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WIGGLING 'LITE' IN GUEST MODE

Just one more format...
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Modular Synth General Discussion  
Author Just one more format...
southphillysynths
Wanted to get some views and opinions of people with multiple format systems in their studios.

I have whats becoming a pretty large euro system and I'm very happy with what it does and how it sounds etc.

I still cant shake the feeling of lusting after another format or one large stand alone instrument. Things like MU, DIY buchla or serge, a TTSH, Wiard 300 are what I'm always thinking about 'thats what I want when I grow up'

Buchla being one of those things that everyone sort of dreams of I guess. Serge being my second favorite synths just for the look and sound. I love the 2600 and could eventually save for a TTSH or try and build one. I have always loved the look, sound, and esoterica of the Wiard 300 format. A friend has a VERY nice synthesizer.com system that sounds great and looks fantastic when I see him perform.

This is to say that I dont even mean to interface my euro with any other format I just always think that I would love to have X modular or stand alone synth as a separate instrument and ecosystem for exploring.

I totally understand that each format has its own way that you interact with it that will lead to different types of patches and sounds but I'm thinking purely from a analytical standpoint of that has oscillators and filters too just like my euro. I know that everything sounds different but wouldn't want redundancy, if I can do that type of patch on my euro system I'm happy with that even if its not EXACTLY the same sound of feel.

ANYWAY what do y'all think about having one more format or stand alone synth to accompany your main system even if there is redundancy and overlap of features?


EDIT: In doing a good amount of thinking 5U is probably the one other format I might consider. I would love to supplement 6 Rob Hordijk modules with some .COM utilities...
ritchiedrums
I am in 4 formats.
Right now I am not enjoying mixing bananas with anything else...
Parnelli
ritchiedrums wrote:
I am in 4 formats.
Right now I am not enjoying mixing bananas with anything else...


Good, because you should never stick your banana in a hole not made for bananas... Dead Banana
diophantine
I have 4+ formats right now. I've tried to choose them and build them so that they suit different needs, styles, inspirations, etc.

My Dotcom system was my first, and is my all-around analog work-horse. Lots of choices in VCOs, VCFs, modulators, etc.

When I built my Steiner-Parker Synthasystem I wanted something more streamlined, where I didn't have to think about which VCO or VCF to use. I just patch it up!

With the Serge I really just wanted something different. I love the different way I interact with it, and the different sort of sounds I find that I produce with it.

The Frac is the newest system, which started only because I wanted a couple of Miniwaves! I'm trying to grow it to be more focused around those and some random-ish things, including a Klee.

Also have a Hordijk system, which is technically 5U, but I don't use it with my Dotcom system - again, different workflow/approach/etc. And I have a Buchla 208, and a TTSH + 1601, but personally I don't find myself using those as often - not entirely sure if it is because other things are more flexible and/or have similar features, because of where they're set up in the studio, or what.

Anyhow, if you do decide to go with a second format, I suggest that you come up with a basic plan of what you want it to be, and how it will provide something different from your Eurorack system (whether that be sound, or approach, or ...?). Seems like you're already going down that mental path, but I feel it has been helpful for me.
diophantine
Parnelli wrote:
ritchiedrums wrote:
I am in 4 formats.
Right now I am not enjoying mixing bananas with anything else...


Good, because you should never stick your banana in a hole not made for bananas... Dead Banana

southphillysynths
hihi meh


(sorry about your luck ritchie Hug)
thanks guys...

any other thoughts?
calaveras
I've been interested in Richter Wiard or Blacet system for a while.
There are a few things from those systems that show up in Euro, more or less. But as you say, there is something about a modular system.
Eurorack for all of it's popularity sometimes does not seem to interoperate as smoothly as a dotcom or whathaveyou.

The Wiard stuff is especially interesting, as most of the modules combine not just one but several complementary functions per each.

There is also an impression I have of the 5u stuff in general that it seems to have a more solid sound? But maybe that is because most of the guys I know have a ton of triangle core oscs and ladder filters.
PatchMonger
I have a 5U MOTM system and a Eurorack system. Both have their own space in the studio and they both work together REALLY WELL. Like I find that modulation and effects are ace in Eurorack but for more "bread and butter" sounds, the 5U sounds hughe.
They are not that different and you only need adapter cables to have them all talking with each other. I toyed with the ideaa of building a small Serge (random source) but the banana to jack/minijack freaks me out a bit so not done it. I will probably get Serge in Eurorack (a bit of cheating)
My opinion about the 5U sounding more solid sound is probably because people do not mix manufacturers as much as in Euro so you end up with VCO-VCF-ADSR-VCA all from the same manufacturer and I think that makes a different. Probably the same applies to Serge and Buchla but I don't really know....
So much to explore....
calaveras
I'm thinking like a live and recording audio engineer here, so here goes.

One of the things that I think is going on, and I think this is a problem with Eurorack. Is that in 5U, people do tend to stick to one brand generally, so the headroom in filters, mixers and VCAs is known in advance. They build their OSCs and downstream devices to work well at a certain level and impedance. If they do exceed headroom, it's an intentional Moog CP3 kind of thing.

On the Euro side we have all different kinds of brands that are putting out varying levels. Their stuff probably works pretty great with other models from the same house, but may overdrive other peoples stuff, or be overdriven by other brands.

This, and it seems that in the haste to fit the most, skinniest modules into the densest, smallest cases, nobody wants to buy any attenuators.
southphillysynths
calaveras wrote:
I'm thinking like a live and recording audio engineer here, so here goes.

One of the things that I think is going on, and I think this is a problem with Eurorack. Is that in 5U, people do tend to stick to one brand generally, so the headroom in filters, mixers and VCAs is known in advance. They build their OSCs and downstream devices to work well at a certain level and impedance. If they do exceed headroom, it's an intentional Moog CP3 kind of thing.

