verbos 254e

Discussing some incredible modules that don't quite fit into the other forum categories.

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verbos 254e

Post by solaris » Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:29 am

[video][/video]
▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈□ □ □ □ □ □ □ □ □ t r a n s f e k t i o n ▔▔▔▔╲▂▂▁▂▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈▂▁▁
▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈□ □ ▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈□ ▂̵̶̵̥̤̳̤̇̈̄̅̈▔╲▂̥̥̊̊̊̊▂ ‬::.:::.h++p://z.x-xx---x.info □ □ □ □ □ □ □ □ □‬

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amnesia
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Post by amnesia » Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:46 am

wow nice! When is it for sale?

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Kent
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Post by Kent » Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:46 am

That's DougCL's YouTube account. I asked about what is going on here, but have yet to receive a reply.

Verbos gets 'e' code?
Doug applies 'e' code to a 254V?
Verbos sold the design to BEMI and Doug is testing it?

Possibilities, possibilities...

Note that it lacks the typical " & Associates " indicator of either manufacturer.

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snufkin
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Post by snufkin » Mon Feb 22, 2016 10:22 am

very interested in this as the two official options don't quite get me what I want.

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Post by mirf59 » Mon Feb 22, 2016 12:11 pm

OK. I'll play the dumbass. Are these just CV mixers? If yes, what does "e" get you?

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Post by ttown23 » Mon Feb 22, 2016 5:05 pm

mirf59 wrote:OK. I'll play the dumbass. Are these just CV mixers? If yes, what does "e" get you?
The "e" gets you preset storage :party:
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Minimoog56
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Post by Minimoog56 » Mon Feb 22, 2016 8:12 pm

:guinness: Cool - yes I agree - I am good with my 254v as is but how cool that someone is now breaking the code! Imagine a P/Re or a 258e, or a real 259e! Imagine if we could shrink an analog 259r and make it an "e" module with digital controls and memory but analog core!
Beatniks and Bongos/Bagels and Bongos/Buchlas and Bongos...

de gustibus....

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amnesia
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Post by amnesia » Fri Mar 04, 2016 12:33 am

https://soundcloud.com/dougcl/254e-pulses-and-transpose

Does Dougcl work for Buchla or is this a indie release?

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Minimoog56
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Post by Minimoog56 » Sat Mar 05, 2016 6:07 pm

Doug has been out of Buchla for a while now. Glad to see he is back with a great contribution to the format!
Beatniks and Bongos/Bagels and Bongos/Buchlas and Bongos...

de gustibus....

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krv
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Post by krv » Mon Mar 07, 2016 10:05 am

snufkin wrote:very interested in this as the two official options don't quite get me what I want.
same here :tu:

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Post by vgermuse » Thu Apr 14, 2016 1:33 pm

A little update here. Yes, DougCL is designing and has built a couple prototypes. He's still tweaking it, but I was lucky enough to beta test the first prototype. It is awesome! Amazing that all the patches can be saved.
So here are some roughly shot videos, which were originally just for my personal archive, to show some of its possibilities. So far, it hasn't crashed or bricked :-) :party:

[video][/video]

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Post by mirf59 » Thu Apr 14, 2016 4:53 pm

vgermuse wrote:A little update here. Yes, DougCL is designing and has built a couple prototypes. He's still tweaking it, but I was lucky enough to beta test the first prototype. It is awesome! Amazing that all the patches can be saved.
So here are some roughly shot videos, which were originally just for my personal archive, to show some of its possibilities. So far, it hasn't crashed or bricked :-) :party:

[video][/video]
That’s really cool. Is there any simple way to keep the notes in key? (I can hear the cries of agony now…diatonic music on a Buchla?!! How dare you, sir!)

The third step in a major scale has a flat 9, so the stacking of fifths you’ve got going on there (I think) won’t stay true to key if the 251e sequence contains the note a major third up from the root. Of course, the 7th step up also has a flat 5, so same issue there, but on the first fifth in your stack as opposed to the second.

