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Archangel: The Unveiling
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Modular Synth General Discussion Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5, 6  Next [all]
Author Archangel: The Unveiling
det3
Hello folks,

You've seen some teaser videos we've put up, and have been waiting for more information on Archangel. Without further ado, you can find it at the new Detachment 3 website.

Simple vitals are as follows:

Archangel is a 4-row 16-step analog sequencer with integrated 16-pad touchplate controller. The layout of the sequencer allows for instant access to every function available. Archangel can be its own timing master as well as slave to MIDI, DIN sync or an external clock pulse. The sequence length can be set from 1 to 16 stages, and step size can be adjusted from 1/32nd note to two bars. To speed composition and improvisation Archangel has an integrated global multi-scale quantizer which will constrain the sequencer outputs to either a chromatic scale or the same scale that the keyboard is set to. The touchplate keyboard is also pressure and position sensitive with their own CV outputs.

Size: 6U rackmount with optional tabletop endcap kit.
Price: $1795.00
Release Date: Late Summer

There will be 3 models - a 1/4", 1/8" and banana jack version.

I'm setting up the web cart to start taking orders on the 1/4" version soon. If anyone has questions, ping me via PM or e-mail.
Babaluma
this looks great! now do i jump on it or wait for the circklon?

det3, does each row have its own cv/gate output?

[edit] just checked the site, yes it does.

another question, can it sync to an external analogue trigger (from a modular square wave lfo for example)? not having external sync is the bane of the mobius, imho.
Ranxerox
Judging from the features / diagram, there appears to be separate CV outs for each row, but no individual gate outs. I could be wrong?

In any case, this thing looks like a total fucking beast - good work!
toothless_wonder
ho my god what a tease !!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!!
suitandtieguy
Ranxerox wrote:
Judging from the features / diagram, there appears to be separate CV outs for each row, but no individual gate outs. I could be wrong?


nope. you are in fact not wrong.

all of the stages advance at the same time, so there is only one "gate output" .. it's labeled "clock" and is the far right "sequencer output"

Babaluma wrote:
this looks great! now do i jump on it or wait for the circklon?


the answer is obviously that you need both.

Babaluma wrote:
another question, can it sync to an external analogue trigger (from a modular square wave lfo for example)? not having external sync is the bane of the mobius, imho.


yes that is what the "advance" input does.

maybe it should be changed to "shift", because that's what the Moog 960 and my sequencers have it labeled as.
Ranxerox
'Stage Addressing' looks like a great feature. Does each stage generate a corresponding gate output when activated using addressing?

It looks like the Moon M564 sequential switch would make an ideal playmate...
suitandtieguy
Ranxerox wrote:
'Stage Addressing' looks like a great feature. Does each stage generate a corresponding gate output when activated using addressing?


that _might_ be possible when the transport is stopped, but i don't believe it should do that if it's running. there might be times when you'd want to use voltage addressing while also using this thing as a clock master.

i personally don't like the idea because that's a _clock_ output, and i don't think it should spit anything other than clocks out from the transport.
Monobass
det3 wrote:
The sequence length can be set from 1 to 16 stages, and step size can be adjusted from 1/32nd note to two bars.


can each row have totally independent reset, length and step size?
2012
i thought first the unit could store presets,but it seems not :(
suitandtieguy
apologies in advance to Det3, i want to address this general topic immediately.

Monobass wrote:
can each row have totally independent reset, length and step size?


no. that opens up a can of UI worms which is no easier to seal than a BP drilling accident.

for example, that would have required an LCD. and menus.

then, people would ask "why doesn't it store my sequences?"

and then it goes from there. pretty soon you wind up with something like this:



to make this thing happen this decade, we had to draw a perimeter around the concept, defined as "a TKB for the rest of us." normally i'm a bit more coy about what things are based on conceptually or electrically, but i need to explain why it has the feature set it does.

the only thing that this thing doesn't have that the TKB does are the 16 stage select inputs. there wasn't room for them, and quite frankly the only thing i could imagine them being used for is pendulum mode and a length control, which is taken care of other ways on this device.

things like sync and an internal clock were added because they fit the concept. the quantiser is something Joe suggested because there were spare A/D channels to play with.

adding vertical position and a real scale control to the touchplates really pushes this thing into a new territory, far enough it's a "new thing" and not just a "TKB ripoff", but it needs to stay grounded in the original concept.

individual row transport doesn't fit the concept, because then the ABCD and such outputs make no sense.

this thing is incredibly complex. there are 8 circuit boards inside. there is a microprocessor for overall control, and the touchplates themselves have 4 processors dedicated to parsing all the data coming off the _80_ (yes, there are actually 80 plates, divided into 16 groups of 5) touchplates.

it is the most advanced touchplate sequencer ever, and every chip in this device is being pushed near its limit. i hope the lack of presets isn't a dealbreaker for anyone.
Nuuj
Any possibility of releasing just the touch pad controller without the sequencer, as a follow on product?
Nelson Baboon
So, it sounds like the real news here is that the original release date of may has now been moved back to late summer? Damn....
Ranxerox
suitandtieguy wrote:
Ranxerox wrote:
'Stage Addressing' looks like a great feature. Does each stage generate a corresponding gate output when activated using addressing?


that _might_ be possible when the transport is stopped, but i don't believe it should do that if it's running. there might be times when you'd want to use voltage addressing while also using this thing as a clock master.

i personally don't like the idea because that's a _clock_ output, and i don't think it should spit anything other than clocks out from the transport.


