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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

J247 VCO Panel
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> 5U Format Modules Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6, 7, 8, 9  Next [all]

Is having an etched panel worth the additional cost, and slightly longer wait time?
Yes. $55 for an etched panel
76%
 76%  [ 10 ]
No. $42 for a silk screened panel.
23%
 23%  [ 3 ]
Total Votes : 13

Author J247 VCO Panel
Jsharpphoto
[/b]**PLEASE READ THROUGH TO THE END BEFORE POSTING COMMENTS. MANY CHANGES HAVE ALREADY BEEN MADE AND ARE REFLECTED ON SUBSEQUENT PAGES.**[/b]

Wigglers,

I have been working to redesign the q106 VCO layout, to consolidate as much of the "oscillator aid" module as possible, without gaining any weight. Here is what i've come up with. This adds the following features.

1. Aux. Wave Selector
2. Amplitude for the Aux. Wave
3. Normal and Inverted outs for the Aux. Wave.
4. Soft Sync with attenuation
5. Pure square wave output (not effected by PWM)

To accomplish these goals, the only thing we loose is the attenuators for both Linear and Exponential Frequency Modulation. And assuming you are using the Aux. Wave of a q106 to FM another q106, the Aux Wave output has it's own attenuation. If you are using something other than one of these for FM, you would need to attenuate it with another module.

This may not be a perfect fit for everyone, but it's the least amount of compromise that I could fit into the panel. It still allows for two Exp. Frequency inputs, and if you're using the jumper trick, you can still daisy-chain your oscillators without needing a mult.

Here is my current panel design.

**The only thing missing from the panel currently is the frequency LED indicator, because the batteries in my digital caliper died. I will have the LED in place for the prototype.**

I am still making subtle tweaks to the alignment of certain text, and will build a full mockup and subject it to some real-world usage before having them produced. I'm going to be using Freestate FX to silk screen and CNC the panels.

This thread is to gauge the interest of doing a "group buy" on the panels. On top of the costs of the new panel, you'd need to order a few parts from synthesizers.com to add to the board. I can provide a specific part list later, but the cost for the parts, and shipping runs about $30-35 per module, plus the panel, which will cost around $32. So, estimate $60-65 per VCO for the full conversation. All mods are plug and play, and completely reversible if you ever decide to sell or return to the original state. If you already own the "oscillator aid" module, you can just remove the components from that panel and install them in the new panel. Given the cost of the extra parts, and the new panel, you are only slightly below the cost of purchasing the existing oscillator aid. This mod shouldn't be viewed as a money-saving option, but as a space saving option. Feel free to comment if you have questions about the panel design. The font used is a %99.9 match for the Moog modular panel font, NOT the dotcom font. It's very similar to what's used on the Moon Modular panels.
Jsharpphoto
Testing the layout...

The outside edges of that box represent only the black part of the panel, it doesn't go all the way to the bends.
Dave Peck
For me, the lack of exponential frequency modulation attenuator would be a deal breaker. It would require using up some additional mixer or VCA or dedicated attenuator module to do it.

I think it would be more useful to place an attenuator for the frequency mod depth where that bipolar aux wave level control is currently located, and add a simple +/- polarity toggle switch for the aux wave, located to the left of the Aux Wave output jack.
Jsharpphoto
Dave Peck wrote:
I think it would be more useful to place an attenuator for the frequency mod depth where that bipolar aux wave level control is currently located, and add a simple +/- polarity toggle switch for the aux wave, located to the left of the Aux Wave output jack.


That's correct a switching jack is an option, but that isn't available as a "plug 'n play" function. That requires people to have to wire something up.

Out of curiosity, what are you using as a source for FM?
Dave Peck
Jsharpphoto wrote:


That's correct a switching jack is an option, but that isn't available as a "plug 'n play" function. That requires people to have to wire something up.

Out of curiosity, what are you using as a source for FM?


It might be sending separate LFOs to a few different 106's for independent vibratos at slightly different rates, it might be some kind of EG sweep for hard sync sweep effects, maybe a small 'blip' of pitch mod from a quick EG during the attack of a note (again with different amounts to different oscs), etc.

Yeah, I see what you mean about being able to provide a simple direct way for folks to implement this panel. Hmm. I wonder of it's possible to squeeze a freq mod attenuator in there somewhere and include a small knob for it? Or no knob, with just the pot shaft installed on the panel, and the customer can supply whatever small knob they want to use?
Jsharpphoto
Are you looking for linear or exponential? If you only needed one or the other to be attenuated, you could just plug the AUX amplitude pot into either the Lin or Exp Attenuator jack on the PCB.

So the panel wouldn't change at all, and that pot isn't actually labeled (for user customization purposes). You would just have to remember what it was used for.
Dave Peck
Jsharpphoto wrote:
Are you looking for linear or exponential? If you only needed one or the other to be attenuated, you could just plug the AUX amplitude pot into either the Lin or Exp Attenuator jack on the PCB.

So the panel wouldn't change at all, and that pot isn't actually labeled (for user customization purposes). You would just have to remember what it was used for.


A-HA! That's a good point. The same pot could be used for either purpose just depending on which header you connect it to on the board. Nice!
Jsharpphoto
Dave Peck wrote:
Jsharpphoto wrote:
Are you looking for linear or exponential? If you only needed one or the other to be attenuated, you could just plug the AUX amplitude pot into either the Lin or Exp Attenuator jack on the PCB.

So the panel wouldn't change at all, and that pot isn't actually labeled (for user customization purposes). You would just have to remember what it was used for.


