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Does anyone here own the Q162 Filter Mixer?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> 5U Format Modules  
Author Does anyone here own the Q162 Filter Mixer?
alternating.bit
I'm curious if it really does any 'new sounds' that it boasts. I guess if I just routed each output of the Q107 ladder filter into a 4 channel mixer I'd experience the same thing? Obviously this module would avoid cable clutter. I have the Q109 aid and I very rarely consider the mixer to make certain sounds, rather I really just turn the knobs to choose which sound wave I want, rather than having to plug patches to do so. This Q162 would obviously alleviate that need as well.

Anyone here have one?

VinceL
I considered the filter mixer, but I decided that having general purpose mixers and using a few patch cords from the filter to the mixer offered more flexibility.

The Q162 is really a one-trick pony. You are locked in to using it with a specific filter. The one positive is that it eliminates up to 4 patch cords.
XXXEsq
I have one. I don't use it that much, but occasionally, I land on a combo of filter outputs that just works for a particular patch. In retrospect, it may make more sense to get another general purpose 1U mixer (like a STG CP3 clone) as it's more flexible and the few extra patch cords don't make a huge difference.
Just me
I have one and use it regularly. It allows me the ability to set the bandwidth of the bandpass and notch. It is helpful in subtle ways. I don't want to eat up my STG mixer for that duty. I also have mixers on my a106s. If you are trying to synthesize specific sounds, it helps. If all you are doing is random cool noises, not so much. As with anything, YMMV.
bwhittington
I have one. It is a luxury, but it definitely gets used regularly. Obviously, the "new sounds" are limited to mixes of the different filter types, but I think it adds some nice spice to the Q107.

If you have 5 minutes and 13 seconds to spare, you can savor every moment of my Q107 filter mixing video below. hihi It uses a Q112 and those four patch cords, but the exploration made me think the Q162 was worthwhile.

Honestly, you could mix filter outputs at any time with another mixer, but how often do you? With the Q162, the knobs are right there begging for your sweet caress, either for that perfect extra sizzle to your patch or for a live tweak to animate things along the way. A little less "modular" to have a dedicated filter mixer, but it's a fun approach.

[/b]
brandnewmath
I have one and, as others have said, it's exceedingly convenient but not essential.
ranix
bwhittington wrote:
you can savor every moment of my Q107 filter mixing video

it's very good thumbs up
alternating.bit
Thanks for the responses. Indeed it seems like my assumptions were correct; it's convenient, but subtle. Thanks for the video share, Bwhittington.
Reminds me of my demo of the Q161 Oscillator Mixer demo. Fun to tweak with some subtle changes, but over time I realize it's not entirely practical for my compositions. As I mentioned before ideally I'd be using the mixer primarily as a short cut and the fact that I hate to plug/unplug each of the mixer outs to test to see how I want the general output to sound, be it notch, lowpass, etc.

Just me
Now, if ONLY they were voltage controlled!
facklr
I had one but I sold it. Everytime I wasn't using it, I felt like I should be using it, and every time I was using it, I felt like I had to over-utilize it. It was a module that made me very self-conscience, so I got rid of it.

I will say--and it may have just been my imagination--the leveling was smoother than using a mixer. But it was probably just my imagination.

I say go for it. If anything it will introduce more instances of notch, band, and hi pass where you may not have done so otherwise.

Then again, it also might introduce more instances of notch, band, and hi pass where you may not have done so otherwise. hihi
facklr
Just me wrote:
Now, if ONLY they were voltage controlled!


Oh yes. This would have changed my opinion of it quite a bit.
alternating.bit
Technically you could make it voltage controlled with a Segwuencer or some other mixer/VCA/CV combo.

That new Moon filter has CV controlled filter output.

But yeah, I think the mixer would actually get me to use my Q107 more often in general. It's been my least used filter, but I think that also has to do with its location in my setup.
Squattamolie
alternating.bit wrote:
....It's been my least used filter, but I think that also has to do with its location in my setup.


It was my first filter, so as time went on and I added more VCFs (have 7 ATM) I started sorta ignoring it. But I quickly found that as cool as all my other VCFs are, the 107 makes sounds and does things none of the others do. I find that I often prefer it for certain synthesized percussion sounds, even over some killer VCFs like the Delta, Mankato or Sea Devils. Also, I popped a switch into the panel that enables the hard clipping and, with that engaged, it's even farther away from anything that any of the other VCFs do. It's a great filter! spinning

This is a vid from a few years ago that shows the hard clipping, and why I think it's so handy to have a switch for it.

bandwidth
The Q107 is a great filter. Several months ago, I was reviewing Roger Arrick's tutorials on the Q960. I noticed that I really liked the timbre of the patch in the videos and thought it must have been something exotic like a Q127 FFB. His reply was, "I rarely go to the effort to patch a Q127 ffb in videos. What you're hearing is probably a Q107 filter with a tiny bit of Q115 reverb on the end." It made me go back and spend some time with the Q107. I also added the hard-clipping switch after watching Squattamolie's video. I like it! I've considered the filter mixer, but so far, I just make do with a 4 channel mixer.
facklr
alternating.bit wrote:
Technically you could make it voltage controlled with a Segwuencer or some other mixer/VCA/CV combo.

That new Moon filter has CV controlled filter output.

