Pioneer TORAIZ SP-16 Sampler

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Thu May 30, 2019 12:41 pm

The DSI portion does seem to be just strapped on and not fully integrated in to the machine. It doesn't really make sense that you can't use midi CC to change the parameters on it. I wouldn't doubt if the functionality is there but Pioneer just never bothered to turn it on.

dubonaire · Post by **dubonaire** » Thu May 30, 2019 2:45 pm

DiscoDevil wrote:The DSI portion does seem to be just strapped on and not fully integrated in to the machine. It doesn't really make sense that you can't use midi CC to change the parameters on it. I wouldn't doubt if the functionality is there but Pioneer just never bothered to turn it on.

I would doubt it's there actually, because then there would need to be additional control circuitry.

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Thu May 30, 2019 2:55 pm

dubonaire wrote:
DiscoDevil wrote:The DSI portion does seem to be just strapped on and not fully integrated in to the machine. It doesn't really make sense that you can't use midi CC to change the parameters on it. I wouldn't doubt if the functionality is there but Pioneer just never bothered to turn it on.
I would doubt it's there actually, because then there would need to be additional control circuitry.

Well, there's some control circuitry in place considering you can choose how you want to use the section and that option was not available at launch ie it was "unlocked" in a software update. My guess is it's all there and just needs to be programmed.

dubonaire · Post by **dubonaire** » Thu May 30, 2019 4:02 pm

DiscoDevil wrote:
dubonaire wrote:
DiscoDevil wrote:The DSI portion does seem to be just strapped on and not fully integrated in to the machine. It doesn't really make sense that you can't use midi CC to change the parameters on it. I wouldn't doubt if the functionality is there but Pioneer just never bothered to turn it on.
I would doubt it's there actually, because then there would need to be additional control circuitry.
Well, there's some control circuitry in place considering you can choose how you want to use the section and that option was not available at launch ie it was "unlocked" in a software update. My guess is it's all there and just needs to be programmed.

Yeah you are right actually. I don't use that feature and had forgotten about it.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Thu May 30, 2019 8:21 pm

where does it save the file when you render a track ??

dubonaire · Post by **dubonaire** » Thu May 30, 2019 9:45 pm

Panason wrote:
where does it save the file when you render a track ??

Have a look at the Firmware Version 1.5 Operating Instructions Addendum.

Jason Brock · Post by **Jason Brock** » Fri May 31, 2019 7:52 am

I was also a bit bummed that it can't lock Reverse per step, but I figured out an easy workaround. Just assign the same sample to two tracks and reverse one of them, then set both tracks to the same choke group. With 16 voices available I don't mind using up an extra track for things like this when I need it.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Sat Jun 01, 2019 4:19 am

Panason wrote:
where does it save the file when you render a track ??

Anyone? I already looked at Pioneer's sad excuse for a user guide... I tried to render a track and it looked like it saved something but I can't find it on the file system / internal or USB. There's a folder called "Rendered" but it's not in there...

Jason Brock · Post by **Jason Brock** » Sat Jun 01, 2019 5:53 am

SP-16 v1.5 Addendum
Says, "The destination to store rendered audio files has been changed as: /PIONEER DJ SAMPLER/RenderedAudio/"

It works for me, that's where I find the files.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Sat Jun 01, 2019 12:35 pm

You cannot access audio files after rendering from the sample browse screen of this unit. Save them in your computer for edit and mastering.

Never again, Toraiz or Pioneer...

So the only way to bounce a track with effects included and then load the rendered audio to a track without a computer is to re-sample it from the analog inputs?

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Mon Jun 03, 2019 8:25 am

Panason wrote:
You cannot access audio files after rendering from the sample browse screen of this unit. Save them in your computer for edit and mastering.

Never again, Toraiz or Pioneer...

So the only way to bounce a track with effects included and then load the rendered audio to a track without a computer is to re-sample it from the analog inputs?

Rendering is a function for exporting to a computer. You can resample the Master outputs internally.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Thu Jun 06, 2019 2:58 pm

I finally recorded something!
Here's another raw SP-16 live jam (pattern mode) recorded directly to stereo without further processing (No DAW or mixer)
The TT303 is clocked, controlled and distorted with the SP-16 ( using the line in)

oodles of fun!

https://soundcloud.com/treebase/gangsta-acid-live

Hopefully I'll sequence it properly sometime and add some VST juice... doubt I'll get away with those samples tho

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Thu Jun 06, 2019 3:52 pm

Nice! Yeah, that's one thing I've never done with my SP-16 is use the THRU for effects.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Thu Jun 06, 2019 4:10 pm

This box is gonna be the hub from now on. Will have to start using the Arranger for more coherent structures. Bring on the fucking Cirklon.

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 7:35 am

Panason wrote:This box is gonna be the hub from now on. Will have to start using the Arranger for more coherent structures. Bring on the fucking Cirklon.

