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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Do you care about tuning?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Modular Synth General Discussion Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4  Next [all]

Is keeping sounds in tune with each other a focus when you wiggle?
Yes, always
43%
 43%  [ 143 ]
Only sometimes
46%
 46%  [ 153 ]
Never
10%
 10%  [ 35 ]
Total Votes : 331

Author Do you care about tuning?
Bogus
I'm curious how many on here would say they concern themselves with keeping their sounds in tune while they patch? Tuning being A 440Hz, 432Hz etc.
bkbirge
Yes about 90% of the time as most of my writing also involves other instruments. I need to be able to play well with pianos, basses, guitars, etc. The 10% covers either rhythmic unpitched stuff or solo modular patching which are both tons of fun but just not where I spend most of the time.
MA-CHEW!!
When I started wiggling no.

Now YES!

I realized early on that some modular takes I record can be useful for projects down the line. If they're out of tune not so much.

and..

Now I interface with an A4 and other instruments so tuning is necessary for me. w00t
z3r01
I usually tune it just so that the base note of my oscillators are either the same note, or belong to the same scale, then I'll patch a quantiser to the oscillators, just to keep things going. I'll then start de-tuning them, sometimes by a very minute amount, sometimes by a large amount.

The oscillators are often cross-modulated, so de-tuning them sounds more pleasing to my ears (pitch & FM ratios).
RetBody
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.
slpsys
RetBody wrote:
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.


curious, do you do this during setup, before the show, etc.? seems like during setup would be the most sensible time (bodies diffusing waves, etc), but seems like it could also be pretty time-consuming (as a complete n00b wiggler who hasn't tuned anything yet)
maudibe
Yes, the question could have been phrased slightly better - a lot of folk do tune but not to 440… tuning within the box is an example, just to make everything sits pretty.

However, as others have mentioned, if you envisage using other instruments or working with a recorded piece later then tuning can save a lot of time and frustration later.

It all depends ….
Jaspo
I tune to 130.8 (C3) or 261.6 (C4) and transpose with a quantizer. My first tune is after warmup and again right before I press record. I then tune as needed, usually after I stop for a break.

It really depends on if you are doing modal pieces or not. When I am being more experimental, the last thing I want to do is tune. Maybe sometimes octaves by ear.

Listening is critical. If something sounds wrong ... fix it. If it sounds right, keep going. If you doing more planning than listening, you might not ever know.
sgventil
I always tune to my rhodes thumbs up
arnoux
RetBody wrote:
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.


Very cool. Care to elaborate a bit?

Also, The Enemy of The Good sounds amazing..
Monobass
If I really like what I recorded... and then later down the line I can't get a second instrument to sit well with it.. then my opinion is it's a limitation of the second instrument that is the problem smile
jc3music
I always keep a plug in tuner running on my DAW. Even the fine tune controls can get bumped, or switching octaves throws off certain Osc's.
mritenburg
[quote="arnoux"]
RetBody wrote:
Very cool. Care to elaborate a bit.


Rectangular rooms (and rooms with parallel walls, ceilings, and floor) will cause certain reflected waves to reinforce themselves to create resonant peaks thus shaking the room at a given frequency. The frequencies at which this occurs depends on the room dimensions.

Of course, a room full of dancing people will dampen this effect on upper frequencies, but omni-directional low frequencies will remain.
arnoux
mritenburg thanks that's an amazing field to explore.
CDavis
If I play solo shows I don't tune to a tuner or use a quantizer. Everything is just tuned by ear to what sounds good in the room. If I'm playing with other instruments then I have a tuner set up. I really do enjoy playing untuned and unquantized. We are all used to hearing sounds that are out of normal tunings but most people don't get to hear music made in alien frequencies so it makes for a unique live experience.
sduck
I tune everything to the same pitch. And then leave it there. Sometimes for decades.

I'm not allowed to tell you what pitch it is though.
Leverkusen
Tuning kills dolphins - i care about dolphins!


Sorry, could not hold off. (hides)


I am just tuning everything so that it sounds pleasing - somtimes intervalls but cannot say which ones.

