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Shakmat Modular 2hp modules : SumDif and HiPass
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules  
Author Shakmat Modular 2hp modules : SumDif and HiPass
Bishop Dust
Yoow !

We went at the superbooth with new modules, here're the two tiny ones we had in our rack This is fun!

SumDif

- Dual 2 inputs adder / differentiator for CV or audio

- For example if the first input is 3v and the second output is 1v, sum output provides 4v and dif output 2v.

- Each section can be used as as a 2:1 unity mixer, a 1:2 buffered multiple or a signal inverter.

- Mid Side processing application

- Optional -6dB gain for the first section

- 2hp wide, 29mm depth



HiPass

- 4 fixed high pass filters (butterworth response curve)

- Filters 1 and 2 : 2 poles – 30 Hz (DC remover – extreme low frequencies attenuator)

- Filters 3 and 4 : 3 poles – 100 Hz (usual Lo Cut design on mixers)

- 2hp wide, 29mm depth

g3d9
i like the design style on these modules very much.

Dont have much use for them in my present set-up, though i will certainly be watching to see what you release in future.
Ninja
Charles_Tanios
Very interested by those 2 usefull little ones.

Price and availability, please ?
Bishop Dust
Price : in the 80 - 90 euros range.

Availability : this summer
Charles_Tanios
Great !

Thanks !
joem
I'm interested! Are they going to be available as kits?
Bishop Dust
joem wrote:
I'm interested! Are they going to be available as kits?


This is SMD so I m afraid not !
joem
Ah, well, I'm still interested. I love small knob-less utilities!
MvK
I've been looking for a small module to protect my speakers from blowing. In case of userfault liketoo much low frequency self oscillation of filters for example. The HP seems to be the thing, doesn't it?
tbecker
For the HP module, what is the attenuation level IE 12db/oct, 24db/oct ect? These both look very useful and the HP could be a nice compact way to get AC only (clearing any DC bias) in the Rubicon TZFM inputs!
Bishop Dust
tbecker wrote:
For the HP module, what is the attenuation level IE 12db/oct, 24db/oct ect? These both look very useful and the HP could be a nice compact way to get AC only (clearing any DC bias) in the Rubicon TZFM inputs!


First two filters are 12db/oct - 30Hz and the two last ones are 18dB/Oct 100Hz
jenz
Love your new modules Franky!! Keep em' commin'!! we're not worthy Guinness ftw!
Bishop Dust
jenz wrote:
Love your new modules Franky!! Keep em' commin'!! we're not worthy Guinness ftw!


Thanks cousin du Quebec Guinness ftw! ! Our modules might be in a shop in Montreal in a near future w00t
jenz
Bishop Dust wrote:
jenz wrote:
Love your new modules Franky!! Keep em' commin'!! we're not worthy Guinness ftw!


Thanks cousin du Quebec Guinness ftw! ! Our modules might be in a shop in Montreal in a near future w00t


Great news! w00t Guinness ftw!
dugoutcanoe
Bishop Dust wrote:
Yoow !

We went at the superbooth with new modules, here're the two tiny ones we had in our rack This is fun!

SumDif

- Dual 2 inputs adder / differentiator for CV or audio

- For example if the first input is 3v and the second output is 1v, sum output provides 4v and dif output 2v.

- Each section can be used as as a 2:1 unity mixer, a 1:2 buffered multiple or a signal inverter.

- Mid Side processing application

- Optional -6dB gain for the first section

- 2hp wide, 29mm depth



HiPass

- 4 fixed high pass filters (butterworth response curve)

- Filters 1 and 2 : 2 poles – 30 Hz (DC remover – extreme low frequencies attenuator)

- Filters 3 and 4 : 3 poles – 100 Hz (usual Lo Cut design on mixers)

- 2hp wide, 29mm depth


were these ever produced? sad banana
Shwaj
Can anyone contrast the SumDif with the LRMSMSLR? Is that a tiny switch I see at the bottom right of the modules?
lisa
That’s part of the logo, not a switch.
tbecker
Shwaj wrote:
Can anyone contrast the SumDif with the LRMSMSLR? Is that a tiny switch I see at the bottom right of the modules?


