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Brian Eno: Composers as Gardeners
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Author Brian Eno: Composers as Gardeners
Raytracer
Brian Eno: Composers as Gardeners
https://www.edge.org/conversation/brian_eno-composers-as-gardeners

I need more gardening.
tony d
Nice to read this. I think that's why so many of us are drawn into working in a modular environment. I remember struggling with these ideas a long time ago. When i became interested in music my mentors had instilled this idea on me that music was to be used for "saying something" and i thought i needed to have something to say to make music but it wasn't really until i got into modular synths that i realized that what i really enjoy is the uncontrollable and unexpected, i've also had plenty of experiences at this point with music to realize my input can only control so much of what comes out in the end.
Paranormal Patroler
That's a nice concept, especially when it comes to modular systems. You trim a bit there, you wiggle a bit here ...
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
Excellent! This talk of Eno's fits perfectly into another thread that is current here, on whether learning music theory will help or hinder creativity. It is currently discussing more or less exactly what Eno is talking about.
Bojmir Raj Raj
Very nice! Brian Eno is a really good thinker in my opinion.
Spivkurl
Very interesting to read!

As a long time Eno fan, as well as an avid gardener, I can relate very well to most of this article/speech.

I found this part very interesting and a little therapuetic -

"What we're not so used to is the idea that another great gift we have is the talent to surrender and to cooperate. Cooperation and surrender are actually parts of the same skill. To be able to surrender is to be able to know when to stop trying to control. And to know when to go with things, to be taken along by them. And that's a skill that we actually have to start relearning. Our hubris about our success in terms of being controllers has made us overlook that side of our abilities. So we're so used to dignifying controllers that we forget to dignify surrenderers. "

The whole concept which he is propounding here, and not just generative music in general, reminds me of my recent live cassette EP "Agonist Moon." My packet of seeds was the instruments I chose for each piece, as well as the ways in which I interfaced them. Nature, including myself, the listeners, weather, environment, external "noise" - they all did the rest.

I wish more of this massive generation were being influenced by artists such as Eno. There is much to be gained, and expanded upon!
Anechoic
Previous thread with Eno perspectives:

Brian Eno - interview on BBC HARDtalk




.
MindMachine
Bojmir Raj Raj wrote:
Very nice! Brian Eno is a really good thinker in my opinion.


He continues to blow my mind in many ways. I wish I could put my thoughts together as eloquently.

I was thinking of my sisters garden and Conrad Schnitzler as I read this.

Thank you OP!!!
amnesia
Surprised no one mentioned Curtis Roads
felixer
again: french gardens or english ones hihi eno is brittish so i guess he means an english (landscape) garden along the lines of lancelot 'capability' brown! also remember the technique of earthworks, making arificial hills and rivers (visit hyde park for an example of that!). in contrast american gardens are extremely boring/synthetic. no life left as it is all too neatly brought under control without the tension of a good formal french garden.
german gardens are pretty boring too. usually some cheap imitation of french gardens (sanssoussi in potsdam) or overtly romantic with some fake ruin.
and then you have chinese/japanese gardens as well. whole different game!
so what does he mean exactly? he could have said improvisation but that would have meant other things as well ...
Muzone
felixer wrote:
again: french gardens or english ones hihi eno is brittish so i guess he means an english (landscape) garden along the lines of lancelot 'capability' brown! .


".....Versailles, which is, to me, the most grotesque of all gardens, since it's the total denial of nature and the complete expression of human control over nature. "

I'm guessing not a formal garden, of any nationality wink
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch
I hate gardening, but I like other peoples' gardens.
felixer
Muzone wrote:
felixer wrote:
again: french gardens or english ones hihi eno is brittish so i guess he means an english (landscape) garden along the lines of lancelot 'capability' brown! .


".....Versailles, which is, to me, the most grotesque of all gardens, since it's the total denial of nature and the complete expression of human control over nature. "

I'm guessing not a formal garden, of any nationality wink

prob not cool but then any act of gardening will bring that closer. my garden is a compromise. a part is kept by my mother who likes flowers and things that are neat. and a part is kept wild. anything may grow there and i only cut down trees that have been a victim to storms. or die of old age. i also put in a winterhome for the hedgehog who lives there. recently we had some trouble with raccoons. they are a pest here. we cought two with a trap and i was ready to shoot 'm. but my mother argued that it isn't their fault that they are here: people brought them here in the 20ies (from america for fur) and of course some escaped. the thing is that they mulitply so fast (up to 20 young per female per year). and they hardly have any natural enemies. now we are getting more wolves hopefully that should take care of itself. so we took 'm to a forest a few miles away and let 'm go.
but gardening is fun. it also is a good balance to intellectual work. getting your hands in the soil and all that ... i should do more ... and i will now that my seeds have come up smokin'
widdly
amnesia wrote:
Surprised no one mentioned Curtis Roads


The first thing I thought of too.
dubonaire
felixer wrote:
Muzone wrote:
felixer wrote:
again: french gardens or english ones hihi eno is brittish so i guess he means an english (landscape) garden along the lines of lancelot 'capability' brown! .


