Plan B Model 15s or Cwejman VCO 2RM

Cwejman, Livewire, TipTop Audio, Doepfer etc... Get your euro on!

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timmah
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Plan B Model 15s or Cwejman VCO 2RM

Post by timmah » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:14 am

Hi fellow synth nerds,

I've been doing a bit of research on oscillators for my 1st small modular synth. I've been using software synths for years and have started a small euro-modular, which at the moment has a filter, EG, LFOs, external input by doepfer.

I need some oscillators, and have narrowed it down to these two.
from what i've they both track very well over a wide range, which is important to me as i'll being doing mostly tonal basses, lead synth sort of sounds at first.

How much of a disadvantage is not having separate outputs for each waveform on the cwejman? also it doesn't seem to have a 'linear' FM input? Is the plan B more suited to fx sounds and 'art' music?

any comments, experiences with either oscillator would be much appreciated.

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felix
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Post by felix » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:31 am

I've heard a lot of people complain about tracking problems with the M15. I've never hooked mine up to a keyboard, so I can't comment.

I don't think I've heard anyone complain about the cwejman.

I really like having independent waveform outputs, I don't think I would want an osc that didn't offer that. *However*, given the choice between 1 oscillator with multiple outputs and 2 oscillators with ring mod, I'll take the 2 oscs any day.

I really like my M15 and it has a very nice sound to it, particularly the sawtooth, which sounds very "woody", and goes perfectly with the M13 low pass gates. The PWM is nice too, although the range is larger that most, so large that the ends of the range output no sound at all. You can get some neat sounds utilizing this, but it basically means you always need to attenuate the input voltage to the PWM.

If you are looking to do more "traditional" synth stuff, played via keyboard and what-not, I would probably suggest the cwejman, just because I have heard so many people complain about tracking or calibration issues with the M15.

If memory serves, rossg should have some good input. I believe he sold his M15 and went with the 2RM.
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timmah
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Post by timmah » Thu Jul 24, 2008 12:34 am

just to clarify I would be getting either two M15s or one VCO 2rm

the extra space that two of the M15s take up wouldnt be an issue at this stage.

cheers for your comments.

timmah
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Post by timmah » Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:06 am

or, to put it another way, if you were starting a new modular, what oscillators would you buy and why?

:guinness:

any comments much appreciated before I throw down a huge amount of cash on something i've never tried :)

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D/A A/D
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Post by D/A A/D » Thu Jul 24, 2008 8:46 am

If HP and cash wasn't an issue:

Euro - 2x Livewire AFG or maybe a AFG and Zeroscillator...

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Post by thermionicjunky » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:09 am

I'll have to agree with D/AA/D, but I might actually end up with an AFG or two depending on the future of Livewire. Some people have no trouble with the Model 15. It's the discrete exponential converter that causes trouble, but is also responsible for it's FM sound. It's really important to calibrate it in the case you'll be using, with the power supply you'll be using and after the temperature has stabilized. People love or hate the Cwejmans like they love or hate MOTM. Stable and sterile seem to be interchangeable. I'd like to have them all.

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Post by tragedybysyntax » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:35 am

I"m selling my Blacet VCO and buying an AFG (which I have shawn snagging one for me since someone cancelled their order) and I have a ZO on order for the end of summer when they restock. HAPPY MOTHERFUCKER I WILL BE COME FALL!!! AN AFG AND A ZO!!! WOWWWWWWWW! :)

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Post by D/A A/D » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:41 am

tragedybysyntax wrote:I"m selling my Blacet VCO and buying an AFG (which I have shawn snagging one for me since someone cancelled their order) and I have a ZO on order for the end of summer when they restock. HAPPY MOTHERFUCKER I WILL BE COME FALL!!! AN AFG AND A ZO!!! WOWWWWWWWW! :)
bastardo!