Not to belabour the point, and I understand this thing already has a very rich feature-set, but...

I really like the idea of being able to 'sweep' through the stages using a swinging voltage e.g. LFO or envelope, with each stage activation generating its own trigger pulse or gate to trigger e.g. another envelope.

Would it be possible, while clock is running, to purpose the keyboard gate-out to generate the gate or trigger-pulse with each voltage-addressed stage activation?

In such a case the keyboard itself could be selected to either 'retrigger' at the same output, or force a 'high' gate to remain 'high' until the keyboard pressure is released.

Anyway, just a thought!
suitandtieguy
in what use case would it be more useful to run a sequence that way instead of just using the internal clock or an external clock of some kind?

Joe is going to have to chime in on wether or not it's possible and if it can be fit in. i'm just very curious as to why you would want to do that.
mono-poly
I'd really love to see gate outs on each step.
stretta
Quote:
then, people would ask "why doesn't it store my sequences?"

and then it goes from there. pretty soon you wind up with something like this:



THANK YOU.

I just want to take a moment for everyone to appreciate the wisdom of this decision. It is easy to add features (especially when it comes to software). The difficult part is understanding what to leave out. Understanding and limiting the parameters of design is an art. I've witnessed feature creep destroy products. Some never ship. Those that do ship have impressive feature lists, but become impenetrable in use.

Bravo.
Monobass
Yeah I applaud the wisdom of the decision to have a rigidly defined feature set.

I just wish it was the one *I* wanted, such is life smile

(lack of presets wouldn't be a deal breaker for me though as it goes)
2012
[quote="stretta"]
Quote:
I just want to take a moment for everyone to appreciate the wisdom of this decision. It is easy to add features (especially when it comes to software). The difficult part is understanding what to leave out. Understanding and limiting the parameters of design is an art. I've witnessed feature creep destroy products. Some never ship. Those that do ship have impressive feature lists, but become impenetrable in use.

Bravo.


yes you are right,reminds me the signal arts..

But for live use just a couple of presets would have made this unit VERY handy. (and imo would bump the sales)
Monobass
even if it did have that... what % of the userbase would even be using it live anyway?... 1% maybe?
frozenkore
Monobass wrote:
even if it did have that... what % of the userbase would even be using it live anyway?... 1% maybe?


I'm not sure if you mean what % of the userbase would even be using "presets" live or "the Archangel" live, but if you mean the Archangel itself, this thing just screams live use. Especially with the tkb. The live user interaction makes this very useful.

That's just my opinion though and I may be misinterpreting what "it" is. huh?
Ranxerox
suitandtieguy wrote:
in what use case would it be more useful to run a sequence that way instead of just using the internal clock or an external clock of some kind?

Joe is going to have to chime in on wether or not it's possible and if it can be fit in. i'm just very curious as to why you would want to do that.


Rather than, say, modulating the frequency of a clock oscillator with an envelope, your address index would offer the ability to move between stages in a non-linear way using, for example, a random voltage.

This could in turn be modulated by another voltage, leading to interesting non-linear patterns. Or, alternatively, 'rounds' within a constrained set of notes. It would open up huge possibilities for experimenting with aleotoric note- or event-progressions under voltage control.

I dunno, I just reckon it would sound cool oops
dougt
suitandtieguy wrote:
the only thing that this thing doesn't have that the TKB does are the 16 stage select inputs. there wasn't room for them, and quite frankly the only thing i could imagine them being used for is pendulum mode and a length control, which is taken care of other ways on this device.


Do you mean the TKB step outputs on each stage? I use them quite a bit to trigger events on certain steps. Say I want to trigger an envelope at stage 6 and trigger another one at step 13...
suitandtieguy
dougt wrote:
Do you mean the TKB step outputs on each stage? I use them quite a bit to trigger events on certain steps. Say I want to trigger an envelope at stage 6 and trigger another one at step 13...


well that's good to know that they're outputs. from the way the colour coding looks on the panel, i thought they were inputs!

regardless, i don't see where they would fit on the case. it's already 6U .. it doesn't need to be larger.

also since it sends DIN sync you could easily run a Trigger Mini-Store or two off of this thing to send trigger events.
authorless
I personally (if and when I can scrape the money together, super broke lately) want it first and foremost for the touch plates, the sequencing is just a really nice bonus. I really think this thing is going to be awesome just as it is. Not really something to replace every sequencer. Capacitance touch keyboards are really effing awesome.

Gods damnit, I want one. we're not worthy MY ASS IS BLEEDING we're not worthy
suitandtieguy
authorless wrote:
Not really something to replace every sequencer.


bingo.

the whole idea of the "megasequencer" bothers the shitting crust out of me.

in acid house, you use the 303 sequencer for the 303 stuff, the 101 sequencer for the 101 stuff, the drum machines for the drum machines, et cetera.

in Tangerine Dream, Christoph Franke used a combination of Moog 960s with Projekt Elektronik expansion units, Projekt Elektronik sequencers, PPG sequencers, and an Oberheim DS-2 all in the same rig just to control 2 modular voices. it wasn't just a matter of having different parts ready to go on different sequencers, they could have afforded multiple sequencers of any type. obviously different sequencers were used for different kind of lines.
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