I still haven't really used the arranger either. I just change patterns manually and then after the performance, I go through the recording and cut/copy/paste in Soundforge to "arrange" the tune. I guess I really never know what the song structure is going to be until I actually get in front of a crowd to play. Once I start the set, I just wing it and build the tunes up, break them down, remix, etc on the fly and hope it works out. Usually I can "fix" any phrasing errors or performance flubs afterwards.

Panason · Post by **Panason** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:07 am

I'm trying to stay away from perfectly streamlined beats but it's so easy to destroy a rhythm that people are dancing to, when trying to break away from a monotonous beat.... I want to keep it as live as possible but I'm finding it tricky with transitions/fills since switching to a new scene requires a few too many button presses (and remembering which scene I want) so I'm trying to stick with 16 patterns per "song".

Since there is no colour coding for the patterns within a scene, and there is no pattern chaining it's awkward working with transition patterns that should not loop..Moving patterns around so I can put such patterns next to the patterns they should follow (for easy recall when playing live) requires keeping a blank pattern as a copy/paste zone... the kind of house-keeping jobs that make people run back to the computer!

I thought about sticking to one or two bar long patterns and using the pattern length button to add fills that can be manually brought in for a bar or two... but it's easy to miss the timing window for a switch and let the pattern loop over.

I used to have a sequencer (or was it drum machine) that had dedicated fill patterns ... i miss that stuff.

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 8:52 am

Yep. Pattern organization is definitely a chore and leaving a blank pattern to use temporarily while you shuffle patterns around is necessary.

To make transitions smoother, I will sometimes put sequences from the next song in to the current one. Sometimes just the bassline or even just drums so I can break the tune down and then bring in some part of the next song before I switch scenes. It makes it sound more like a DJ set because I am combining the two tracks together for a bit before I "mix" out of the old one. Having another drum machine and synth with internal sequencers in the live rig helps as well as I can mix in to those for a bit while I switch scenes and then start bringing in tracks from the new song.

dubonaire · Post by **dubonaire** » Fri Jun 07, 2019 2:54 pm

DiscoDevil wrote:Yep. Pattern organization is definitely a chore and leaving a blank pattern to use temporarily while you shuffle patterns around is necessary.

To make transitions smoother, I will sometimes put sequences from the next song in to the current one. Sometimes just the bassline or even just drums so I can break the tune down and then bring in some part of the next song before I switch scenes. It makes it sound more like a DJ set because I am combining the two tracks together for a bit before I "mix" out of the old one. Having another drum machine and synth with internal sequencers in the live rig helps as well as I can mix in to those for a bit while I switch scenes and then start bringing in tracks from the new song.

I was going to say part of the reason you don't need to arrange is because the SP-16 is just one instrument in your live set.

Actually the arrangement function in the SP-16 is very easy to use and also good for jamming different loops.

h4ndcrafted · Post by **h4ndcrafted** » Fri Jun 21, 2019 3:13 am

What I’m really coming to appreciate with this sampler, is actually how well sampling works.

Maybe it’s the other phrase samplers I’ve used, but actual method of sampling is so quick. Being able to resample to defined lengths and quickly being able to do retakes is great.

I’m not really using the arranger much as it is mainly used as a studio device.

I’m also finding the analogue filter is great for resampling and using as a band pass for boosting certain freq in drums.

h4ndcrafted · Post by **h4ndcrafted** » Sat Jun 22, 2019 10:23 am

Service manual is here if anybody is interested ?

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/TSP-16 ... uCuDsgFmjA

tenembre · Post by **tenembre** » Sat Jun 22, 2019 12:40 pm

h4ndcrafted wrote:Service manual is here if anybody is interested ?

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/TSP-16 ... uCuDsgFmjA

Thank you!

sneak-thief · Post by **sneak-thief** » Tue Jun 25, 2019 6:56 am

h4ndcrafted wrote:Service manual is here if anybody is interested ?

https://lookaside.fbsbx.com/file/TSP-16 ... uCuDsgFmjA

Can't d/l without a fb login. Is there any possibility for this file to be hosted elsewhere?

sneak-thief · Post by **sneak-thief** » Tue Jun 25, 2019 2:26 pm

Aha, finally got the service manual.

Are there schematics also available?

"TSP-16 QRT1002: SCHEMATIC DIAGRAM, PCB CONNECTION DIAGRAM, PCB PARTS LIST"

sneak-thief · Post by **sneak-thief** » Wed Jun 26, 2019 2:21 am

Re. analog filter section:

Can the analog high-pass filter be automated with the current firmware?

Neither the LPF frequency nor the LPF resonance pots are connected to the main CPU, but there's a single-channel DAC that goes to the HPF frequency CV control:

DiscoDevil · Post by **DiscoDevil** » Wed Jun 26, 2019 8:28 am

As it is now, no. I imagine you could make a breakout box to allow CV control over those circuits though.

MUFF WIGGLER

MUFF WIGGLER

Pioneer TORAIZ SP-16 Sampler