputs with resistors to that Ext pad

Would too many inputs just turn the output to mush ?
(trying not to get too close to the tickling analogy here)


That's right, just be sure to add a resistor to each input connected to EXT. You could try weighting if adding multiple extra inputs; use resistors of different values. Higher values means less effect, lower = greater.
100k is standard, so use 200k, 300k, etc.

I have always felt 3 inputs are enough but feel free to prove me conservative and unadventurous Chicken
unrecordings
Consider it a challenge
I'll be back in a few weeks - ran out of jacks, i've some on back order...
Crashlander42
very frustrating *Deleted! Wrong thread.
s'mores


saw this really corny joke on the internets but it got me thinking about the part on the left. what happens if you patch up neighborhoods of neurons like this? are there unexpected anomalies or do more consistent patterns approach?

w00t
andrewF
Generally the more neurons and the more patching - feedback and signals from various sources - the more complex the patterns coming out.

With these neurons, I think the most I have patched was 8.
I have a design for a 24 neuron module somewhere, VC-controlled synapses and whatall, should dig it out and finish it hmmm.....
s'mores
andrewF wrote:
Generally the more neurons and the more patching - feedback and signals from various sources - the more complex the patterns coming out.

With these neurons, I think the most I have patched was 8.
I have a design for a 24 neuron module somewhere, VC-controlled synapses and whatall, should dig it out and finish it hmmm.....


24 neurons? voltage control? you make the pcb, I'll buy it hihi
nevetsokyeron
I'm building the Neuron PCB from Modular Addict - and I'm a little confused about the markings for the 1N4148 diodes.

Want to confirm -- Is the dashed line there where I orient the black-ring (cathode) side of the diode?
andrewF
nevetsokyeron wrote:
I'm building the Neuron PCB from Modular Addict - and I'm a little confused about the markings for the 1N4148 diodes.

Want to confirm -- Is the dashed line there where I orient the black-ring (cathode) side of the diode?


Here you go:
nevetsokyeron
andrewF wrote:

Here you go:


Thanks!

FWIW - the board markings are kinda iffy *for me* without a loupe/magnifier

andrewF
nevetsokyeron wrote:


FWIW - the board markings are kinda iffy *for me* without a loupe/magnifier



Don't worry, you'll get used to it.

As for a magnifier, lucky you! I pretty much have one fused to my head; it is worn whenever I am soldering.
nevetsokyeron
andrewF wrote:


Don't worry, you'll get used to it.

As for a magnifier, lucky you! I pretty much have one fused to my head; it is worn whenever I am soldering.


lol Me too. I walk around the house all the time wearing my magnifier headband/visor thing (even hours after soldering).
nevetsokyeron
Finally got my panel and assembled the Neuron today. Yay!

Is there a good methodology for testing the DIFF-REC section? Or maybe a video showing what it does?

I'm still a little stumped on how to use that section. I've got a basic scope, but not sure what I should be getting.
andrewF
nevetsokyeron wrote:
Finally got my panel and assembled the Neuron today. Yay!

Is there a good methodology for testing the DIFF-REC section? Or maybe a video showing what it does?

I'm still a little stumped on how to use that section. I've got a basic scope, but not sure what I should be getting.


blue and yellow traces are inputs, pink is + output

nevetsokyeron
andrewF wrote:

blue and yellow traces are inputs, pink is + output

Cool! That totally tells me what it should be doing. we're not worthy

In this instance I'm guessing the inputs are (more or less) a saw wave (blue) and a triangle wave (yellow)? Are both of those inputs on the + side?

Should I get a similar output when on the - side?
andrewF
similar but not the same and mostly operating between 0 and -5V
Mood Organ
I'm working on a Neuron panel and I'm short by 1 Neuron/DiffRect PCB. It's the older version 2012 PCBs that I have. I wonder if anyone has an unused PCB that they'd be willing to sell to me?
andrewF
Is it the small PCB you have to wire up the jacks?
If so, I think I have a few in the back of a drawer somewhere. pm me.

Mood Organ
andrewF wrote:
Is it the small PCB you have to wire up the jacks?
If so, I think I have a few in the back of a drawer somewhere. pm me.


Sameness confirmed. PM sent. : )
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