What does bother me is when I switch everything on in the morning and cannot get the tuning together again - it took me hours the last time. I thought it could have been something with harmonics due to filtering and PWM but I hardly got four sequences together again that fitted more than nicely the day before. Dead Banana
RetBody
slpsys wrote:
RetBody wrote:
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.


curious, do you do this during setup, before the show, etc.? seems like during setup would be the most sensible time (bodies diffusing waves, etc), but seems like it could also be pretty time-consuming (as a complete n00b wiggler who hasn't tuned anything yet)


I do it during soundcheck. I'll find a good solid room mode by sweeping a sine, and then tune the other oscillators to unisons, octaves, and/or fifths above that. I find unfiltered saw waves are the easiest to use when tuning by ear.
RetBody
arnoux wrote:
RetBody wrote:
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.


Very cool. Care to elaborate a bit?

Also, The Enemy of The Good sounds amazing..


Thank you! That recording was made with a pair of omnidirectional mics in a reverberation chamber we use for sound power testing at my job (I work in acoustics). All of the stereo information comes from the two mics picking up different peaks and nulls of the room modes because of their different positions.

mritenburg has the right idea. When you have a wavelength that fits an even number of times in a room dimension, the reflections reinforce each other. These frequencies are called the "modes" of the room, and a strong signal at a modal frequency creates a standing wave between the walls. Walking around when this is happening can be an intense experience, because you move between the peaks and nulls of the standing wave and can really experience the physical shape of the wave.

mritenburg is also right that people are too absorptive for this to work at mid and high frequencies, all the meat damps the modal resonances. To get around this, I work with very, very low frequencies and perform through a 6 x 15" stack with a 2000 watt amplifier.
arnoux
RetBody many many thanks for the explenation, I definitely want to try this.
J3RK
I like to have gear that can be tuned well, but it completely depends on what I'm working on as to whether I tune it to a note/scale/etc. If I'm just "FMing" around making bells, bongos, blips, and anything else that might start with a b like that, then I don't tune anything. (other than maybe to get the FM sounding the way I want)

Most of the time if I'm being melodic, I tune things relatively within the same system, but still not to a specific note/scale.

Usually, if I want something to be in tune at the note/scale level, I'm playing a different instrument. Though on rare occasions I have actually tuned my modular to match other instruments/notes/scales.

For me, the modular is for all the in-betweens, out-beyonds, down-unders, etc. most of the time. I can always sit at the piano for the other things. (though it's not all mutually exclusive by any means)
makro
when i am playing around, testing things out, creating new stuff, i forget about tuning. otherwise it wouldnt be spontaneous nor creative.
when i record, i let my modular warm up for at least half an hour, then tune a master vco (TT z3000 in my case via built in freq. display) and all subsequently used vcos by ear. sometimes i tune with the guitar tuner of my wife. Rockin' Banana!
most of the time i tune by ear because slightly imperfect tunings do add sooo much richness.
Leverkusen
RetBody wrote:
arnoux wrote:
RetBody wrote:
When I play live, I tune to room modes to maximize sound pressure. So, tuning is critical to my playing, but I'm tuning to an architectural reference, not A440.


Very cool. Care to elaborate a bit?

Also, The Enemy of The Good sounds amazing..


Thank you! That recording was made with a pair of omnidirectional mics in a reverberation chamber we use for sound power testing at my job (I work in acoustics). All of the stereo information comes from the two mics picking up different peaks and nulls of the room modes because of their different positions.

mritenburg has the right idea. When you have a wavelength that fits an even number of times in a room dimension, the reflections reinforce each other. These frequencies are called the "modes" of the room, and a strong signal at a modal frequency creates a standing wave between the walls. Walking around when this is happening can be an intense experience, because you move between the peaks and nulls of the standing wave and can really experience the physical shape of the wave.

mritenburg is also right that people are too absorptive for this to work at mid and high frequencies, all the meat damps the modal resonances. To get around this, I work with very, very low frequencies and perform through a 6 x 15" stack with a 2000 watt amplifier.


Great to hear this! I am just about to start preparing a live installation in Summer and wondered if it would work to get the tuning related to the room (it's in a kind of basement with nice concrete walls) and work with the modes. And yes, The Enemy Of The Good is great! I am just listening again with an ear for workflow you used.
filtermod
I tune most of the time. I use a variety of instruments other than the modular, and I have some collaborative projects, so I like to have everything play nice together. I also do sound design for other musicians and they generally like me to work within specific scales. If I'm working on something that is modular only I just tune by ear until I like how everything sounds together. That being said, I enjoy dissonance too depending on the execution.
bkbirge
Cool approach on the room modes. My gut level approach would be to tune them out as much as possible to avoid the reinforcement.
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