".....Versailles, which is, to me, the most grotesque of all gardens, since it's the total denial of nature and the complete expression of human control over nature. "

I'm guessing not a formal garden, of any nationality wink

prob not cool but then any act of gardening will bring that closer. my garden is a compromise. a part is kept by my mother who likes flowers and things that are neat. and a part is kept wild. anything may grow there and i only cut down trees that have been a victim to storms. or die of old age. i also put in a winterhome for the hedgehog who lives there. recently we had some trouble with raccoons. they are a pest here. we cought two with a trap and i was ready to shoot 'm. but my mother argued that it isn't their fault that they are here: people brought them here in the 20ies (from america for fur) and of course some escaped. the thing is that they mulitply so fast (up to 20 young per female per year). and they hardly have any natural enemies. now we are getting more wolves hopefully that should take care of itself. so we took 'm to a forest a few miles away and let 'm go.
but gardening is fun. it also is a good balance to intellectual work. getting your hands in the soil and all that ... i should do more ... and i will now that my seeds have come up smokin'


I envy you, I live in an almost nature-less city. It's a total concrete jungle, which I also like for other reasons. Any idea why you are getting more wolves? maybe it is the raccoons.
dubonaire
It's an interesting article. I don't think much benefit is gained from trying to deconstruct what gardening is to challenge the metaphor. I'm not a very good gardener, maybe that's why I'm not a great musician. I feel I need some architecture to get to an outcome otherwise I just endlessly loop into a mess. Maybe accomplished musicians with many years of experience already work to an architectural plan without even realising it.
Paranormal Patroler
dubonaire wrote:
It's an interesting article. I don't think much benefit is gained from trying to deconstruct what gardening is to challenge the metaphor. I'm not a very good gardener, maybe that's why I'm not a great musician. I feel I need some architecture to get to an outcome otherwise I just endlessly loop into a mess. Maybe accomplished musicians with many years of experience already work to an architectural plan without even realising it.


It's not a black and white state, you can find the balance between architecture and gardening that fits your needs. Even more with modular!
felixer
dubonaire wrote:
Any idea why you are getting more wolves? maybe it is the raccoons.

well, they have space. lots of old military testinggrounds out here. some are completely inaccecable for humans as there is still a lot of old ammunition in the ground. nobody dares go there so the animals are left in peace and quiet. that seems to be the main thing. they come from the east and are slowly spreading. and they are a protected species, which doesn't prevent hunters and farmers to try and kill 'm as much as they can, but that is illegal so there is no big hunt.
thevegasnerve
Dr. Sketch-n-Etch wrote:
I hate gardening, but I like other peoples' gardens.


I dont like designing or building modules, but I like playing other peoples' modules.. I do like gardening though...
tesserack
Eno speaks more eloquently through his music. I think he's over thinking a little bit here because in my opinion Architects our gardeners.
Paranormal Patroler
tesserack wrote:
Eno speaks more eloquently through his music. I think he's over thinking a little bit here because in my opinion Architects our gardeners.


I heartily disagree! Architects need to create functional designs for living beings, whereas gardeners work with living beings. I appreciate both fields, but plants are a thing you need to care for, it's not a one-off build, it grows and grows.

It's also worth pointing out that failing in gardening does not usually end up with people in rumbles. I get the poetics of the parallelism but I honestly thing they are two very distinct ways of looking at things, both with their own beauty and modi operandi.
felixer
architects (or most of 'm) are the enemies/antithesis to gardening.
and badly designed gardens can be dangerous, giving ample shelter for muggers etc.
coffeeshopped
Great read, thanks for sharing! Also reminds me of Jane Jacobs' "The Death and Life of Great American Cities", which offers a sort of bottom-up perspective on how cities grow/evolve as opposed to the previously traditional top-down perspective of planners. https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/The_Death_and_Life_of_Great_American_Cit ies

Seems the most interesting things are often the ones that evolve out of simpler pieces, to go beyond what any master planner could envision.
dubonaire
Paranormal Patroler wrote:
dubonaire wrote:
It's an interesting article. I don't think much benefit is gained from trying to deconstruct what gardening is to challenge the metaphor. I'm not a very good gardener, maybe that's why I'm not a great musician. I feel I need some architecture to get to an outcome otherwise I just endlessly loop into a mess. Maybe accomplished musicians with many years of experience already work to an architectural plan without even realising it.


It's not a black and white state, you can find the balance between architecture and gardening that fits your needs. Even more with modular!


I guess that's where landscape architects come in.
gimber
dubonaire wrote:

I guess that's where landscape architects come in.


applause it's true, landscape architecture accepts the general idea of what Eno is talking about as standard practice. Not coincidentally Jane Jacobs is required reading in most landscape architecture programs.
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