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Post by vgermuse » Thu Apr 14, 2016 5:34 pm

mirf59 wrote:
That’s really cool. Is there any simple way to keep the notes in key? (I can hear the cries of agony now…diatonic music on a Buchla?!! How dare you, sir!)

The third step in a major scale has a flat 9, so the stacking of fifths you’ve got going on there (I think) won’t stay true to key if the 251e sequence contains the note a major third up from the root. Of course, the 7th step up also has a flat 5, so same issue there, but on the first fifth in your stack as opposed to the second.
Wow! Good ear! Frankly, I was going very quickly and just finding stuff I liked as I tried to make up patches to test this cool unit. These were actually personal videos to help remind me what the heck I've done. That said, I hear you and when I get time I'll explore your keen observation, "Is there any simple way to keep the notes in key?" and report back. Also, I know Doug is a perfectionist and, as mentioned before, "he's still tweaking it."

Thanks mirf59! You, and everyone, keep the oberservation, comments and ideas coming.

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Post by ttown23 » Thu Apr 14, 2016 6:56 pm

This is great.

I'm just trying to figure out something though. I thought that the "e" bus code was covered by BEMI? Is this being done in collaboration with BEMI, or do they not care?

Hate to point out the 300 lb gorilla in the room.... :ripbanana:
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Post by djangosfire » Fri Apr 15, 2016 1:23 am

:yay: BRAVO DougCL!! Thanks you for sharing the beta test patches Todd. Safe to say that the 254e would be a must-have for a preset 200e system :sb:
Started building a few Buchla 200 style modules again - Send a note if you are looking to have a specific module built! WTB: Vactrols.. seeking Excelitas or Vactec VTL5C3 & VTL5C3/2. Thank you - Hope your day is awesome!

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Post by snufkin » Fri Apr 15, 2016 2:50 am

Interested to hear how this works, what does the preset manager see this as ? Not sure how the protocol works and if each module calls it's name and then the number of preset variables or if the preset manager can only talk to already "known" modules.

also interested to hear about rights etc, I heard talk long ago of the source code eventually being accessible to third parties but not sure if that was ever serious or worked out.

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rayce
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Post by rayce » Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:23 am

Total speculation on my part, I have no idea what DougCL did.

The 200e modules store their presets on each module.

Thus if you could read the i2c data from the preset manager that says SAVE, advance, decrement, and LOAD X where X is the number of a preset you could come up with an e module.

I'm guessing for those that know such things it would not be that hard to pull the i2c bus data when the above commands are entered and program a chip to use those individual data commands.

The module wouldn't have to talk with the preset manager at all. It would just sit and listen for those bytes of data and then change its onboard presets accordingly.

Only drawback is one would not be able to save the presets to a card.

That being said sign me up for one. Looks great. Wonder if it is still all analog as far as signal path goes? No stepping?

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Post by Reed » Fri Apr 15, 2016 8:56 am

That guy asked Mark Verbos for permission to use the 254 design, and Mark said no. I'm sure the guy would argue that because Mark's design evolved from Buchla's 256 and 257 (the originals, not the limited "e" versions) it's a moot point.

With the exception of the straight clone 258v, Mark's modules have all been helpful extensions to expand the usability of Buchla systems. The 243 pulser takes Buchla's 242 and gives it the power and flexibility of the 246. The 247v is a rock-solid, performance-friendly half-Marf (with better glide). His harmonic oscillator takes the original Buchla 148 wave-folding extravaganza and incorporates the most useful features of the 296 (which, for some reason, Buchla discarded when he designed the e version).

Mark Verbos' 254v extends the Buchla voltage-mixer concept to daily usability. Each of the four sections was designed to replace what some of us were doing by daisy-chaining two sections of a 257. In that respect one 254v replaces four 257's, freeing up a ton of panel space. Also, the extra input gain makes it twice as useful as the original 256. Later in its evolution Mark added a negative voltage offset to deal with quirks in addressing original Buchla modules, especially the Marf.

