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Maths - fashion or useful?
MUFF WIGGLER Forum Index -> Eurorack Modules Goto page 1, 2, 3, 4, 5  Next [all]
Author Maths - fashion or useful?
Martinorman
I have seen plenty of people recommending Maths. But is this because it's fashion, or is it really that useful?
lud
Maths the module or the science?!
Martinorman
LOL. I guess science Maths has gone out of fashion!
lisa
It is really useful. Check a few of the videos on Youtube or the manual and you will soon see that the uses for MN Maths are many.

lud wrote:
Maths the module or the science?!

hihi
A21.12.12
Well, on the surface it's not the most sexy module ever. It's not a sick sounding VCO or a granular synthesizer or what not. Just some voltage modulation. But with some patience and practice it's so ridiculously deep, and maybe even essential. I agree with lisa, check the YouTube videos.

There's a reason everyone is always talking about it.
folpon
When I first got into modular I bought Maths because it was universally recommended. I didn't really understand what to use it for other than generating LFOs.

One day a friend came over with his system and I saw him use Maths to perform complex behaviors I didn't understand. As he patiently explained the EOR, EOC, and channel attenuverters to me I felt a lightbulb switch on in my mind. I think that was the moment I understood why modular synthesis was interesting and not just an expensive distraction from writing songs.

Now I'm looking at my rack and asking myself, "Is there a single module here which isn't made a lot more useful by having Maths?" and the answer is no.

Summary: I think some things become fashionable because they're just really, really good.
moremagic
if you dont have maths in your rack, you should have a reason
otherwise yeah you probably need it
Parnelli
Maths is an analog computer capable of nearly an infinite series of voltage calculations to influence any voltage throughput, be it CV, gates, envelopes, triggers, etc.

So yeah, it's fairly essential, though it might take me a lifetime to learn how to use it fully. thumbs up
BaloErets
I get where you are coming from, being that we are living in a world where everything is so hyped and marketed that sometimes things are regarding as must-have's because of marketing hyperbole rather than them being so great.

With that said, I don't think the eurorack format suffers from this kind of BS... except maybe some of the TipTop product videos. Maths is a brilliant module. Slope and Function generators have been around for a very long time, much longer than the Make Noise company has been around, and it's popularity is more of a great design that has surpassed the test of time.
Superfuzzyfrog
Maths ends up in every patch I do and I am only scratching a little below the surface of its functionality. It also has stopped me from buying certain modules (when does that ever happen). When researching new modules I now like to make sure maths can't do it first. It is a great tool to have in your toolbox.
bobbcorr
...and right after Maths, add a Cold Mac, and suddenly a thousand flowers bloom and all is illuminated.
anotherjones
Hi, I guess this thread is as good as any to ask: Is Function essentially half of Maths? Having read a few threads on Maths, watched demos etc, I understand it can do things other single function generators can't, but not many simultaneously.

I'm in research / planning stage but have had a Nord G2 for 7 years, so understand the concepts of logic modules etc.

Anyways, in the way of modulation / fumction / logic I'm leaning towards Function + Erica dual EG / LFO + Disting + Doepfer A -136-2 Precision Adder

This is for 2 Oscs, Noise + Topobrillo Wavefolder, + FM Aid + Ring Mod - Octatrack for sequencing and a couple of extra LFOs).

Maybe I'm missing somethng and Maths would offer more options in combo with one or two of the above?

WMD Toolbox also packs a load of utility in a small space, but a lot of its functions are available from the other modules above.

I'm not looking towards making self-generating patches, but plenty of options for transposing, clk divinding sequences, mixing CVs and gate's, inverting etc, and of course for sound shaping

I guess I should try and replicate Maths and more complex function modules with G2 logic, level and switch modules to get an idea, but I reckon it's be a time consuming endevour and I'd miss nuances!

Any suggestions, comments thoughts would be very welcome.

Here's my current dream plan
https://www.modulargrid.net/e/racks/view/500745
Nino


many things in common: yes
half maths: not at all
Parnelli
Half Maths? That would be like buying an airline ticket for LA in NY and getting off in Chicago.... Dead Banana
anotherjones
Nino wrote:


many things in common: yes
half maths: not at all


So if you were forced to replace Maths with Function, which functions capabilities would you miss?
anotherjones
Parnelli wrote:
Half Maths? That would be like buying an airline ticket for LA in NY and getting off in Chicago.... Dead Banana


Far better music has come out of Chicago than LA without a doubt!
facklr
Parnelli wrote:
Half Maths? That would be like buying an airline ticket for LA in NY and getting off in Chicago.... Dead Banana


Hey watch it there, Utah. The Midwest is cooler than you think. WAY cooler than UTAH! hihi
mateo
Extremely useful: it packs in a ton of functionality without needing any menu diving. Take a look at the patch ideas section of the manual http://www.makenoisemusic.com/content/manuals/MATHSmanual2013.pdf

It's the only module I own that I would never part with.
Parnelli
Quote:
So if you were forced to replace Maths with Function, which functions capabilities would you miss?