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Chuck E. Jesus
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Post by Chuck E. Jesus » Thu Jul 24, 2008 10:58 am

i have the VCO2RM and think it's great, excellent built quality, packs a lot into a small package...if you are looking for something that tracks well you won't be disappointed, i think it makes a great first pair of oscs...i also have a pair of Doepfer A-110s which have separate wave outs, so it isn't an issue...i also have the Doepfer A-196 PLL which tracks to another osc, and the VCO2RM excels at this task (i assume because it's so stable), i can get a variety of rich tones with this combo...looking forward to the Plan B Wave Splicer with these, should be pretty wacky...stable/sterile isn't an issue for me, there's lots of ways to dirty it up...to sum up: zero regrets w/ the VCO2RM...

felix wrote:If memory serves, rossg should have some good input. I believe he sold his M15 and went with the 2RM.
yes, i had a Plan B osc for a short period of time but i traded it in for the Cwejman...i couldn't get the M15 to track even an octave and was unable to successfully calibrate it...in all fairness Peter G was unavailable to help (it was trade show season i believe) and Analogue Haven didn't have another M15 in stock to try...tracking was important to me as my A-110s weren't tracking well (got one working pretty good since, going to do some mods on the other at some point, ain't racked up)...i really liked the features and wide range of the M15 and would consider trying another at some point...

hope this helps...

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Post by felix » Thu Jul 24, 2008 1:53 pm

timmah wrote:or, to put it another way, if you were starting a new modular, what oscillators would you buy and why?

:guinness:

any comments much appreciated before I throw down a huge amount of cash on something i've never tried :)
Oh, it's AFG all the way then. Reasons:
1) "Animated" Saw and Pulse outputs (which are separate from the standard saw and pulse outs)
2) Dedicated sub octave waveform output, switchable between saw/square
3) Two FM inputs, each switchable between exp/linear
4) Wide frequency range, slow LFO, all they way through audio range
5) Matter / Anti-Matter modes. Anti-Matter mode alters the shape of all the waveforms. It's unknown the full depth of possibilities of this. Forthcoming Livewire Flux Capacitor module will say for sure.
6) 9 total independent waveform outputs
7) It looks fucking HAWT! 8)

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Post by sgnhh » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:09 pm

I have one Plan B M15 and (since I have no interest in keyboarding the modular up) I love it. Can't really imagine going with a sterile sounding VCO, personally.

That said, I also have an AFG preordered. Had I not jumped on the AFG, I would plan to buy a second Plan B VCO. But it's going to just be the M15 and AFG for a while.

And apparently the AFGs are imminent. SPERM!

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REwire
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Post by REwire » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:27 pm

My fav Osc's are the Model 15 and the ASystems RS-95e. I had a Cwejman OSC-2RM for a while but got bored of it. I'll keep the top two forever but also have an AFG coming in a day ot two so we'll see if that becomes #1.

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Post by D/A A/D » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:49 pm

REwire wrote:My fav Osc's are the Model 15 and the ASystems RS-95e. I had a Cwejman OSC-2RM for a while but got bored of it. I'll keep the top two forever but also have an AFG coming in a day ot two so we'll see if that becomes #1.
You like them BETTER than your 200's??? :eek:
Last edited by D/A A/D on Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:58 pm, edited 1 time in total.

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REwire
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Post by REwire » Thu Jul 24, 2008 4:56 pm

D/A A/D wrote:
REwire wrote:My fav Osc's are the Model 15 and the ASystems RS-95e. I had a Cwejman OSC-2RM for a while but got bored of it. I'll keep the top two forever but also have an AFG coming in a day ot two so we'll see if that becomes #1.
You like them BETTER than you 200's??? :eek:
The Buchla's are unique but not capable of fat Pulses (+PWM) and the 259 has a decent but not amazing Saw. It's the Sine + Waveshaper that gives the 259 it's signature sound. BTW, I just sold the 261e. I really wanted a 259e.

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Post by Roycie Roller » Thu Jul 24, 2008 5:44 pm

I'd be really interested in hearing about the differences between the 259e & 261e if you feel like sharing your thoughts :)

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Chuck E. Jesus
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Post by Chuck E. Jesus » Thu Jul 24, 2008 6:30 pm

ross g wrote:i also have the Doepfer A-196 PLL which tracks to another osc, and the VCO2RM excels at this task (i assume because it's so stable), i can get a variety of rich tones with this combo...
no one asked, but i made a little example of this...i like how the PLL can be set to teeter between stable and unstable, and seems to work well with the VCO2RM...(not changing anything, just tuned into the "sweet spot")

http://upload.muffwiggler.com/ROSS/PLLOOP.mp3

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