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What outboard would you consider essential
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Production Techniques Goto page Previous  1, 2, 3, 4  Next [all]
Author What outboard would you consider essential
Gringo Starr
felixer wrote:
Gringo Starr wrote:
If Slayer recorded an album and used a Curve Bender

but they wouldn't !


Of course they wouldn't. But that wasn't my point.

BugBrand wrote:
Does 'experience' count as outboard?


No. But that definitely falls under the essential category.
felixer
Adminius wrote:
the fact that the album was produced with no compression at all.

depends what your sources are. for synth/drummachines you usually don't need compression. but a not-so-great bassplayer will sound a lot better in a bandcontext if his/her levels aren't all over the place ... then again, a good bassplayer might not need any ...
Adminius wrote:

Can someone tell me whether an analogue dual-trace oscilloscope counts as 'outboard' gear?

very useful piece of kit. great to see distortion and stereo imaging. goes under the categorie of 'metering'. good to think about this for a moment: what is '0dB' in your system anyway? just for fun compare the meters on different pieces of gear. exactly when is that red led blinking? and what does that mean sound-wise?
Gringo Starr wrote:
felixer wrote:
Gringo Starr wrote:
If Slayer recorded an album and used a Curve Bender

but they wouldn't !
Of course they wouldn't. But that wasn't my point.

but that is exactly the point: there isn't one device that is essential or fits everything. no matter how fancy/rare/expensive it is. so you'll always end up with a selection of different things. mix&match ...
grillo
Yeah I'm also in the 'a good compressor is not necessary' for electronic music. Granted it looks cool and it can give a polished sound, but I mean it's not the same thing as using it on let's say a real drum kit or bass guitar, where it can tame the performance and save some takes.

I think in general is a bit of a crutch. I've seen plenty of tutorial videos where big name electronic producers add a touch of compression to the kick playing four to the floor with not even a smidge of velocity variation. It's true that it changes the sound, but at that point it's basically the same thing as picking another sample for the kick, slightly tweaking the envelope or printing that effect and using that as a sample.
stk
Nothing is necessary.

But, it is often desirable. And fun. Both of which are necessary.

So there you go.
Ashi
my "must" haves:

- decent mixer w/ EQ (ZED10, too small very soon)
- compressor (2x3632 I picked up for 30$)
- delay (EHX Memory Boy)
- reverb (not yet! well Octatrack has some)
- some distortion / saturation (MF Drive)
- filter (MF Drive)

basically enough to get the basic mix & effects going without having to turn to the laptop, once it's recorded you can still play with EQ & effetcs ITB to make it really work. This is essential for me workflow wise not so much soundwise...
disp
EQ is definitely something that can not yet be done properly ITB.
The same goes for reverb.
And of course preamps.

But I guess one of the most essential things when going OTB/hybrid is a proper converter.
(Modular-)synth sound is so rich in harmonic content and frequencies. There's so much that can and will be lost going through subpar converters.
stk
giggle @ above

Not to turn this into a hard vs soft thread, but reverb is digital. Does it matter what box it is in? Not in my experience, it's all in the algo.

..unless you are talking springs, in which case I agree that afaik there are no really good sounding spring plugins.

Also, EQ. Many, many would disagree with you thumbs up
seeasound
Adminius wrote:
... but I'm with Daft Punk on this one, their 'Random Access Memories' album won almost every award going in 2013, mainly due to the fact that the album was produced with no compression at all.


Not true at all

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul13/articles/daft-punk.htm
Hainbach
My bare minimum is decent or interesting mics, good preamps, bucket brigade delays and tape echoes. A tape machine is not essential but it helps getting a more defined sound going from the start.

My portable setup reflects this, too: always with me is a Minifooger Delay and Marantz PMD cassette recorder, combined with a Babyface and Gefell 691 mic.
Gringo Starr
seeasound wrote:
Adminius wrote:
... but I'm with Daft Punk on this one, their 'Random Access Memories' album won almost every award going in 2013, mainly due to the fact that the album was produced with no compression at all.


Not true at all

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul13/articles/daft-punk.htm


That album massively sucked anyways. IMO of course. So if that's the case then give me some damn compressors!!!!
disp
stk wrote:
giggle @ above

Not to turn this into a hard vs soft thread, but reverb is digital. Does it matter what box it is in? Not in my experience, it's all in the algo.

..unless you are talking springs, in which case I agree that afaik there are no really good sounding spring plugins.

Also, EQ. Many, many would disagree with you thumbs up


Of course reverb is digital. I said ITB reverb is not as good as OTB. I didn't say digital reverb per se.

The sound is NOT only in the algo. Best example: Lexicon. The Native plugin bundle sounds nothing like the real boxes.
You can't turn something like the Lexicon 200 into a plugin. The real thing will always sound better. It's mainly in the converters, but also a bit in other components - I'm no technician so I don't know the details.

Or why is there no Bricasti M7 plugin yet? There's more to it than "it's only algos".

As for EQ: sure many would disagree. But give them a good analog EQ and let them compare. Digital EQ doesn't behave right, as in: doesn't sound as natural. Especially when boosting frequencies of course. But even when cutting: digital EQ curves just sound a bit unnatural, plastic-y.
Of course digital EQ is good. Even sufficient for most. But analog is still much better and preferable.
Adminius
Gringo Starr wrote:
seeasound wrote:
Adminius wrote:
... but I'm with Daft Punk on this one, their 'Random Access Memories' album won almost every award going in 2013, mainly due to the fact that the album was produced with no compression at all.