C+D and C-D are the same as mid side or MS encoding assuming you put in something stereo such as a stereo field recording (ms or xy recording methods). So this can do the same things as the LRMS module from worng. The worng can be used as a 2:1 mixer or inverter too as they are esentially the same thing. I like this form factor a bit better and the more general approach meaning that the lrms is not imposed on the person patching.
tbecker
Still looking forward to both of these when they come out. Would love to hear if there are any updates to the release window!
desolationjones
Shwaj wrote:
Can anyone contrast the SumDif with the LRMSMSLR?


Only apparent difference: the LRMSMSLR has built-in attenuation (-6 dB) on inputs to mid encoder instead of a unity mixer so hot signals into L & R don't clip on M = L+R.
Bishop Dust
The sum dif has an optional -6db attenuation accessible by jumpers on the back.

We have a little fix do to on the production. The hi pass should be packed up next week. The sum dif should be available in August.
yarderyyz
Both instant buys for me if they make it into a Canadian shop! I've seriously been wish for these exact two utilities since I built my modular. Fixed highpass for DC blocking audio rate modulation, and MS has been a big part of my production style forever.
tbecker
Bishop Dust wrote:
The sum dif has an optional -6db attenuation accessible by jumpers on the back.

We have a little fix do to on the production. The hi pass should be packed up next week. The sum dif should be available in August.
will be adding both asap in the us! Thanks.
huffnPuff
I’m reserving space for both!
The adder/ subtractor is such a great idea and the DC filtering will allow me to plug the modular directly to the amp. Awesome.
Buttons ARE toys
Will both Analogue Haven and Modular Addict be receiving SumDif? I'm really hoping to get one of the first batch to fill the final 2hp of my case!

EDIT: It looks to me like this functions differently from LRMSMSLR. The second section of that module appears to use an averager rather than differentiator. So its first two outputs are (A+B) and (A-B), but the second two are (C+D)/2 and (C-D).

Am I understanding that correctly? And if so, how will this behave differently?
flashheart
As was mentioned, by default there's no attenuation on either of the sum outputs of the Sum/diff, you can set this with jumpers.
Buttons ARE toys
flashheart wrote:
As was mentioned, by default there's no attenuation on either of the sum outputs of the Sum/diff, you can set this with jumpers.


Okay, so the /2 that LRMSMSLR is doing on the second stage is just the 6db gain reduction. I guess I don't really understand how dB measurements work, since I expected the math there to be (C+D)-(whatever 6dB translates to in voltage), rather than (C+D)/2.
flashheart
Exactly. -6dB is the same as dividing by 2 in voltage terms, +6dB is a doubling of voltage.
Knock
good idea! I hoped for a hipass like this. applause
Stab Frenzy
Buttons ARE toys wrote:
flashheart wrote:
As was mentioned, by default there's no attenuation on either of the sum outputs of the Sum/diff, you can set this with jumpers.


Okay, so the /2 that LRMSMSLR is doing on the second stage is just the 6db gain reduction. I guess I don't really understand how dB measurements work, since I expected the math there to be (C+D)-(whatever 6dB translates to in voltage), rather than (C+D)/2.

Hi, the -6dB stage is actually in the first section rather than the second, there was an error in the first version of the manual that made it look like it was the other way round but it's fixed now. thumbs up
Lunartransit
Sorry if this is a dumb question, but is a cv adder the same thing as a precision adder? If not, could it be used as one if you put a quantizer after it?
tuj
Is the adder precise enough for pitch CV?
Bishop Dust
tuj wrote:
Is the adder precise enough for pitch CV?


Yes the sumdif uses 0,1% precision resistors to ensure the V/Oct tracking.