A-HA! That's a good point. The same pot could be used for either purpose just depending on which header you connect it to on the board. Nice!


i THOUGHT about eliminating the PWM attenuator label and the Aux. Wave attenuator, and making two generic "Mod 1" and "Mod 2" attenuators, that the user could self assign when they built the panel. But I use PWM constantly, so I left that one nice and labeled.
Squattamolie
Not having level pots for either modulation input would be (for me) a problem. I have no idea if it could be done, but could a small hole be added for a little toggle switch, and then have that switch wired to select sending the value of a front panel pot to either the var exp in or the lin freq in amount? Is that something that would even work?
Jsharpphoto
Squattamolie wrote:
Not having level pots for either modulation input would be (for me) a problem. I have no idea if it could be done, but could a small hole be added for a little toggle switch, and then have that switch wired to select sending the value of a front panel pot to either the var exp in or the lin freq in amount? Is that something that would even work?


Yes and no. It could be wired. But not be plug and play.
Jsharpphoto
If you use the attenuators for the FM inputs, you are better off using the original panel. Like I said, this panel layout isn't for everyone.
Jsharpphoto
If there is enough request for it, I can rearrange the Aid section of the panel in a way that would allow the user to select whether they want to attenuate either of the FM inputs OR the output level of the aid wave.

Can you guys live with just one attenuator for the three, does that work? Then if you wanted to do your own hack for a selector switch, that's on you.
diophantine
Out of curiosity, do people actually use the waveform selector from the aid module a lot?

If so, is it just for convenience so that you don't have to repatch? Or to make easier transitions when performing live? Or for the square wave?

Inverted output could be nice in LFO mode, if trying to do some panning stuff or whatnot. But that's easily achievable with other tools.

I have a couple of the Triple Soft Sync panels for my Q106s, and have never felt the need for any of the other features from the Aid module, which is why I'm curious.
Jsharpphoto
In my testing, I use the aux wave for modulation. Having the attenuator for it makes FM or Sync super quick. I never use it in place of the individual wave outputs. For me, it's %100 a modulation source
Jsharpphoto
How is this for a compromise? I just switched the location of the attenuator for the aux output and the output jacks. Now the user can select what they want the attenuator to connect to on the PCB, but it visually still makes sense to control any of those options. Or if the user wants to, they can work up some kind of switch to toggle between the two.

I mean, how many times are people using both Linear and Exponential FM at the same time, where none of the sources have built in attenuation?


mikefiction
It reminds me of the 921 VCO

Jsharpphoto
mikefiction wrote:
It reminds me of the 921 VCO



that's not a coincidence. i wasn't trying to make a "clone" but the inspiration certainly came from that.
sduck
I think it looks great! However, my solution would be to use some smaller pots for the FM attenuators (and juggle things to make room for them) - I use those all the time, couldn't see doing without them.
Jsharpphoto
That's fair. I wanted to make this plug and play for people. This has actually been pretty eye opening. It's pretty interesting to see how we all use the q106 differently. I only occasionally use the linear FM input, and never ever the exponential FM. I have lots of attenuation in my system, specifically the Moon Reversible Modulation Matrix panel, so losing the attenuators wasn't a deal breaker, but we all have different things in our kit.
mikefiction
Jsharpphoto wrote:

that's not a coincidence. i wasn't trying to make a "clone" but the inspiration certainly came from that.


That's what I figured, the 921 is a beautiful looking design smile
megaohm
Jsharpphoto wrote:




Sync Level atten is bipolar.
Is that correct?
Jsharpphoto
Good catch. That's an error. I just had the wrong label layer turned on in the layer. I will update that before I make the prototype tomorrow.
suitandtieguy
why are you only using 1" knobs?

if you use the Small Bear knobs you can use 1.25" and .75".

the master frequency should probably be 1.25" and stuff like sync and pulse width amt and cv would be fine at .75"

if you use those smaller knobs, you could easily fit a 1v/oct attenuator and third input on there.

i'm not breaking your balls, just trying to make a helpful suggestion. a good panel like this would be a great DIY product and i strongly encourage you to pursue it.

are you in the USA?
Henfield
diophantine wrote:
Out of curiosity, do people actually use the waveform selector from the aid module a lot?

If so, is it just for convenience so that you don't have to repatch? Or to make easier transitions when performing live? Or for the square wave?
.

I have already repaneled my Q106s behind a 1MU panel, which I call the "Q106 Lite". I used the waveform switch and output instead of individual wave outputs. For me, I love the fact that I do not have to repatch, and it does help during live performance.
Jsharpphoto
suitandtieguy wrote:
why are you only using 1" knobs?

if you use the Small Bear knobs you can use 1.25" and .75".

the master frequency should probably be 1.25" and stuff like sync and pulse width amt and cv would be fine at .75"

if you use those smaller knobs, you could easily fit a 1v/oct attenuator and third input on there.

i'm not breaking your balls, just trying to make a helpful suggestion. a good panel like this would be a great DIY product and i strongly encourage you to pursue it.

are you in the USA?


Yes I'm in the US. I had thought about going up to a larger frequency knob, but had decided against it because the only reason I would have been doing it would have been to make it look more like a 921 VCO, which seemed a bit silly. I don't think the increased knob size would yield in more accurate tuning, given that the range of the knob is only 1 oct. it hadn't occurred to me to go smaller on the other knobs. I will mess with the layout today and see if I can make it work. It's not just about fitting them on the panel though, it's also about ergonomics. If the panel gets too dense, it won't be worth it.
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