Well as I am still learning about it I'm sure my answer(s) will fall woefully short of what I'd really be lacking, but I'll try:

1. The ability to mix 4 separate CV inputs, invert, sum, and "or" them.

2. One ASDR, LFO, VCA, Envelope Generator, Trigger Generator, and Gate.

3. The ability to offset CV by plus or minus 5 volts.

4. The ability to offset CV by plus or minus 10 volts.

5. The ability to cross modulate/gate/trigger channel 1 with channel 4 and
vice versa.

That's off the top of my head here at work.

Quote:
Far better music has come out of Chicago than LA without a doubt!


You'll get no argument from me on that!

Quote:

Hey watch it there, Utah. The Midwest is cooler than you think. WAY cooler than UTAH


Depends on what you're into I guess. I know a little about the midwest, as I'm from Michigan, went to boot camp and school at Great Lakes IL, and have done oil and gas exploration all over the US back in the day. I worked out here in the 70's and wanted to retire out here, so here I am. I was never into cowboy and indian movies, but every day I wake up and drive to work in John Wayne territory, where the sky is blue and the dirt is red, the men are men, and the sheep are scared. hihi

I do love it our here. No noise ('cept for coyotes and other critters), no traffic (rush hour means both cars from my area are on the road at the same time), minimal pollution, clean air, and the best drinking water I have ever had in my life anywhere.

Now if I could just get those damned capacitive touch pads to work on the modules that have them!
anotherjones
Thanks for the replies

Parnelli wrote:
Quote:
So if you were forced to replace Maths with Function, which functions capabilities would you miss?


Well as I am still learning about it I'm sure my answer(s) will fall woefully short of what I'd really be lacking, but I'll try:

1. The ability to mix 4 separate CV inputs, invert, sum, and "or" them.

2. One ASDR, LFO, VCA, Envelope Generator, Trigger Generator, and Gate.

3. The ability to offset CV by plus or minus 5 volts.

4. The ability to offset CV by plus or minus 10 volts.

5. The ability to cross modulate/gate/trigger channel 1 with channel 4 and
vice versa.

That's off the top of my head here at work.

But how many of those functions can you use simultaneously? I'm looking into SIMULTANEOUS fumctions available from Function and another (or) two function / utility modules, as an alternative to Maths.
FrogStar
I don't think we'd have seen the modern modular/euro revival without Maths. It really unlocks the potential of th format.
Dancing_Bananas
anotherjones wrote:
Nino wrote:


many things in common: yes
half maths: not at all


So if you were forced to replace Maths with Function, which functions capabilities would you miss?


I use the cycle input a lot, usually while also sending something unrelated to trig in. Very nice, since it does nothing if it's already running and starts it if it's not.

The attenuverters are also a huge part of how I play my modular live and unless all your modules have attenuation on the input, I don't think you can have too many of those. Same goes for the mixer.

Hang input on the function looks great though, would love to have that one on Maths.
anotherjones
Parnelli wrote:
I do love it our here. No noise ('cept for coyotes and other critters), no traffic (rush hour means both cars from my area are on the road at the same time), minimal pollution,


Maybe you forget to mention the noises emanating from your modular!
anotherjones
Dancing_Bananas wrote:
I use the cycle input a lot, usually while also sending something unrelated to trig in. Very nice, since it does nothing if it's already running and starts it if it's not.

The attenuverters are also a huge part of how I play my modular live and unless all your modules have attenuation on the input, I don't think you can have too many of those. Same goes for the mixer.

Hang input on the function looks great though, would love to have that one on Maths.


Thanks, very useful insight for me. The Doepfer A 136 looks the ticket for CV mixing and attenuation.

The love of Maths here is clear! So for a 2 voice rig (X2 Osc x1 noise, Tippobrillo TWF, ring mod, 1 Filter, Optomix, Quad VCA ), what would you choose as companion modulator, function generator?
DMR
Really the only thing the function lacks relative to Maths is the trigger input for cycle. You gain the hang input, and a gate on both end of rise and end of cycle, rather than only one or other on the two channels of maths. You could recreate Maths with 2 functions, an attenuverting mixer (like Mutable Instruments Shades, though it is only 3 channel rather than 4), and analog max (aka "or") and inversion utilities (like on Mutable Instruments Kinks).
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