But yeah, I think the mixer would actually get me to use my Q107 more often in general. It's been my least used filter, but I think that also has to do with its location in my setup.



How's that? For the Q162? I don't think so. The Moon, yes. But if you have some magic trick that turns knobs without CV jacks, please do tell because that would be a useful magic trick.

EDIT:

Unless you were talking about the Q107...
alternating.bit
facklr wrote:
How's that? For the Q162? I don't think so. The Moon, yes. But if you have some magic trick that turns knobs without CV jacks, please do tell because that would be a useful magic trick.

EDIT:

Unless you were talking about the Q107...


facklr
Yeah, I thought you meant the Q162. thumbs up
Rex Coil 7
Q112, Q113, Q161, Q162 all use the exact same PCB ... I've owned every one of those modules and checked out the PCB ... exactly the same circuit boards populated with exactly the same components.

The Q161 and Q162's PCBs even say "Q112 Q113 mixer" right on the boards. Take a look at the data sheets, you can clearly see those markings on all of the mixers mentioned here in the PDFs.

Here's another circuit that is shared between modules ..... The Q111 Pan/Fade and the Q116 Ring Modulator also share PCBs with the same components on them. On a side note, with that having been said about the Pan/Fade and the Ring Mod, it's a wonder that none of our more expert builders/modders/DIYers here in the MU sub forum haven't delved in to creating something SICK ASS using that circuit. I can only imagine what sort of FEK YEA can be done by cross breeding a Pan/Fader and a Ring Mod.

The PCB in the Pan/Fade and the Ring mod say "Q111, Q112, Q116 Pan/Fade/Mix/Ring" on it. The Q112 used to use this board back when it only had two knobs on it, however I think Roger revised the mixers' designs when the Q113 was released along with the updated 3-knob Q112.

The current mixer PCB (Q112/Q113/Q161/Q162) can be used to do some really cool stuff, especially in the Q113 configuration. Here's a little trick I worked out to create some seriously cool gain boosted overdrive with the Q113 just by using two patchcords .....

https://www.muffwiggler.com/forum/viewtopic.php?t=166283&highlight=

And a quote of the description ...

Rex Coil 7 wrote:
(patch pics below)

Simple idea, run the buss output right back in to that buss' input, use that input's level attenuator knob to control the ~drive~ level.

Use the "MAIN" output to feed this signal to it's next destination (VCF I''d guess).

And the damned thing actually works!

On my small system (4 VCO) I patched two VCOs in to Buss A ch's 1 & 2 ... and two VCO's in to Buss B ch's 1 & 2 respectively. I patched Buss A "out" in to Buss A Ch3 "in" ... and did the same with Buss B. The MAIN out feeds the VCF bank mixer, then out to VCA.

Depending on VCO tunings and how one uses them, some really nice timbres are possible. I've just started with this patch, and I've not attempted anything harmonically rich such as Hard Sync sweeps, Soft Sync tunings, or FMage, wavefolding, ring mod et al.... But just goofing with some fave tunings (various chords etc..) I find it fascinating how this patch can be used to bring forth/push back various harmonics. If subtly applied and carefully used it's quite musical, and seems to be worth the two patchcords it requires, at the very least.

This patch will also boost output levels from the MAIN output. It's nothing drastic, but it does provide a means of increasing gain levels if that is what one needs.

This isn't a key that opens doors to DubSteppinVille type filter screeches and popular sine wave squelched rezo-turd sounds, but it does seem to be a way to add harmonic content to (perhaps) otherwise mundane sounds.

nanners











Mind VCF input levels when doing this, too much of ~teh brutals~ creates unintelligible and very over-compressed signals. Of course, unless that is your intention then dig in, by all means available!

I've found that this patch creates a different sounding distortion than when using a Q118 Instrument Interface overdriven to clipping. This patch also seems to react well to basic interval tunings (Root + 5th or m3rd, Maj3rd, 4th, 7th, and so on). Adjust VCO levels at the mixer to create even more colors.

So far my favorite trick is to go into duo-mode, Ch1 (1v/oct + LO NOTE priority) drives VCOs 1 & 2 which are both on Buss A of the mixer ... Ch1 (1v/oct + HI NOTE priority) drives VCOs 3 & 4 which are both on Buss B of the mixer. With this I have instant and very musical real time control over the VCO interval spacing (5th, 3rd, etc) and each voice of the interval has adjustable timbre via the per-buss drive levels created at the VCO mixer.

Now, the next obvious expression of this patch would be to run the feedback patch loops through buss-dedicated VCAs so that drive level may be controlled via CV (or realtime controller such as a pair of wheels or foot controllers or ???). Combine ~that~ with the duo-phonic VCO assignment stuff AND creative tunings on the VCOs and the realtime expression capabilities of this patch become inspiring.

So yea ... the Q113 ... pretty cool gadget. thumbs up

It's a good thing. Rockin' Banana!



And correcting some errata ....


Rex Coil 7 wrote:
Uh ... woops ... quick correction ...

In reference to Buss B, anytime I said "Ch3" I should have more correctly said "Ch7". I don't think of the Q113 the way Roger did the panel layout, I think of it as two 3 channel mixers that are summed. So, in my peanut head channels 5, 6 and 7 are 1B, 2B, and 3B.

So again, referencing Buss B, "Ch3" means CHANNEL 7 .... Dead Banana

thumbs up
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