Not true at all

http://www.soundonsound.com/sos/jul13/articles/daft-punk.htm


That album massively sucked anyways. IMO of course. So if that's the case then give me some damn compressors!!!!


I stand corrected.

Some compression was used, apparently.

But you're wrong about RAM being sucky! IMHO hihi
maruwan
NOBODY MENTIONS A TUNER ?! angry angry angry

hihi
24dB
If I had to choose just one of my hardware outboard rack units, it would definitely be the Eventide H3000B.

Not just because it sounds better than anything else to my ears, but also because, err, it's the only outboard rack gear I own at all. =]
BendingBus
bratley wrote:
For those that work OTB, what outboard compressors, EQs etc would you say are essential for electronic music production...


If you ask people with decades of experience producing records you are going to see the same names coming up on "must have" lists. The classics that have proven themselves over time, and work on all genres, which is why they are classics...

API550 EQs, Neve EQ, Pultecs, LA2A, LA3A, 1176, SSL buss compressors, harmonizers, plate reverbs, etc.
unclewoody
Did anyone mention the most obvious - good quality monitors that you know! You can have a bajillion dollar collection of compressors, eqs, etc, but if you can't hear what they are actually doing, it kinda is pointless.
rans53
geezers? Do you call your mother a geezer?
sam
bratley wrote:
For those that work OTB, what outboard compressors, EQs etc would you say are essential for electronic music production


A good reverb is really something. I love old Lexicon PCM and old Sony.
For EQ those on the Soundcraft 600 are good enough for me. They boost and cut with taste to me.
I'd like a stereo parametric sometimes for specific frequency search but it makes me work more on my skills into the sampler/synth/drumbox. That's better in the end.

I love compression too but honestly, i uses it mostly in a bad way and cannot afford what i'd love (SSL type, Vari-mu type).
Actually an oldschool cheap DBX166 (not XL) fit perfectly its role for parrallel kick compression. Good tool.
Was lucky to use an 1176 clone, a Dyna-mite years ago and this one is just as good -within its limits- for some jobs: giving some crack by saturating the limiter and help the kick sing with the sub for example.
Black Medicine
For production? A SOLID set of monitors, a clean amp, at least Apogee interface, my macbook, a couple of controllers, my bass, coffee, cigarettes, and time alone. The other stuff, mixer, synths, processing, etc., while nice to have, are not essential to my being able to create and record music. *shrugs* That said, I generally also travel with my Mopho because a little analog monosynth is always cool for ideas, when I get stuck.
clusterchord
following could clasify as essential outboard to me:

delays - analog (dm300, srs56), and tape (re-201)
character reverbs - lexicon pcm 70
larger than life reverbs - lexicon 300 & 224X
multifx space reverbs - eventide orville
analog fx - mutator, elkorus, mxr126

preamp - great river
comp - 1176 or a clone of it. i'm still borrowing it, but want to have one of my own, probably the hairball audio clone of blackface. this comp works on wide range of sources ,.. vocals, guitars, synths, drums. it be nice to have few of them on mixdown..


PS yes great monitoring and acoustic treatment are crucial. but don't think that was the object of OP question.
stk
I've used a lot of stuff, from high end to low end, hardware, software, wetware, middleware.. In the end it's all the same; whatever inspires you to start and finish a piece of music is essential, and everything else is guff grin

Im my observations, purists are often those types who get nothing done at all seriously, i just don't get it
mousegarden
This is difficult, nothing is essential, really, unless you've got a specific job to do, and you've been told to "do this"
There's a lot to said for being thrown into a situation where you have to make a go of it with whatever you've been given, the burden of making endless choices then goes out the window, because you don't have any choices, that's why having very little money can be a godsend, it stops you running around in circles wondering what to buy.
It also depends on what music you make, I make synth dominated music with lots of reverb and delay, simple description, but accurate, so I need a synth (which in reality could be anything) and a reverb and delay unit, I like the spaces that Brian Eno and Daniel Lanois create in their music which I like to copy, so that narrows my choices, simple, job done. When you break it down like this it all becomes a lot easier and clearer to see what's actually happening and what you need. I don't know what every effects unit sounds like for christs sake ? Eno likes it, so it's good enough for me, I'll get a Lexicon, fine, Lanois likes Prime Time's, fine, bung that in the shopping trolley. This is always how I've bought gear, and it always works out.
felixer
stk wrote:

Im my observations, purists are often those types who get nothing done at all seriously, i just don't get it

they post a lot on forums Mr. Green
stk
felixer wrote:
stk wrote:

Im my observations, purists are often those types who get nothing done at all seriously, i just don't get it

they post a lot on forums Mr. Green


Well I guess that counts as something.. I wouldn't know really, muffs is the only place I frequent after I swore off Gearslitz as the festering, fart sniffing, mysoginist man child cave that it is zombie
mousegarden
I'm not getting anything done at all, and I'm posting a lot on this forum, but do I care ? No.
Inspiration comes and goes, we have no control over it, down time is good, if it's that important you'll hit that record button, if not then carry on posting.
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