Modules are now ready / packaged we ll contact the retailers this week !
Buttons ARE toys
Bishop Dust wrote:
Modules are now ready / packaged we ll contact the retailers this week !


Can't wait! SlayerBadger!
imrae
[Double post, stupid fat fingers]
imrae
Have there been any updates on this? I'm holding a space for SumDif love
Bishop Dust
Dear wigglers !

The HiPass and the SumDif are finally out !

Contact your favorite dealer or grab it at our shop.

Here is a HiPass demo / tutorial ! The SumDif video will follow very soon this week smile

Footkerchief
Are the top outputs normaled to the bottom inputs?
Bishop Dust
Nope no normalisation !
Bishop Dust
We just finished the demo of the SumDif smile enjoy !

imrae
Are any UK dealers carrying these or should I order directly?
Bishop Dust
Still have to contact them - just curious what is you usual dealer ?
infradead
whoa.. that SumDif...

i'm in love love
imrae
Bishop Dust wrote:
Still have to contact them - just curious what is you usual dealer ?


Too new to this to have a "usual"; Elevator Sound, London Modular and matttech have all been lovely so far.
Tumulishroomaroom
Latest Mylar Melodies' podcast with Divkid reminded me about the HiPass; wonderful little module; packs a lot in 2hp ! Cleaning up the master stereo mix (can be put in the aux send loop of the Performance Mixer, perfect !) + 2 hi pass to clean samples or individual sounds or feedback paths, so my filters are free !

Ordered wink
Buttons ARE toys
I've had the SumDif racked up for about a week now and it's great! I'm using it mainly for M/S processing but it's finding its way into other patches as a basic utility.

And interesting behavior as a logic gate, I don't think the A-B out fits any of the typical logic types. It only puts out a positive gate if A is high and B is low.
Bishop Dust
Was surprised how using a phase inversion on one component of mix can change the mix sound. For example the plus and minus outputs give quite different results while summing two kicks coming from a peaks.
Noisepan
Where would these be available for people in Canada?
Bishop Dust
No retailer yet in canada -but we are have our own shop - drop us an email wink
Noisepan
Am I correct in assuming that mid side processing would remove any panning between the left and right, so the final signal would have identical left and right channels?

My understanding is that if the side is processed as 1 channel, when it is returned and split to the left and right again, it would be the same on both sides?
Paranormal Patroler
Noisepan wrote:
Am I correct in assuming that mid side processing would remove any panning between the left and right, so the final signal would have identical left and right channels?

My understanding is that if the side is processed as 1 channel, when it is returned and split to the left and right again, it would be the same on both sides?


No, I don't think that's the case. By definition Mid contains all that is common between LR, whereas Side contains all the info that is only available on each channel, but not on the other. Any processing happening on Side will be common to both LR but if I recall correctly you retain the stereo imaging that was available in LR in the beginning when you revert Side back to LR.
Dragonaut
Nice packaging!

(after battling with the picture upload function for a half an hour I'm giving up.)

Dead Banana

(my bad?)
Virusinstaller
I could really recommend the high pass for anyone playing live on big systems. It really made a nice difference to the sound quality coming out.
Cleaned the audio just nicely leaving room for boosting frequencies in the right location.
Nice work!
Todai
Question about HiPass routing...


So I just installed HiPass, namely to make space in the low end / remove rumble.

My routing presently is PM master out > MSCL (used as limiter) > buffered multiple. Buffered multiple splits to Vermona TwinOut (DI) and into bitbox for recording.

Noooow....where's the best place to patch HiPass in?

Before or after the limiter?
bago
I would place it before the Limiter/Compressor, otherwise the lowend rumble will still control a good part of the compression. But if you want a pumping sound (like in most Techno trax) you might get more drastic results by patching the Highpass after the Limiter/Compressor.
Paranormal Patroler
There's no right/wrong answer to this one. It really depends what you want to achieve. Google about the placement of compressor in relation to EQ and you'll find a lot of info on this subject.
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