On the Euro side we have all different kinds of brands that are putting out varying levels. Their stuff probably works pretty great with other models from the same house, but may overdrive other peoples stuff, or be overdriven by other brands.

This, and it seems that in the haste to fit the most, skinniest modules into the densest, smallest cases, nobody wants to buy any attenuators.


I agree there is surely some of this going on. This is true that the 5U system a friend has is mostly .COM so that is surely the case.

I will say that most of my signal chain in euro is doepfer with another filter thrown in here or there. I would think that all doepfer stuff is pretty in line though as far as headroom from module to module...
wechard
My system is pretty small, but it mixes Kilpatrick banana stuff (Phenol, and one of his enclosures) with euro (one row for now, and a Microbrute). Once I got the grounding sorted out, and bought a few of the right cables, it all works together just fine and I don't really think about which format is which.
Jamnuska
Growing Euro and pretty smallish 5U. I choose the modules based on the sound I am looking for (or the cheaper price, sometimes it is 5U, other times it is Euro).
Once you get cables to work between the formats it is pretty easy.
Dave Peck
I'm curious - if someone here told you "no, don't do it, you won't like it" would that really do anything at all to dissuade you from going ahead and doing it? This is fun!
luchog
Just getting started, so it's just Euro for now. Well, that's not strictly true, it's Euro and LittleBits Korg, but the LBK stuff is more my SO's (though it will integrate with my Euro).

Looking at picking up the 73-75 Serge clones when they're released; and the Catalyst Audio Buchla 100 clones when they come out.

Aside from an odd DIY project which will be entirely standalone, I don't really have any desire to get into any other formats.
southphillysynths
Dave Peck wrote:
I'm curious - if someone here told you "no, don't do it, you won't like it" would that really do anything at all to dissuade you from going ahead and doing it? This is fun!


absolutely! That's why I ask here first!! A few words from someone could stop me from spending hours comparing specs and buying a $200 power supply that will start me building a $5000 system!!

I agree about the headroom thing. But I also use a good amount of doepfer stuff for most of my sounds so I don't think I'm missing out on losing signal between manufacturers all that much.

Lately I've been continuing with eurorack but have really fallen for the Rob Hordijk stuff. I understand he is doing groups of 3 modules at a time as little panels in his system. I would love to start a small 5U system to eventually have a few of his panels.

that being said there has been a good amount of rumblings in euro regarding his designs. A DIY benjolin, the Klangbau twin peak filters etc. Given the amount of time it would take me to save for two panels of his modules (3 years? I don't even know how long it would take) There might be enough of his stuff to satisfy me in euro...
pugix
I have MOTM 5U, Bugbrand and other banana modules, Eurorack, and also Ciat-Lonbarde that needs alligator clips.

Most of the time I patch within a format, but I made adapter cables that can connect anything to anything. I would never consider a 'format jumbler' box, because when I patch across systems I might use 10 or 20 patch cords. I have plenty of attenuators and offsettors to match levels.

It can be done. w00t
southphillysynths
pugix


thanks for the reply!
I'm thinking 5U might be the other format... I would love to have a few Hordijk modules supplemented with some .COM and DIY...
SmokyClap
I’ve always found that euro has a typical, “smaller” sound than the larger formats. It’s what kept me away from euro for a while in the beginning.
ersatzplanet
I have a bunch of different "formats" of synthesizers but not all of them are formats in the sense that you are talking about, but they all serve the same purpose of being different environments that different things happen.

For me they are not defined by the side or shape of the modules or the connectors use but where on the scale they sit between full-on modular and full on computer. For me the scale is something like this:

Full on modular Eurorack (over 1000HP)>Nord G2>Nord Modular>Axoloti>Midi synths>Max for Cats Virtual Modular>Reason>VSTi in Live.

In that spectrum I can go all the way from totally physical (with no patch memory or presets), through some Physical with some virtual in the Nords, to mostly virtual with limited physical with controllers, to all in the computer. They are very different worlds and very different headspace and inspire in very different ways. I'm sure many on this list have more than one "instrument" on that spectrum too. Now that my modular has a bunch of WAV players/modifiers in it, the flow can go both ways better than ever before. I just got the Reason10 upgrade and will be making some killer timbers in the Grains module that will end up being played a lot by the Nebulae and ADDAC101 in my modular for instance. To me it is just like having a bunch of different setups.
NewAndImprov
I have a fairly extensive 5U setup, mostly MOTM with some Oakley, Encore and homebrew modules, 6U of Blacet and Wiard Frac, and a small but growing Euro system. I bought about a dozen 1/8" to 1/4" cables of various lengths recently, and that's been all I need to patch between systems.

For conventional subtractive synthesis, the 5U does everything I need, so I've been focussing on more esoteric (at least to me) modules in Euro. Lately, I am really enjoying sequencing the MOTM from the Varigate 8/Voltage Block combo, which is such a ridiculously versatile sequencing combo!
RadioTelefonik
I've got a Euro system that I'm downsizing into just a small Sputnik system and a smaller case centered around the Benjolin. I've got a single-row Tangible Waves AE system, and that -can- work nicely with Euro, but I don't generally connect the two. I'm not so big on the AE, though. It sounds nice enough, I suppose, but the fiddly little cables come apart too easily. Might sell it. I also recently got a 5U case on the cheap, so I've got some dotcom stuff coming in, and a Hordijk panel on order (it'll be a number of months before Rob can get around to it, but him taking my order prompted the case purchase), which I'm going to stuff with more esoteric jank, but also some trigger sequencers to run some drum brains I've got. Of course, the dream is to have as many formats as I can, but that's not in the budget... Maybe someone can build me a Buchla 100 system some day...
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