The 254v is the culmination of years of brainstorming how to make a better voltage processor. The fact that someone put presets on it is a tribute and a compliment.

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Post by snufkin » Fri Apr 15, 2016 10:22 am

rayce wrote:Total speculation on my part, I have no idea what DougCL did.

The 200e modules store their presets on each module.

Thus if you could read the i2c data from the preset manager that says SAVE, advance, decrement, and LOAD X where X is the number of a preset you could come up with an e module.

I'm guessing for those that know such things it would not be that hard to pull the i2c bus data when the above commands are entered and program a chip to use those individual data commands.

The module wouldn't have to talk with the preset manager at all. It would just sit and listen for those bytes of data and then change its onboard presets accordingly.

Only drawback is one would not be able to save the presets to a card.

That being said sign me up for one. Looks great. Wonder if it is still all analog as far as signal path goes? No stepping?
that makes total sense, I hadn't given the inner working of the pre-set system a lot of thought, just marvelled at the pathways it opens up.
Reed wrote:That guy asked Mark Verbos for permission to use the 254 design, and Mark said no. I'm sure the guy would argue that because Mark's design evolved from Buchla's 256 and 257 (the originals, not the limited "e" versions) it's a moot point.
If that's true I hope that it's addressed before a general release

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Post by missingtwin » Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:02 pm

whaaaat?
a 254ve?
dougcl?

I miss dougcl around here. maybe he's here
under a different name.

thank you for the voltage processor
assessment reed, that was interesting.

my 254v is usually pack to the gills with
bananas, an "e" version would be a dream.
certainly interested.

the 256e is great but misses the ability to
process/mix pulses. I wonder how this 254ve
responds to pulse streams.

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Post by vgermuse » Sun Apr 17, 2016 2:50 pm

missingtwin wrote: I wonder how this 254ve
responds to pulse streams.
Doug has designed it to handle pulse streams which it does handlely.
I'll try to get out a demo tomorrow but here's the very first test I had sent to Doug
https://www.hightail.com/download/ZWJVT ... SnJtcXNUQw
:party:

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Post by ttown23 » Mon Apr 18, 2016 3:55 pm

Reed wrote: The 254v is the culmination of years of brainstorming how to make a better voltage processor. The fact that someone put presets on it is a tribute and a compliment.
From the user's point of view, I agree...

But then, there is the legal point of view? I'm not a lawyer, but it doesn't take an Esq at the end of my name to forsee that one could get into hot water quickly putting something out like this, when BEMI holds the intellectual property and ownership of the "e" standard.

Of course, everything is cool if this work was done under license from BEMI. Does anyone know the status of this? Has DougCL licensed "e" code from BEMI?
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Post by MATSmile » Mon Apr 18, 2016 6:54 pm

ttown23 wrote:
Reed wrote: The 254v is the culmination of years of brainstorming how to make a better voltage processor. The fact that someone put presets on it is a tribute and a compliment.
From the user's point of view, I agree...

But then, there is the legal point of view? I'm not a lawyer, but it doesn't take an Esq at the end of my name to forsee that one could get into hot water quickly putting something out like this, when BEMI holds the intellectual property and ownership of the "e" standard.

Of course, everything is cool if this work was done under license from BEMI. Does anyone know the status of this? Has DougCL licensed "e" code from BEMI?
I'm just wondering, what difference does it make to YOU?

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Post by missingtwin » Tue Apr 19, 2016 6:08 am

Thank you Todd for putting this
info up here.

Being able to process pulse streams is wonderful.

Often my 254v will have a cv sequence and a
pulse stream happening simultaneously and bouncing
between then directly to a 292 creates a very wide
range of articulations.

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Post by ttown23 » Tue Apr 19, 2016 12:40 pm

MATSmile wrote: I'm just wondering, what difference does it make to YOU?
Well, as a prospective buyer, I'd would want things to be on the up-and-up. Wouldn't you?
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